Wonder how people didn´t notice this.

People refer the place Squall was in the end of the game as a "desert".
To me it looks like a dry plain.There is no sand.So it couldn´t be Dingo nor Kashkabald.
To me it looks like the Esthar soil.Wonder how people didn´t noticed it before.
I always see it as Esthar soil (or at least Mordred plains soil).
It can´t be Galbadia nor Winhill,nor Centra,nor Trabia,nor Balamb nor Grandidi.
Rinoa was in Centra (flower field ) and Squall walks on Esthar/Mordred like soil.
In the beggining of the game I am sure it was Esthar soil only.

You mean Squall is somewhere near Esthar during the end of the game? Well, to me, he is in the middle of nowhere...

i dont thinks hes anywhere and hes just stuck in TC but TC could have placed him there but i is one of those things that isnt and wont and doesnt need to be explained.

i think its supposed to be 'nowhere'

1-I didn´t said he was in Esthar.I said the soil looks like Esthar´s.
2-Time compression put him there as well as Rinoa in Centra.
3-It has meaning and needs a meaning.It´not that I wanna to discuss it but If Rinoa didn´t meet with Squall people who live in Centra would never been able to know Esthar and Esthar would never been able to know about Centra.Even if they travel around the world they will not been able to meat each other.This is just an opinion of mineI don´t wanna to go offtopic but ...
In the beggining of the game Ellone tries to find her lover Squall.She wanna to see shooting stars with him at the flower field.But as she tries to find Squall she accidentally sends her consciouness far into the future.And the place is Esthar(in the future).Her consciousness hops between the flower field and Esthar.Then misteriously we see the flowers flying into the sky.It´s like if we are seeing a movie in reward.So she is sending her counsciousness to the past.The flower field is the same place in which Squall fights Seifer.That´s obvious.The scene looks like a film in reward.The sky then is not blue anymore.It turns grey(it´s raining).The camera remains at the same place.

Eh, Ellone and Squall are not lovers. :rolleyes2

And the colour of the soil is completely irrelevant. It may 'look' like Esthar soil, but the place he's walking on is reduced into a tiny little island after a while, which obviously means he's NOT in Esthar, or any 'real' location.

I'm not even touching the rest of your post though...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

People refer the place Squall was in the end of the game as a "desert".
To me it looks like a dry plain.There is no sand.So it couldn´t be Dingo nor Kashkabald.
To me it looks like the Esthar soil.Wonder how people didn´t noticed it before.
I always see it as Esthar soil (or at least Mordred plains soil).

---

Oh look, you actually made an interesting, not-based-on-crazy-theory thread. Good job.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

In the beggining of the game Ellone tries to find her lover Squall.She wanna to see shooting stars with him at the flower field.But as she tries to find Squall she accidentally sends her consciouness far into the future.And the place is Esthar(in the future).Her consciousness hops between the flower field and Esthar.Then misteriously we see the flowers flying into the sky.It´s like if we are seeing a movie in reward.So she is sending her counsciousness to the past.The flower field is the same place in which Squall fights Seifer.That´s obvious.The scene looks like a film in reward.The sky then is not blue anymore.It turns grey(it´s raining).The camera remains at the same place.

---

:confused: And then you blew it.

I've never actually thought of where Squall was, I just thought it was nowhere, like he was lost in time or something and that was the representation.

It's obviously meant to represent Squall's isolation from others, which has given him a dry and more or less meaningless life. He had the most difficulty of any of them accepting his need for others.

By the way, Future a couple of things:

1) Time Compression didn't deposit Rinoa in Centra. Rinoa deposited Rinoa in Centra, because she was focusing on that place and her promise to meet Squall there. One's own will is what determined where they arrived.

2) I knew it was too good to be true that you would be able to keep posting without bringing back the outrageous, baseless theories. The Thread on Time Compression really looked like you were dying to throw one out, but decided to play it safe until now.

...........yea, what that guy said...........

Here's how I see it:
1- your team is fighting Ultimesia in the future.
2- you finish her off.
3- she exceploades and time compression happens.
4- Zell asks everyone to shut up and concentrate on meating up at a place from their time.
5- everyone is back at Balamb Garden safe and sound except for:
A)Rinoa and the reason for that is Squall's promise of meating her at the flower field behind Edea's house.
B)Squall because of his crappy memory and he is a bit laking on the imagenation department he couldn't leave the... ... ...
RED ROCK WHERE THEY FOUGHT GRIEVER ON!!!!

P.S:
the time compression -represented as a liqued silver sky- showes us
a fast image of Squall whith a hole in his fase, now why would Square put a scary image of Squall duering time compression?!
Because it's a hint to indecate that Squall will smile at the neer future, or should I say at the end of the game <3

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

1-In the beggining of the game Ellone tries to find her lover Squall.She wanna to see shooting stars with him at the flower field.But as she tries to find Squall she accidentally sends her consciouness far into the future.And the place is Esthar(in the future).Her consciousness hops between the flower field and Esthar.Then misteriously we see the flowers flying into the sky.It´s like if we are seeing a movie in reward.So she is sending her counsciousness to the past.The flower field is the same place in which Squall fights Seifer.That´s obvious.The scene looks like a film in reward.The sky then is not blue anymore.It turns grey(it´s raining).The camera remains at the same place.

---

From my POV in the beginning of the game, I didn't see Ellone at all and all I see is Rinoa holding a flower petal and it turn into a feather then the fight scene begins.

How in the world do you know that Ellone want to see shooting stars with Squall in the flower field?

The place where Squall fight Seifer is just a random place near Balamb garden.If the flower field is the same place where Squall fight Seifer, How do they take Squall from Centra all the way back to Balamb after the fight?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sir Bahamut

Eh, Ellone and Squall are not lovers.

