The world is in a weird place..

before I go on, whats the name of the world..? Like ffx is spira, whats ff7? I cant remember..

Anyways, people at square weren't thinking right when they made the world, or maybe they thought no one would notice.

As you fly on your airship, you get the impression the world is round since mountains and things "rise" near you [round world]. But the maps is square.. so latitudes and longitudes would be messed up and therefore on the map, some areas would look bigger than they actually are - but they aren't - or cloud would have to gain a speed boost which is not obvious [flat world]. You keep going forward, you wind up in the bottom of the map [round world - But if on EARTH, you go towards the north pole, you will arrive at Russia - So on the FFVII map, you would have to arrive on the TOP, in the opposite DIRECTION, either on the Eastern or Western continent depending where you went up]. At cosmo canyon, the world is round [round world]. BUT, this is what made me think about this..

[important:]
When meteor is summoned, and its still coming down (thats where I am at the game anyways).. if you take your airship and fly towards the huge circle, the meteor, you wind up at the bottom of the map. But the meteor never changes, it always stays at the same place.
Thus meaning the world isn't round since the meteor stays in the same place when flying towards it and even when you wind up at the opposite direction of the map. For the world to be round in this situation, the meteor would have to go away and be on top of you at some time and appear again as you keep going in that same direction. Or the meteor would have to go around the world (when you are moving) while still coming to the earth.. meaning it would somehow have to accelerate on and off to a different direction (not possible because of Newton's first law of motion:objects in motion stay in motion at a constant speed and direction unless acted upon an outside force).

SOOOOOO therefore I conclude, FFVII's world is NOT round, NOT FLAT, but messed up because of people working at square. People had the idea that the world is round (cosmo canyon fmv sequence, telescope) since the world has round world properties (arrive at opposite ends BUT STILL NOT RIGHT-refer to italics), and they have not been exposed to real round worlds where things CAN BE in front of you and then as you go forward, on top of you and then behind you (referring to meteor). <--So this means that the world is round. Square messed up not only because of longitude/latitude/meteor, but also, shouldnt their be 2 poles..? If there is one ice cap, there should be another one because of the sun and such and when you are at the south end, it appears to be hot (desert type terrain on southern most island) and yet a short distance down (arriving on the northern part of the map) is freezing weather that kills you. This would meant that the world is flat with round world properties. But this wouldnt explain how it can change from night, to day if the world is flat. The whole world would be rotating (plane shape, clockewise motion) but sunrise and sunset would last SECONDS (at the cities that first receive sunlight) ALL OVER THE WORLD. OR, the sun would have to go on and off and manage the amount of sunligh so there can be "sunrises and sunsets". (There has to be sunrises and sunsets because of variation of colors and sudden bright color on cosmo canyon area)

All in all, if you dont feel like reading, Squaresoft made a world of their own in this game with some weird laws of physics.. [short: world not flat or round. Just different]

I leave you to think about this.

It doesnt have a name, and you've put way too much thought into this. It's a game, and the world map doesnt matter. All of that stuff isnt important.

Not that you're dumb for analyzing all of that, but really, it seems like making a big deal out of something unimportant.

People smarter than me will come by to discuss this, though.

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Originally Posted by TheAbominatrix

It doesnt have a name, and you've put way too much thought into this. It's a game, and the world map doesnt matter. All of that stuff isnt important.

Not that you're dumb for analyzing all of that, but really, it seems like making a big deal out of something unimportant.

People smarter than me will come by to discuss this, though.

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Oh I yea I know, its late, I want to go to bed, Im bored haha
I was playing earlier and it just seemed wierd =P
But I DO like the game, very much. It was just weird.

Oh Im not accusing you of disliking the game. I understand what you're saying and all, but I think it's just something we have to take at face value, ya know? I mean... they never explain how giant beasts/human-like creatures come from little balls of condensed mako, either xD

The materia stuff is much more possible than the world of FF7 :P. It's like half a sphere, with teleporters around the edges.

The world's name is "Gaia." The Advent Children pamphlet handed out at the Square-Enix booth at the last Electronics Entertainment Expo (E3) referred to it by this name: Linkage to a picture of the pamphlet.


In regard to another of your questions, there's only one polar ice cap because the Planet focuses its Spirit Energy in that area on healing the Planet's wound (the Northern Crater), rather than growing life. Recall Gast's conversation with Ifalna as seen in the Original Crisis Report tapes in Gast's house at Icicle Inn:

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"The first ones to discover the Planet's wound were the Cetra at
the Knowlespole."

