Kain (SPOILERS)

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10-25-2004, 07:09 PM
Flashback007

Kain (SPOILERS)

Ok, so we all know Kain, the turncoat in FFIV. But we know he turned towards Golbez cause Golbez had him in his power. But why did he turn and not Cecil. Was Cecil's heart stronger or maybe was it a little bit hate that Kain had toward Cecil cause Cecil had the girl (Rosa) and the job (Dark Knight and later Paladin). Afcourse Cecil makes the story he must be the lead character. But Kain is also a strong character in the game. Especially when he attacks Cecil at a moment, at that moment, you really know that Kain is magical possesed. By Golbez. But the spell is broken. Kain joins your party, but then suddenly Kain turns against Cecil again. But why this time? Is he still jaleous?? Or maybe the spell never trully was gone, but he just infiltrated. It is to bad, that Kain turns out that way, cause else he would be the best character of IV. Now it is Cecil for me. But Kain is still the best dragoon in the FF-series for my opinion. Again like the Vivi-topic this is a topic to put all the things about Kain into a row. The opinions about Kain also and other things about him. So please post.
10-25-2004, 08:59 PM
Anarchys_Prize

I agree that Kain is one of the strongest characters in FFIV but, its just as likely the reason why he was under Golblez's (I think I spelt that right) power instead of Cecil, cause Cecil is Golblez's brother. Since they come from the same father, same blood line, and share equal amounts of their powers, just use them differently, it would theoritically be possible that the reason why Cecil couldn't be controlled by Golblez i sthe fact that their powers cancel each others out. That is in terms of who can control whom!... I dunno just a thought.
10-25-2004, 11:34 PM
theundeadhero

As far as why Kain fell under the spell again, that's just when Golbez decided to gain control again. Nothing changed in him to make him resistant to the power. Golbez just waited for the right strategical moment.
10-26-2004, 12:14 AM
Kawaii Ryûkishi

Cain was able to be manipulated because he had a weak constitution overwhelmed by suppressed envy of Cecil.
10-26-2004, 08:59 AM
Big D

Yeah, Kain's relationships with Cecil, Rosa and the King made him pretty vulnerable to being manipulated against them. Cecil's his best friend, but he's engaged to Kain's ex-girlfriend Rosa, who Kain still cares for deeply, as a friend. The King wanted Kain to become a Dark Knight; instead, he followed in his father's footsteps as a Dragoon.

So basically, he had a lot of reasons for feeling like a bit of a put-upon underdog. Golbez was able to exploit that vulnerability.
10-27-2004, 08:00 AM
Storm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kawaii Ryûkishi

Cain was able to be manipulated because he had a weak constitution overwhelmed by suppressed envy of Cecil.

I couldn't agree more.
10-27-2004, 09:28 AM
Takara

Wait! What do you mean "would be the best character of IV"? You mean he isn't? :eek:

Yeah, anyway, what Kishi and Big D said. Kain's my favourite character in the series.
10-27-2004, 12:02 PM
Flashback007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takara

Wait! What do you mean "would be the best character of IV"? You mean he isn't? :eek:

Yeah, I just hate it that he always turns to "darkside" when you just have leveled him up good and when sometimes in some battles you really need him. If that wouldn't happen, he was the coolest, but now Cecil is for me.
10-30-2004, 04:16 AM
Del Murder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big D

Yeah, Kain's relationships with Cecil, Rosa and the King made him pretty vulnerable to being manipulated against them. Cecil's his best friend, but he's engaged to Kain's ex-girlfriend Rosa, who Kain still cares for deeply, as a friend. The King wanted Kain to become a Dark Knight; instead, he followed in his father's footsteps as a Dragoon.

What part of the game is this all stated? Is it something that wasn't translated right? I don't ever remember Kain being mentioned with Rosa or the king, at least not anything specific.
10-30-2004, 05:19 AM
Kawaii Ryûkishi

Cain talks about how he chose to become a Dragon Knight instead of a Dark Knight before you leave Baron at the beginning of the game. His relationship with Rosa, though, is only fully explained in an official supplementary book to FFIV; I can't remember the title offhand.
10-30-2004, 06:23 AM
theundeadhero

Somebody please mention the title and I will spend lots of money to buy it and tell you all about it. Maybe around a campfire, with hotdogs and stuff. I know it was mentioned in a thread here 3 years ago, but that doesn't help very much.
10-30-2004, 08:36 AM
Roogle

That book would be in Japanese, so it wouldn't be that much use unless you could read in Japanese...
10-30-2004, 09:40 AM
Flashback007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Delete

What part of the game is this all stated? Is it something that wasn't translated right? I don't ever remember Kain being mentioned with Rosa or the king, at least not anything specific.