---

True....but she might be in love with Laguna since she like Laguna so much when she is a kid but this is just my own little pointless theory. :D :D :D

Me thinks Future Esthar is getting Rinoa and Ellone confused alot.. And needs to play FF8 again before making such statements.

He is stuck in the time compression, until Rinoa comes to find him.. That's it. Good job on reading WAY too into it. :p

its either nowhere or a big chunk of the planet stuck in time compression like a chunk of mordred plains or esthar plains.

Quote:

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Me thinks Future Esthar is getting Rinoa and Ellone confused alot.. And needs to play FF8 again before making such statements.

He is stuck in the time compression, until Rinoa comes to find him.. That's it. Good job on reading WAY too into it.

---

And you need to play the part in which Rinoa is possessed in space.
If you place yourself in between Rinoa she will split into many Ellone´s.
I played it yesterday.I don´t remember if they dress the white clothe or the green "bandage" Ellone dress but at least they dress in blue and theyr body seems like Ellone´s(It´s exactly equal).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Quote:

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Me thinks Future Esthar is getting Rinoa and Ellone confused alot.. And needs to play FF8 again before making such statements.

He is stuck in the time compression, until Rinoa comes to find him.. That's it. Good job on reading WAY too into it.

---

And you need to play the part in which Rinoa is possessed in space.
If you place yourself in between Rinoa she will split into many Ellone´s.
I played it yesterday.I don´t remember if they dress the white clothe or the green "bandage" Ellone dress but at least they dress in blue and theyr body seems like Ellone´s(It´s exactly equal).

---

God, Future, why are you bringing this stuff back? X_X They nearly made the FFVIII Forum uninhabitable the last time.

No, Rinoa doesn't split into many Ellones. There's a doubling of Rinoa's own image. Nothing more, nothing less.

At this point I'm thinking that you're just Trolling and making this up as a reference to Rinoa and Ellone having what is obviously the same facial model for the FMVs. Next we'll be hearing about how Selphie is Ellone's twin sister, right?

First Ultimecia = Rinoa now Ellone = Rinoa...
Now came a question...Who or what is Rinoa...Is she just who we think she is or something more than meet the eyes?
(Maybe ppl will stop making things so complicated by coming with all soft of imaginary theories since the game ended just fine...)

According to his Profile, he's 25, and considering his 'theories', it seems likely he's just a troll. :rolleyes2

Future Esthar, please do not spread rumors. They may be 'theories' to you but that is not how they come across. Just stick to discussing actual events in the game without your unique 'interpretations'. :)

It's the end of time he's in a place when everything is gone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Squall of SeeD

Next we'll be hearing about how Selphie is Ellone's twin sister, right?

---

I think they're big and little sister. They are not the same age.

I provided proofs,Del Murder.

Quote:

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No, Rinoa doesn't split into many Ellones. There's a doubling of Rinoa's own image. Nothing more, nothing less.

---

You are a pretty bad observer.
And no,Rinoa´s appearance is not equal to Ellone´s.
How can I take screenshots of the game?and how to post here?
By the way,the game implies Squall get lost in time.To be lost in time didn´t mean that Squall was in nowhere or TC.It means that he just wasn´t in HIS era.

Quote:

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The place where Squall fight Seifer is just a random place near Balamb garden.If the flower field is the same place where Squall fight Seifer, How do they take Squall from Centra all the way back to Balamb after the fight?

---

I think I showed you that the camera stops and it looked like it was filming in reverse.And then the flowers disappeared into the sky.
It goes like this:
1-Both Squall and Seifer dreamed that.
2-Like in the Laguna dreams the damage was also feeled in the real world.
3-People in the Garden saw they are damaged and take Squall to the Infirmary.
4-Squall is a bit confused (has something in his forehead) and is convinced they really fought at the training center.Same for Seifer.Who knows if Seifer and Squall went not there in the curfew and sleep?.At midnight it´s possible.So people on the next day found them there and they were damaged.

Quote:

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It's the end of time he's in a place when everything is gone.

---

Depending on the interpretation you made you are right.
I wanna to note that the wall in which we see the images mixed is the TC but not the soil Squall foots on.This is obvious.Time seems to flow normaly in it.Esthar is a big continent.It explains why Squal gets tiring.TC surrounds the area,that´s why it looks like a floating island.
But if you say that the total set of places (flower field+Esthar+others) is TC well,then I am the first to agree.The recognition of that can change drasticaly how you see the storyline.

I'm not sure what you consider 'proof', but it is not what constitutes as such around here. It would just be best if you kept your theories to yourself or shared them elsewhere, because you'll just end up confusing and irritating people.

Then explain why Squall missed doing the fire cavern because of that fight and had to make it up with Quistis. I'm playing the smurfing game again at the moment and what you are saying isn't making any smurfing sense.

And BTW.. lost in time doesn't mean he's not in his era.. It means he's not in ANY era.

Well,at least let me finish the debate in this thread.And let me at least try to prove(on another thread ) that the world of FF8 is already time compressed.I will not advance with any other theories.That will be my unique theory these days.The demonstration uses logic and is mathematical.It´s not empiric.It only uses some logic.

Quote:

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Then explain why Squall missed doing the fire cavern because of that fight and had to make it up with Quistis. I'm playing the smurfing game again at the moment and what you are saying isn't making any smurfing sense.

And BTW.. lost in time doesn't mean he's not in his era.. It means he's not in ANY era.