"Tell us Ifalna... Where is the land called 'Knowlespole'?"

"Knowlespole refers to this area. The Cetra then began a
Planet-reading."

"Ifalna, what exactly does Planet-reading entail?"

"...I can't explain it very well, but it's like having a
conversation with the Planet..."
"It said something fell from the sky making a large wound."
"Thousands of Cetra pulled together, trying to heal the Planet..."
"But, due to the severity of the wound, it was only able to heal
itself, over many years."

"Do the Ancients, rather, the Cetra, have special powers to heal
the Planet?"

(She shakes her head.)

"No, it's not that kind of power. The life force of all living
things on this Planet becomes the energy."
"The Cetra tried desperately to cultivate the land so as not to
diminish the needed energy..."

"Hmm, even here so close to the North Cave, the snow never melts."
"Is that because the planet's energy is gathered here to heal its
injury?"

(She bows her head.)

"Yes, the energy that was needed to heal the Planet withered away
the land... then the Planet..."

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That area wasn't always a desolate, icy region.


By the way, the Planet is round. Recall either of the FMVs involving Meteor in space:
From the FMV in which the Shin-Ra No. 26 Rocket hits Meteor.
From the FMV in which it's shown that Meteor survived the collision with the Rocket.

Being 'much more possible' doesnt make it possible, which is my point.

Well why couldn't the center of the map just be the south pole?

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Originally Posted by Squall of SeeD

The world's name is "Gaia." The Advent Children pamphlet handed out at the Square-Enix booth at the last Electronics Entertainment Expo (E3) referred to it by this name: Linkage to a picture of the pamphlet.


In regard to another of your questions, there's only one polar ice cap because the Planet focuses its Spirit Energy in that area on healing the Planet's wound (the Northern Crater), rather than growing life. Recall Gast's conversation with Ifalna as seen in the Original Crisis Report tapes in Gast's house at Icicle Inn:



That area wasn't always a desolate, icy region.


By the way, the Planet is round. Recall either of the FMVs involving Meteor in space:
From the FMV in which the Shin-Ra No. 26 Rocket hits Meteor.
From the FMV in which it's shown that Meteor survived the collision with the Rocket.

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I get what you mean, yes, even in the cosmo canyon when the old dude shows them the world, its round (and it appeared to be in our solar system..hmn..maybe im wrong).
But Im saying, the "round world" doesnt follow "round world"'s rules. And you are right, I forgot about the lifestream and that's why there is ice. And true, this IS final fantasy. But the temperature is way down, which the earth couldnt have any control over since its the sun who provides light and heat.
Also, a second polar region in the middle of the map (actually, slightly below) would make the most sense.. but theres no ice there.
Im just saying that really, if you pay the slightest attention, the game (all FFs) tries to be realistic (it does try to explain everything.. but we're only human), and I just realized that the the world wasn't done in a way which we can relate the FFs world to ours like they(square) try so hard in every FF.
.. that is, after all, what I find most fun about FF. The idea that the world could exist (since they take so much time explaining things.. "cloud sum up what happen for the 35th time") in some place far off in space, it just doesnt.
[yea I know, like some guy can make a behemoth come up and kill everyone, but thats not what I mean. Like in FFX, there was the chocobo powered boats, I thought that was ingenous since they didnt believe in machines. The helicopter things on top that I forgot what was called on the airship allow it to hover and etc. You know, things that make sense and would work but don't necessarily exist.]

I know im being weird and annoying, but it was just one thing that was just way too much "fantasy" for me.
..get it? fantasy? haha ok im going now.

your referring to our world think about it Gaia worksdifferently to Earth it uses Lifestream so if something happens lifestream heals it pay attention to Bugenhagan on disc 1 and the Ghast/Ifalna tapes it tells you that the northern crater is where the planet concentrates most of the spiritual energy to heal the massive wound created by Jenova and the thing that looks like ice is Materia and lots of it but ive been thinking, does all materia have magical properties?
This is a video game it doesnt have to obey the laws of physics you know the laws of matter in ff7 could be a hell of alot different to ours but hey its only a video game what does it matter FF8 and FF9 have the same features even 6 and before

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Originally Posted by Shoden

but ive been thinking, does all materia have magical properties?

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The indication given by the game is that they do. Even the White Materia, which Aerith thought useless, had a function.

Also, taking into account that all Materia is condensed, crystallized Spirit Energy, and that the knoweldge of those who have lived and died in the past (their memories, essentially) -- carried to the Lifestream when their Spirit Energy returned there -- is what interacts between the wielder of a Materia and Gaia, allowing the wielder to call forth Magicks, it's probably safe to assume that all Spirit Energy in the Lifestream has some memories attached.