This isn't stated in the game itself I believe. Or maybe in the begining, but in the gameguide you get with FFIV, it is. He said he followed his father and I also remember something from he had a thing with Rosa.
10-30-2004, 03:04 PM
theundeadhero

I know it's in Japanese, no problem. It'll be a slow a grueling task translating page by page. Much like what I'm doing with xenogears perfect works right now.
10-31-2004, 01:01 PM
Saint_007

I'll go with "supressed envy towards Cecil". Love of a woman was what caused Troy to fall, after all :D

You know, Kain is just awesome. I had only one problem with him and Golbez:

Quote:

Golbex: Uhm, so after all this mess, we'd like to say we're sorry about the crystals thing. And kidnapping Rosa. And the thing with the King. Oh, and sorry about that thing with me trying to double-cross you after you brought me the Earth crystal...

Kain: Will you ever forgive us Cecil?

Me: ... :mad:

Rosa: It wasn't their fault! I forgive them!!

All: Yay!!

How I would have liked to end this:

Quote:

Me/Cecil: Aw, hell, that's history now! Ya know, forgive and forget...

Golbez & Kain: Really?!

Me/Cecil: BTW, can you help me with something?

Kain: Just name it, best buddy!!

Me/Cecil: Well, it's just... *grabs both Kain and Golbez's throats in a vice grip*

Golbez: Uhm, Wow, nice grip, bro'...

Kain: Cecil... what about *gurk*

Me/Cecil: How about helping me with my ANGER MANAGEMENT?!

*Thirteen minutes later*

Me/Cecil: There, now, wasn't that better? I know I feel relieved...

Rosa: CECIL!? HOW COULD YOU?!

*Scene pans to a broken Kain and Golbez*

Me/Cecil: Well, like I said, forgive and forget. Now if you'll forgive my temper outburst, and Oliver and Stanley over here forget about their intense pain and get back to work, we can go back to kicking Zemus' sorry ass...

Golbez: Ow... he always like this?

Kain: I can remember a time some guy called him "shorty". 10 minutes later, Cecil was the taller one. By the way, can you remove your hand from my liver?

Golbez: I would, except that it's been broken in three places and dislocated at the elbow. And the fact that your buddy just wielded your knee to my elbow isn't helping...

:D :D :D
11-17-2004, 09:52 PM
Odaisé Gaelach

If I remember correctly, Kain only comes under Globez's influence when Cecil is a Paladin. Because he's from the white side and Globez is from the dark side, maybe he can't posess someone so good.

And who does he posess instead? The dragoon Kain.
11-17-2004, 10:43 PM
Kawaii Ryûkishi

Except Cain is under Golbeza's control long, long before Cecil ever becomes a Paladin.
11-18-2004, 08:49 AM
Flashback007

Quote:

Originally Posted by OdaiseGaelach

If I remember correctly, Kain only comes under Globez's influence when Cecil is a Paladin. Because he's from the white side and Globez is from the dark side, maybe he can't posess someone so good.

And who does he posess instead? The dragoon Kain.

From the white side and the dark side, hmmm, that sounds intrestting:

Golbez: "FuSoYa, never told what happened to your brother"
Cecil "Yeah, he told me enough. He told me you killed him"
Golbez: "No, I am your brother"
Cecil: "NOOOOOOOOOOO"

:D :D

Ok, that is a bit overreacting, but Kawaii is right. Kain becomes under influence when he gets seperated after the attack on the Mist Village.
12-11-2004, 03:24 PM
Saint_007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flashback007

From the white side and the dark side, hmmm, that sounds intrestting:

Golbez: "FuSoYa, never told what happened to your brother"
Cecil "Yeah, he told me enough. He told me you killed him"
Golbez: "No, I am your brother"
Cecil: "NOOOOOOOOOOO"

ROFLMAO. Does it also involve Golbez cutting off Cecil's arm? Or Golbez tossing Zemus over a balcony? :D :D

Quote:

Ok, that is a bit overreacting, but Kawaii is right. Kain becomes under influence when he gets seperated after the attack on the Mist Village.

Actually, I thought that Golbez's agents grabbed Kain after that attack and then mind-washed him when he got separated from Cecil.
12-11-2004, 05:28 PM
Takara

Quote:

Actually, I thought that Golbez's agents grabbed Kain after that attack and then mind-washed him when he got separated from Cecil.

I don't think it's ever stated when exactly Kain came under Golbez' control, but it's obvious it's between the events in Mist and Fabul.