---

I already explained.They sleeped at the training center and fight at their dreams.The damage was feeled in the real world.When they wake they were convinced that they fought there.The other Garden people aswell.So he missed doing it because he slept at the training center.This is pretty much like Ellone´s ability.Squall and Seifer were the only ones at the training center,so how do you expect Garden´s people to know they weren´t fighting in reality.People in FF8 can be damaged in reality when they are sleeping.If you have HP 700 ,then sleep then laguna has HP 300 and loses 30 HP he will have HP 270 and when you woke you will have HP 670.

To be lost in a place means to be in a non familiar place.It don´t mean in a space compressed world.
This applies to time in the same manner.
You need to go to the dictionary.



.

And you need to get your head examined. What the smurf would be the point of having them "dream" they fought and have them believe they did fight and even have damage to show for it.. If they were never to be told otherwise? That's just pointless and stupid. Please do us all a favor and get a life.

EDIT: His theories may be out there but that is no reason to insult him. Consider yourself warned. -Murder

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I already explained.They sleeped at the training center and fight at their dreams.

---

Why would the two of them go catch a nap at the training center and how can they dreamed of each other and fought... care to explain?

Ok, Maybe you will say Ellone make them do it just like the Laguna's dream. But as far as I know, Ellone only have ability to send one back to the past. But can she let someone fight in their own dreams and get hurt?Even so, can you give reasons why Ellone want the two of them to fight?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

If you place yourself in between Rinoa she will split into many Ellone´s.

---

This is what is posted earlier...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

And no,Rinoa´s appearance is not equal to Ellone´s.

---

And this is posted recently..You say Rinoa split into many Ellone and you say Rinoa appearance is not equal to Ellone.So you are trying to say Rinoa is not Ellone but Rinoa's image is splited into many Ellone in the ending so in Squall's mind so Ellone is Squall's true love and Rinoa is just a smokescreen?

If you see the ending, you will see Squall and Rinoa ended together and Ellone isn't. Maybe you need to read this...

FF8 Story

Future Esthar, you're theory that the world of FF8 is a time compressed world is wrong, as has been pointed out several times in the other topic. Proof:

Fact 1) Both Edea and Rinoa tell us that only Ultimecia is the only one who can live in a time compressed world.
Fact 2) More people than Ultimecia live in the world off FF8.

Conclusion: The world of FF8 is not a time compressed world.

Í discussed it till the end in that topic.It´s unfortunate that it´s dificult to explain the phenomenas.I tried.You then stop replying to it .But in the last post I defeated the counter arguments that were left to discuss.

To Unknown:
The entire dream consists of the events in the beggining.
Ellone initiates the dream but she is looking for Squall so fierce that she accidentally sends her counsciousness to the past and found them fighting.
She starts at the beach,runs through the sea and while she is talking to Squall she hops between Esthar and the sea.Then she is at the flower field,some leafs fall and she takes a feather.Then the leafs and the feathers start to flying and (with the camera at the same place) the scene goes continually to the battle event.This proofs that the place in which they battle and the flower field were the same.
The same way Ellone sees through Laguna his battles, she see through Squall his battles.
And Rinoa split in many Ellones when she was possessed out in space.
No one telled me how to take screenshots of the game yet.

No Future, you never even tried to argue against the proof I just posted. If you did, could you please repost your counter argument to the proof I just posted?

Some of you people analyze things waayyy too much, it's not meant to be anywhere it's just some random place with nothing in it.
It doesn't mean anything.

This isn´t going anywhere.
Just tell me how to take screenshots from the game.And how to post them here.

Unless you have a PC version you'll have to literally take a picture of your TV screen, scan it onto a computer, and upload it somewhere.

But don't think you'll convince anyone besides yourself, Future. Everyone but you can see your theories for what they are... :rolleyes2

What's wrong with interpreting a game in your own way? These things are made for our own enjoyment. Future Esthar is free to take what he wishes from the game, and whether he's "right" or "wrong" doesn't really matter.

Eh, there's a difference between interpreting the game your own way and claiming Rinoa splits into multiple Ellones in outer space. :rolleyes2

But yeah, you're right that Future can believe whatever he wants. But you may not remember what it was like the last time he went on a spree of 'theory topics'. Wasn't very pretty, and it looks like he's starting all over again now.

Well, your responses dictate the tenor of the debate as much as the quality of his theories.

Grr, for goodness sakes! It isn't a desert becasue there is no sand, right, just cracked ground? But what we also have to remember is that time compression is still around, so it could just be a random place conjoured up by the last magic that exploded with Ultimecia. Personally, i think it just looks like the dried up dead looking flower field

[QUOTE]Grr, for goodness sakes! It isn't a desert becasue there is no sand, right, just cracked ground? But what we also have to remember is that time compression is still around, so it could just be a random place conjoured up by the last magic that exploded with Ultimecia. Personally, i think it just looks like the dried up dead looking flower field[QUOTE] Agree completely.It was burned by Galbadian Soldiers, flooded by water,suffer ice catastrophes and used by ancient Estharians to construct a small village.

I have the pc version.How to take screenshots in this case?
__________________

Thank you Future ^_~

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I have the pc version.How to take screenshots in this case?
__________________

---

Hit the 'print screen' key and paste it into Paint or some other picture editer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eestlinc

Well, your responses dictate the tenor of the debate as much as the quality of his theories.

---

I'll have to aplogise here, and admit that I may not exactly be the most patient man when it comes to dealing with his theories. I just get overly frustrated when I try and respond to his theories which are damn near impossible to understand to begin with, and he either completely ignores what I've been saying or cooks up something completely different which contradicts what he said in his previous post. Especially when some people actually take it seriously...

But yeah, sorry for being so rude, I'll try and tone it down.

Thanks Del Murder.
I press print screen but nothing happens.
Where is the file with the picture suppose to be?