Anyway, here was Sephiroth's explanation concerning the functioning of Materia:

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"...the knowledge and wisdom of the Ancients is held in the
materia."
"Anyone with this knowledge can freely use the powers of the Land
and the Planet. That knowledge interacts between ourselves and the planet
calling up magic..... or so they say."

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The name of the Final Fantasy VII world was Earth, it was also surrounded by the planets Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. This is made clear in (SPOILER)Safer Sephiroth's spell "Supernova" which just so happens to be the lamest spell in Final Fantasy, and possibly video game, history for this reason and others I've delved into many times here on EoFF

Someone mentioned that the name was something else in Advent Children, and to be honest with you, I hope it is. I won't care that they changed it because it's obvious Square wasn't thinking clearly when they claimed that the Final Fantasy VII world was Earth.

Yes, it's supposedly called "Gaia" in AC.

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Originally Posted by Necronopticous

The name of the Final Fantasy VII world was Earth, it was also surrounded by the planets Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. This is made clear in (SPOILER)Safer Sephiroth's spell "Supernova" which just so happens to be the lamest spell in Final Fantasy, and possibly video game, history for this reason and others I've delved into many times here on EoFF

Someone mentioned that the name was something else in Advent Children, and to be honest with you, I hope it is. I won't care that they changed it because it's obvious Square wasn't thinking clearly when they claimed that the Final Fantasy VII world was Earth.

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It's never called "Earth" in Final Fantasy VII's dialogue, though. As for the Supernova Spell, seeing as how it wasn't even really happening (the Spell can be cast several times, meaning those celestial bodies weren't being destroyed), and seeing as how a Spell capable of rendering that kind of destructive power would have rendered Meteor useless to begin with. With this in mind, I think the purpose of showing Pluto get shattered, Jupiter get a hole punched through it and then explode, and various other incidents of cosmic conflagration was to offer an emphasis concerning the Spell's strength by offering the destruction of worlds that the player would be familiar with. Which does beg the question of why the Spell isn't all that powerful.

And, yes, as the link I provided earlier shows, it would seem that Square-Enix has deemed to name that world "Gaia": Here's that link again.

By the way, in Final Fantasy VII, those icy cliffs atop the world were called "Gaea's Cliffs." Considering that it's only a difference of one letter and that other incidents of translation or localization altered a good deal more than that, I think it's a safe indication that this refers to the world.

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Originally Posted by Squall of SeeD

It's never called "Earth" in Final Fantasy VII, though. As for the Supernova Spell, seeing as how it wasn't even really happening (the Spell can be cast several times, meaning those celestial bodies weren't being destroyed), and seeing as how a Spell capable of rendering that kind of destructive power would have rendered Meteor useless to begin with. With this in mind, I think the purpose of showing Pluto get shattered, Jupiter get a hole punched through it and then explode, and various other incidents of cosmic conflagration was to offer an emphasis concerning the Spell's strength by offering the destruction of worlds that the player would be familiar with. Which does beg the question of why the Spell isn't all that powerful.

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I can't think of any other instance where a spell's visuals are used metaphorically, the things you described about the spell just enforce how immensely lame the spell actually is. Since at the climax of the spell the game clearly says "Earth" as a caption and shows your characters being scolded by the suns outer layer upon it, this spell DOES suggest that the planet is called Earth. There is no way around how uninspired and thoughtless the implementation of this spell into Safer Sephiroth's aresonal was.

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Originally Posted by Necronopticous

I can't think of any other instance where a spell's visuals are used metaphorically, the things you described about the spell just enforce how immensely lame the spell actually is.

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Sadly, yes.

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Originally Posted by Necronopticus

Since at the climax of the spell the game clearly says "Earth" as a caption and shows your characters being scolded by the suns outer layer upon it, this spell DOES suggest that the planet is called Earth.

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Yes, I meant to edit that sentence -- and then forgot -- to say the game's dialogue doesn't refer to the Planet as Earth like Final Fantasy IV's dialogue did with its Planet:

(Spoilers of Final Fantasy IV; don't highlight it unless you've played the game, or if you do so, do so at your own risk.)

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(SPOILER)Cecil: ...Who are you?

Old Man: I am FuSoYa, guardian of the Lunarians.

Rosa: Lunarians?

FuSoYa: In eons past, a planet between Mars and Jupiter verged on
extinction. The survivors escaped by ship to the blue planet.

Cecil: The blue planet...? Our home?