Print Screen will just store the image in your clipboard memory. After hitting print screen, switch back to yoru desktop, open Paint, and choose edt>paste and the screen image shopuld appear. Then you can save it to your hard drive, resize it, etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eestlinc

What's wrong with interpreting a game in your own way?

---

That only goes so far. The storyline of a game is a written work created by an author that had an intent in mind when they wrote it. To argue that it could be interpreted in any direction would be like arguing that in The Lord of the Rings (spoiler for the books, movies, and games ahead) (SPOILER)Sauron actually won and the whole victory was just a delusion that Sam was suffering from before Sauron executed him and claiming that it is as valid a take on things as any other.

Interpreting things your own way only goes so far, especially when you start posting on a public Forum and arguing that your interpretations are fact when they are contradicted by the actual work in question.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

She starts at the beach,runs through the sea and while she is talking to Squall she hops between Esthar and the sea.Then she is at the flower field,some leafs fall and she takes a feather.Then the leafs and the feathers start to flying and (with the camera at the same place) the scene goes continually to the battle event

---

I pretty sure what that the girl was Rinoa and not Ellone...

Now that with this theory of yours make Ellone the main female character since she is Squall's true love as for Rinoa...she can go wash the toliet? So,what is Rinoa's purpose of existence in the game since she is not the female lead.....to split into many Ellones?

Also in the ending when Squall and Rinoa end up together is actually Squall thought Rinoa will split into many Ellones so he can live happily with all his lovers?And last but not least..what about the LOGO???The lady in the logo is actually Ellone and not Rinoa???....I need to go on medication.....please excuse me.....

Let me explain it to you,Unknow.
Rinoa is the true Ellone.I am yet to proof this (needs to take a screenshot).

The grown Ellone is just a machine similar to Ellone and with the same abilities.Not the doctors invention ones but similar to it.

Unless you think Rinoa is the machine one which i don´t believe.

So in conclusion it is Rinoa = REAL Ellone and Ellone = A Machine
so which STILL mean Ellone = Rinoa. right?

Unknown, you'd be best not to take his Ellone being a machine and all that as anything remotely serious. Although he may find it fits somehow in his warped mind, i's certainly nothing any sane person should consider.

Quote:

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So in conclusion it is Rinoa = REAL Ellone and Ellone = A Machine
so which STILL mean Ellone = Rinoa. right?

---

Right.This theory is familiar to some forum members.I just post it here for Unknow to know.
Do you wanna the proof.?
Wait a little and your eyes will testifie it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Thanks Del Murder.
I press print screen but nothing happens.
Where is the file with the picture suppose to be?

---

Ever heard of PSX-MC? It's more easier to use. You can save all the movies from the game, take pictures, and you can burn them into a disc if you want.

http://www.eyesonff.com/forums/attac...id=15030&stc=1

http://www.eyesonff.com/forums/attac...id=15029&stc=1


Eait a little.I am testing the image thing.This will be edited.
I upload the images but how can I post them in the middle of the post?
And what did IMG stand for.How to use it?

Oh yes. I see it. They're the same person, and the real message of FFVIII is that incest should be tolerable.

I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I need more proof.

Squall and Ellone weren´t brothers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Squall and Ellone weren´t brothers.

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They were basically raised as siblings. Raine was Squall's mother. Raine also adopted Ellone. Laguna is Ellone's "Uncle" and Squall's father. If they're not siblings, they're damn close to it. If a family with only a son adopted a girl, I'm pretty sure the son and daughter wouldn't fall in love, nor should they.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Del Mordor

Oh yes. I see it. They're the same person, and the real message of FFVIII is that incest should be tolerable.

---

Actually, the fact that Squall's father and Rinoa's mother were in love briefly kinda weirds me out a bit. Like their children were rekindling the romance that they lost. :sweatdrop

...

What. The. smurf.

Please tell me that this nonsense doesn't have to be allowed to go on.

Jesus God, Future, all of those doubles are of Rinoa. Look at them. You can even see her duster hanging to her feet in all of them. Bloody hell.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Squall of SeeD

...

What. The. smurf.

Please tell me that this nonsense doesn't have to be allowed to go on.

Jesus God, Future, all of those doubles are of Rinoa. Look at them. You can even see her duster hanging to her feet in all of them. Bloody hell.

---

Exactly. And is there any point to the picture of Ellone sitting down?

Maybe Future is just doing this to get a rise out of everyone.

You are saying Ellone = Rinoa based on THAT????
Even a two year old will see those are double images of Rinoa or you prefer to call her Ellone.
You really need to take a CLEAR look at the picture.

PLEASE JUST TELL ME HOW TO USE THE [IMG] TAG TO POST IMAGES (OR WHATEVER OTHER METHOD) INSTEAD OF DISCUSSING THE THEORY. :mad2:

You had the images posted just fine before. Why did you take them down?

And that would be [*IMG]http://www.whatever.com/blah.jpg[*/IMG]. Just remove the *s.

Oh,I am not supposed to see the images I post?
Only the other members?
I mean,see them without need to click on the link.

No.. if you put the IMG tags around the url, it should display fine. Unless there is an issue with your hosting or the site it's coming from.

EDIT: Oh, I see.. Nah, attachments don't give you the complete url to the pic. You'd need an actual link, which would come from hosting the file, rather than attaching it.

What do you mean by hosting a file?

Like the way people have images in their sigs. That sig has to be hosted by an external site.

www.photobucket.com <

Because I'm an untrusting bastard, I'm just going to save Future the time to come up with a way to cover himself on this one and host the images he had up before:

http://img243.imageshack.us/my.php?i...ofrinoa8hp.jpg
http://img243.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ellone7tr.jpg

No bloody splitting into Ellone is taking place there. It's obviously Rinoa splitting into Rinoa.

No matter how I look at it from whatever angle it is still Rinoa but since Future claim Ellone = Rinoa and Rinoa split into a lot of images of herself so that's also mean Rinoa spliting into many Ellones?Alright, this doesn't make sense. As I say before, even a two year old can tell that is Rinoa's double images.

Also,even if Rinoa split into many Ellones, it is still not convincing enough to say Rinoa is Ellone and Ellone is just a freaking machine and why is that so since the machine is only avaliable in the future.And also, why did the REAL Ellone turn into Rinoa and didn't stay as herself and how did she do that?

So when Julia get pregant and give birth, just what the hell did she give birth to? Ellone as Rinoa, or Ellone or Rinoa as Ellone or a Machine or she just fart and didn't give birth at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

What do you mean by hosting a file?

---

You could always just save the screenshots as pictures on your own computer, and attach them as thumbnails (you do this by clicking on the manage attachments button below the text window while posting a reply.

I'm really curious to see what it is your talking about.

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...lonemelhor.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a53...Rinoasplit.jpg

I am not saying that each splitting isn´t Rinoa.

What I am saying is that if you look at each splitting (without considering the clothes) you will see they are equal to the picture of Ellone.
Each split has short hair unlike Rinoa (but they are Rinoa).
This is mysterious.How can we have two Ellone´s at the same time?

The only explanation is either Rinoa is a robot and Ellone a human or Rinoa a human and Ellone a robot or Ellone possesses Rinoa(which makes no sense).
Looking at Rinoa´s personality I can´t really believe she is a robot so.

The little difference in the color of rinoa´s skin and Ellone´s skin is explained by the fact that Ellone is just a non perfect imitation.

And don´t say to me the characters use the same model.

We aren´t comparig two very different persons(like Ulti and Rinoa).We are comparing two persons with many similarities lile hair color,hair lenght,face structure,etc...

If Elle and Rinoa were important characters why would Square not bother to the fact that the splitting and Ellone were near equal?

To me these graphical considerations were more important in stating thruths about the game than a lot of scripts.

They were more reliable than the scripts obviously.
(Think about why is it that the graphics in FF8 were more realistic and get deep to details).

Just because the image have a SHORTER hair mean they are not Rinoa but likely to be Ellone

Let me make a assumption, anyone with a scar is Squall????
Anyone that is blonde is Cloud???
Anyone with green eyes is Aeris????

The only explaination that they are all Rinoa's image and the short hair thingy is probably the graphic like sometime the eyes of the character will dissappeared and appear again.

One can see that "Machine Ellone" was created to IMITATE Rinoa.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

One can see that "Machine Ellone" was created to IMITATE Rinoa.

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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

One can see that "Machine Ellone" was created to IMITATE Rinoa.

---

Then why it is call "Machine Ellone" and not "Machine Rinoa" since it is used to imitate Rinoa.

And for Hyne sake we all know that Machine Ellone is created by Dr Odine to imitate Ellone's powers.

Why do they want to imitate Rinoa anyway? Cause they want wings growing on their back?

Lastly, I still puzzled what do Julia give birth to? Let me guess.. Ultimecia? nah, mostly likely Kefka...

Rinoa's splits have no mouths!! Now, we can safely assume that Ellone (Rinoa) is actually mute and communicates telepathically by making Squall and friends think they hear her voice and see her (non-existent) mouth move. Because of this, we know that Ultimecia's speech impediment (The C=K theory) is due to Rinoa's (Ellone's) mind eventually deteriorating over the many years.

OMG, I wonder how people didn't notice this!?! *Sarcasm to the extreme*

It´s not only the "short hair".Everything is equal.
This is mysterious.
How is this possible?
You have to agree there is a plot hole here even if my theory don´t explains it.
This plot hole cannot be left open.

I think you are mistaking sh*tty graphics for depth.

Future, we can barely even see her hair in that damn picture due to the doubling effect. As hard as it would be to discern it with the translucency and the doubling effect, it's made more difficult because her hair is dark and the angles aren't exactly showing us Rinoa's back. Her hair is the same length it always was.

Jesus God, this has gone on long enough. I'm going to see if there are any Moderators with enough mercy to put this Thread down.

Quote:

---

Future, we can barely even see her hair in that damn picture due to the doubling effect. As hard as it would be to discern it with the translucency and the doubling effect, it's made more difficult because her hair is dark and the angles aren't exactly showing us Rinoa's back. Her hair is the same length it always was.

---

Don´t you think I didn´t thought about this?Of course I thought.

And there were scenes in which we see Rinoa´s back.
And believe-me I played the game and tried to separate one splitting from the others(this is possible).
And the hair was still short.
And since we see part of the hair in the translucency why can´t we see it all?
Why are you using excuses to keep your superiority to others?
I dismiss my theory.Happy?
But surely someone has to solve this mysteriy quickly.
We see that the splittings LOOKS PHYSICALLY like Ellone.
This mystery has to be solved somehow.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Autumn Rain

I think you are mistaking sh*tty graphics for depth.

---

Again, I state.

It didn´t matter the theory one addresses.
The splittings were similar to Ellone.
And this is mysterious.
End point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It didn´t matter the theory one addresses.
The splittings were similar to Ellone.
And this is mysterious.
End point.

---

Ok, but have a look at this two pictures.

http://img176.echo.cx/img176/3271/terra9my.png
http://img176.echo.cx/img176/9422/celes1nz.jpg

The girl in red is Terra and the other girl in white is Celes both from FF6.
They both look similar right?
But they are DIFFERENT person.
(Courtesy from this thread)
http://forums.eyesonff.com/showthread.php?t=64083

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Autumn Rain

I think you are mistaking sh*tty graphics for depth.