FuSoYa: Yes, Earth. But because the people of Earth were still
evolving, the survivors created another moon, where they now sleep.

Edge: So these survivors became Lunarians, and they're still sleeping.

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Sorry about that.

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Originally Posted by Necronopticus

There is no way around how uninspired and thoughtless the implementation of this spell into Safer Sephiroth's aresonal was.

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Agreed. Especially in light of the title "Gaia" having now been given to it.

Well, the basic idea is that "Supernova" had nothing to do with reality. Sephi (or Jenova) had all kinds of REALLY warped illusion powers. Think of supernova as a psychological assault, moreso than a physical one. Intimidation coupled with sensory overload. I know if someone force-fed my mind the destruction of a solar-system, I'd be a little unnerved.
And there are quite a few spells with metaphorical images. Take the appearance of darkness/poison/etc. as floating images on the character. Unless you think being asleep includes real "zzz" or whatever else it might be images.

But, even if another place but the "north pole" was true north, the problem with the sphere hop would be the same. No matter how you turn a ball, going up the top of it sends you DOWN the other side, not instantly to the opposite side of the world. That was just lazyness.

The question that I always wanted answered- how long is meteor supposed to take getting there? You can leave the game RUNNING for a couple weeks, and still that damned rock won't land. I want a "you loose" ending sequence that involves the utter annihilation of the entire world.

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Originally Posted by udsuna

Well, the basic idea is that "Supernova" had nothing to do with reality. Sephi (or Jenova) had all kinds of REALLY warped illusion powers. Think of supernova as a psychological assault, moreso than a physical one. Intimidation coupled with sensory overload. I know if someone force-fed my mind the destruction of a solar-system, I'd be a little unnerved.

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If you were going to psychologically assult someone by showing them these images you certainly wouldn't show them some random solar system that they have no idea of, and then again, I think it's pretty ludacris to say Supernova was psychological or that Sephiroth was making the team psychosomatically witness the destruction of a solar system. Even if he was, they are on their planet, they clearly cannot see any of the effects of this "psychological trip" except when the sun approached their planet so why would Sephiroth go through the trouble to fake the destruction of some other random planets? I think this explanation is an exercise in denial.

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Originally Posted by udsuna

And there are quite a few spells with metaphorical images. Take the appearance of darkness/poison/etc. as floating images on the character. Unless you think being asleep includes real "zzz" or whatever else it might be images.

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This is quite different. People also do not talk in textboxes and go inside each other's bodies when they form a party. These are symbols as opposed to what you're suggesting Supernova is, which is planted psychological hallucination.

Unless it's scripted or an unavoidable aspect of the storyline, battle events aren't occurring in reality, anyway, so I wouldn't put too much thought into anything behind Supernova being an illusion or something to that affect. For an example of what I mean, Aerith can get shot forty times in a battle and survive, whereas Zack got shot probably that many times in a cutscene and died.

Battle physics don't equate to reality. The animation sequence of Supernova was more than likely more for the player's benefit than anything else.

Yeah, I just thought it looked cool. Remember, this is a game where people stand around during the heat of combat waiting for their speed gauge to charge, and hundreds of items are carried around and available at moment's notice. I think the map placement/supernova effects are just done that way for graphical reasons and shouldn't be taken seriously.

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Originally Posted by udsuna

Well, the basic idea is that "Supernova" had nothing to do with reality. Sephi (or Jenova) had all kinds of REALLY warped illusion powers. Think of supernova as a psychological assault, moreso than a physical one. Intimidation coupled with sensory overload. I know if someone force-fed my mind the destruction of a solar-system, I'd be a little unnerved.

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That's a pretty good explanation there. After reading that, I imagine Supernova's imagery implanted in the party's head as some kind of bad acid trip.

You have too much time on your hands.
It's not important the the world isn't perfect, honestly no one cares
:rolleyes2

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Originally Posted by Necronopticous

why would Sephiroth go through the trouble to fake the destruction of some other random planets? I think this explanation is an exercise in denial.

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Call it the "translation effect" theory of telepathy. If I think a certain concept to another person, regardless of the language they speak, they would understand my message, because it's not the sounds that transmit, but the concept BEHIND the words that get recieved. So, we saw the solar system familiar to us, as did the characters see the solar system familiar to them. And final fantasy has done plenty of "automatically translated for your benefit" stuff, before. As far back as a foriegn language the characters learn in FF1.

And I wasn't comparing Supernova directly to the standard spells. I don't think they're related. But you said you couldn't think of spells where images are used metaphorically, I corrected that statement. They were seperate points, not to be clumped together.