---

It might be the graphic problem or you just THINK too much...
And BTW, I still dun think the splittings look anywhere similar to Ellone.

So Future,

I was playing FFVIII last night, and at the part where you're getting ready to leave Fisherman's Horizon, just before that cheesy concert. Squall and Irvine are talking to Selphie by the Quad, trying to comfort her because the stage is demolished.

The Headmaster calls Squall over the PA, and he leaves Irvine to comfort Selphie..........however, Squall walks RIGHT through Irvine, instead of walking around him!!!!! (Well, in my copy, anyway).

So what do you think? hmm? Is this a glitch in the game?? NO!! PS1 games have perfect programming!! Just like in the case of the Rinoa = Ellone theory!!

So, is Irvine a "Dream" like Tidus in FFX? Is he not really there??? Is he imaginary like Mr. Snuffalufagus?? I mean, they don't remember him from the orphanage!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by crazybayman

So Future,

I was playing FFVIII last night, and at the part where you're getting ready to leave Fisherman's Horizon, just before that cheesy concert. Squall and Irvine are talking to Selphie by the Quad, trying to comfort her because the stage is demolished.

The Headmaster calls Squall over the PA, and he leaves Irvine to comfort Selphie..........however, Squall walks RIGHT through Irvine, instead of walking around him!!!!! (Well, in my copy, anyway).

So what do you think? hmm? Is this a glitch in the game?? NO!! PS1 games have perfect programming!! Just like in the case of the Rinoa = Ellone theory!!

So, is Irvine a "Dream" like Tidus in FFX? Is he not really there??? Is he imaginary like Mr. Snuffalufagus?? I mean, they don't remember him from the orphanage!!

---

Both Irvine and Rinoa DIED while the others were in prison. They are ghosts. It doesn't say this or hint it in any fashion, but it's one of those SECRET side plots that only cool people can figure out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Autumn Rain

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by crazybayman

So Future,

I was playing FFVIII last night, and at the part where you're getting ready to leave Fisherman's Horizon, just before that cheesy concert. Squall and Irvine are talking to Selphie by the Quad, trying to comfort her because the stage is demolished.

The Headmaster calls Squall over the PA, and he leaves Irvine to comfort Selphie..........however, Squall walks RIGHT through Irvine, instead of walking around him!!!!! (Well, in my copy, anyway).

So what do you think? hmm? Is this a glitch in the game?? NO!! PS1 games have perfect programming!! Just like in the case of the Rinoa = Ellone theory!!

So, is Irvine a "Dream" like Tidus in FFX? Is he not really there??? Is he imaginary like Mr. Snuffalufagus?? I mean, they don't remember him from the orphanage!!

---

Both Irvine and Rinoa DIED while the others were in prison. They are ghosts. It doesn't say this or hint it in any fashion, but it's one of those SECRET side plots that only cool people can figure out.

---

Ooohhhhhhh........so that's it

It happens all the time in the game.You just need to control Squall in the field going back and forth.Eventually the characters will pass over him.This seems just a glitch to me.
Why are you taking me as stupid?
I know how to distinguish between a glitch and a non glitch.

And Unknows,despite I never played FF6,I bet there wasn´t any machine to imitate Celes or Terra.
But there was a machine to imitate little Ellone´s powers.
And for reasons I can´t reveal now(they are related to Adel and the Sorceress War but it´s not the right time to reveal it.I would need millions of threads to show it) the machine was created to imitate even her physical appearance.It was transformed at her image to deceive and confuse people.Not even Doc Odine recognizes it.
Of course in the future Ulti will use it to send her consciousness to the past.
Basically after the real Ellone get to the White Seed ship somehow a battle begins and Elle was taken hostage by Galbadia.Edea was at the ship and (already possessed) manage to give Ellone to Galbadia.
She was adopted by Caraway who changed her name to Rinoa.
General Caraway is in fact a monster(maybe gerogero) who change it´s appearance after being possessed.
The general somehow obtained the machine and give it to the White Seed in Ellone´s place.
They thought it was Ellone and got away.

The general sealed his room to prevent Ellone to use it´s power inside there.He also devised a locking mechanism.
But Watt´s and Zone managed to free Rinoa.
How do they meet Rinoa?That´s another mystery I can´t reveal.
I can only say for now that Laguna and Ward were very smart.Smart enough to recognise the true Ellone.
The general changed the program of the machine so that it will give persons false visions about the past.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It happens all the time in the game.You just need to control Squall in the field going back and forth.Eventually the characters will pass over him.This seems just a glitch to me.
Why are you taking me as stupid?
I know how to distinguish between a glitch and a non glitch.

---

I figured you'd catch the sarcasm in that last post.....I didn't say you were stupid.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

And Unknows,despite I never played FF6,I bet there wasn´t any machine to imitate Celes or Terra.
But there was a machine to imitate little Ellone´s powers.
And for reasons I can´t reveal now(they are related to Adel and the Sorceress War but it´s not the right time to reveal it.I would need millions of threads to show it) the machine was created to imitate even her physical appearance.It was transformed at her image to deceive and confuse people.Not even Doc Odine recognizes it.

---

However, I wonder when you post stuff like this......... :p

The last post was edited.

The sorceress never looks for Ellone in the 2nd disk.
It was an excuse.

Fishermans Horizon-The sorceress wanna to scare the citizens so that they hate you and you are forced to leave the city.That way she prevents you to reach the future and at the same time she keeps the citizens in complete ignorance about what happens in the outside world.

Balamb city-The sorceress orders Raijin and Fujin to stay at the hotel.
That way,the sorceress prevents Elone from sending the conscience of the citizens to the "orphanage" time.She also order the soldiers to knock out people if they sleep.
However Ellone somehow(I don´t understand how up to this day) enable the soldiers at the station to the past.One of them see the flower field and the other was in the body of his grandma.
I don´t know how the badamb fish is related to her ability.
Had to research that.
But ellone succeeds anyway because she starts to talk that "peace talk" at Trabia Garden to prepare our heros and then she enable them to the past (with a little help from Irvine).But this time they don´t sleep.They are enable to see their childhood awakened.

Galbadia Garden-The sorceress knowing this gets angry and awaits them at centra.She plans to force Seed to dispose of the Garden.But first she wanna to use GG to pull Balamb Garden out of Centra.
This way she prevents them to go to Centra since there were no other vehicles going there.
At the same time she tries to kill Ellone in the rotative ring of the Garden.
Then Squall and company would be sent to jail without an Ellone to save them.
However Laguna helped Squall to reach Rinoa(Ellone) flying on that machine.A soldier appears pretending to obey the sorceress and intentionaly losed to Squall to help him(with the flying machine).
This Laguna thing looked strange to you?Ignore it for now.
Seed succeeded but Edea has another plan.
To spread sleeping gas over Rinoa should she be defeated.And then at the 3rd disk she pretends she was not possessed.And then you know the rest of the story,don´t you?

(I may have misssed bits on this thread but I got the jyst of it)

1. Ellone and Squall are brother and sister so the can't be lovers -that would be Cest
2. The place in the ending is not Ether it just a "Knowwhere" place contained in time compression.
3. It is similar to the place where you figth the GF (What ever you call squall's ring.)
4. Future Esther. What do you mean by "A film in reward"?
5. Make movies with the thinnesUnder the burger!!

Rinoa was at the orphanage.Squall was in love for her.However due to her special ability she had to leave the orphanage.Squall´s heart broken hard and from that day he loses the will to depend on others.But when he meets her again his feelings start to boil.He don´t recognizes her but he starts to change due to her influence.
Squall always loved Rinoa.A simple "sister" feeling don´t produce that wreckage on Squall´s life.I grant you that.Love does.Ellone was a special girl to Squall in the same manner that Selphie was to Irvine(Love)
Squall don´t feels that way for machine Ellone (the person that appears as Ellone in the third disk).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Rinoa was at the orphanage.Squall was in love for her.However due to her special ability she had to leave the orphanage.Squall´s heart broken hard and from that day he loses the will to depend on others.But when he meets her again his feelings start to boil.He don´t recognizes her but he starts to change due to her influence.
Squall always loved Rinoa.A simple "sister" feeling don´t produce that wreckage on Squall´s life.I grant you that.Love does.Ellone was a special girl to Squall in the same manner that Selphie was to Irvine(Love)
Squall don´t feels that way for machine Ellone (the person that appears as Ellone in the third disk).

---

See, what you aren't understanding is that all of your "theories" aren't backed up by any real facts. In fact, every "theory" you are announcing was portrayed to be something else or occur differently in the game. In very straightforward ways at that.

I'd vote that this thread be closed due to annoyance and confusion of everyone involved, but that will prolly never happen.

No,they don´t occur differently.I just add things without substituting anything.
I didn´t said "Mayor Dobe wasn´t in FH" nor "Squall fight the soldiers and the machine at the Mayors house".No.
If you thought a little you will see that some of my theories made a lot of sense looking at the context.
For exemple the previous theory and the theory of what happens at FH.

I HAVE looked at them. It's not that they wouldn't make sense.. It's that there is no reason to believe it occurred. You aren't reading too much into things, cause you are just adding new things for no apparent purpose.

SUGESTION:Don´t look for proofs for my theories.
Just read them and keep them on your head while you play FF8.As long as you play it many times and as long as you keep listening to my theories,light will be shed in your head.You will see gradually that I am right.In fact the theories are linked like a puzzle.
They can not be seen independently of the others.They are only pieces of a big puzzle.I managed to sligtly see the overal puzzle.But it would be difficult to believe the theories until you see the whole.The theories became more obvious the most you can see this whole.This can only be achieved as long as you keep listening to them and when you start to see how they relate to each other.I can not post all of them on a single post.It would take about a month or more.And millions of lines in the post.
Since this is a game not can be proved but of course there would be some theories which would made more sense than others.This is the farthest we can go in.We can give different interpretations to the game
as long as we DON`T CONTRADICT THE EVENTS ON IT.
I am not saying I don´t make mistakes.Of course i can make.
And I don´t know everything about this whole puzzle.I need to research more to find.There were things I don´t understand yet.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It happens all the time in the game.You just need to control Squall in the field going back and forth.Eventually the characters will pass over him.This seems just a glitch to me.
Why are you taking me as stupid?
I know how to distinguish between a glitch and a non glitch.

And Unknows,despite I never played FF6,I bet there wasn´t any machine to imitate Celes or Terra.
But there was a machine to imitate little Ellone´s powers.
And for reasons I can´t reveal now(they are related to Adel and the Sorceress War but it´s not the right time to reveal it.I would need millions of threads to show it) the machine was created to imitate even her physical appearance.It was transformed at her image to deceive and confuse people.Not even Doc Odine recognizes it.
Of course in the future Ulti will use it to send her consciousness to the past.
Basically after the real Ellone get to the White Seed ship somehow a battle begins and Elle was taken hostage by Galbadia.Edea was at the ship and (already possessed) manage to give Ellone to Galbadia.
She was adopted by Caraway who changed her name to Rinoa.
General Caraway is in fact a monster(maybe gerogero) who change it´s appearance after being possessed.
The general somehow obtained the machine and give it to the White Seed in Ellone´s place.
They thought it was Ellone and got away.

The general sealed his room to prevent Ellone to use it´s power inside there.He also devised a locking mechanism.
But Watt´s and Zone managed to free Rinoa.
How do they meet Rinoa?That´s another mystery I can´t reveal.
I can only say for now that Laguna and Ward were very smart.Smart enough to recognise the true Ellone.
The general changed the program of the machine so that it will give persons false visions about the past.

---

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAH :) :p :D :love: :love: :love: :love: :love: :love:
I also died laughing after reading this....

Let's just say Julia didn't give BIRTH to ANYTHING afterall. She just farted at the hospital, right? I just knew it!!!!!!!!!! Did you know one of the part that make FF8 interesting, is that Laguna and Julia can't get together but their children make it up for them. But now since Julia just farted at didn't give birth to anything at all, not even a lump of meat, so mentioning of this Julia's character serve no specific important purpose except she farted instead of giving birth.

So "Eyes on Me" also serve no specific purpose since no one seems related to Julia in anyway so what's the point of this song being played in the end? Cause everyone love Faye Wong?

As for Caraway being a monster, I know why!!! Wasn't there a theory saying Rinoa is ALSO Ultimecia, so Caraway is OMEGA WEAPON protecting the chapel.

Ok, back to business. When Ellone is onboard the White SeeD ship, she is OLD enough to know who her real PARENTS are. So if Omega weapon..I mean Caraway adopted her, she jolly well this old dude isn't her old man. So why didn't Rinoa tell anyone about this???

Dun tell me you gonna add "Oh, Caraway brainwash her with Terra Break which deal almost 18000 damage and anyone will be brainwashed after recieving this kind of damage."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

The last post was edited.

The sorceress never looks for Ellone in the 2nd disk.
It was an excuse.

Fishermans Horizon-The sorceress wanna to scare the citizens so that they hate you and you are forced to leave the city.That way she prevents you to reach the future and at the same time she keeps the citizens in complete ignorance about what happens in the outside world.

Balamb city-The sorceress orders Raijin and Fujin to stay at the hotel.
That way,the sorceress prevents Elone from sending the conscience of the citizens to the "orphanage" time.She also order the soldiers to knock out people if they sleep.
However Ellone somehow(I don´t understand how up to this day) enable the soldiers at the station to the past.One of them see the flower field and the other was in the body of his grandma.
I don´t know how the badamb fish is related to her ability.
Had to research that.
But ellone succeeds anyway because she starts to talk that "peace talk" at Trabia Garden to prepare our heros and then she enable them to the past (with a little help from Irvine).But this time they don´t sleep.They are enable to see their childhood awakened.

Galbadia Garden-The sorceress knowing this gets angry and awaits them at centra.She plans to force Seed to dispose of the Garden.But first she wanna to use GG to pull Balamb Garden out of Centra.
This way she prevents them to go to Centra since there were no other vehicles going there.
At the same time she tries to kill Ellone in the rotative ring of the Garden.
Then Squall and company would be sent to jail without an Ellone to save them.
However Laguna helped Squall to reach Rinoa(Ellone) flying on that machine.A soldier appears pretending to obey the sorceress and intentionaly losed to Squall to help him(with the flying machine).
This Laguna thing looked strange to you?Ignore it for now.
Seed succeeded but Edea has another plan.
To spread sleeping gas over Rinoa should she be defeated.And then at the 3rd disk she pretends she was not possessed.And then you know the rest of the story,don´t you?

---

You should really send this to Square, all their staffs will be amazed by your...imaginations.It is like FF8 is a totally DIFFERENT story now...I mean, FF8 has turned out to be YOUR story.

i thought he was in edeas orphanage but then again he was traveling through time so he could have been there but just a 100000000 years in the futyre or a 100000 years from the past....urgh what am i onabout

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

The last post was edited.

The sorceress never looks for Ellone in the 2nd disk.
It was an excuse.

Fishermans Horizon-The sorceress wanna to scare the citizens so that they hate you and you are forced to leave the city.That way she prevents you to reach the future and at the same time she keeps the citizens in complete ignorance about what happens in the outside world.

Balamb city-The sorceress orders Raijin and Fujin to stay at the hotel.
That way,the sorceress prevents Elone from sending the conscience of the citizens to the "orphanage" time.She also order the soldiers to knock out people if they sleep.
However Ellone somehow(I don´t understand how up to this day) enable the soldiers at the station to the past.One of them see the flower field and the other was in the body of his grandma.
I don´t know how the badamb fish is related to her ability.
Had to research that.
But ellone succeeds anyway because she starts to talk that "peace talk" at Trabia Garden to prepare our heros and then she enable them to the past (with a little help from Irvine).But this time they don´t sleep.They are enable to see their childhood awakened.

Galbadia Garden-The sorceress knowing this gets angry and awaits them at centra.She plans to force Seed to dispose of the Garden.But first she wanna to use GG to pull Balamb Garden out of Centra.
This way she prevents them to go to Centra since there were no other vehicles going there.
At the same time she tries to kill Ellone in the rotative ring of the Garden.
Then Squall and company would be sent to jail without an Ellone to save them.
However Laguna helped Squall to reach Rinoa(Ellone) flying on that machine.A soldier appears pretending to obey the sorceress and intentionaly losed to Squall to help him(with the flying machine).
This Laguna thing looked strange to you?Ignore it for now.
Seed succeeded but Edea has another plan.
To spread sleeping gas over Rinoa should she be defeated.And then at the 3rd disk she pretends she was not possessed.And then you know the rest of the story,don´t you?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Rinoa was at the orphanage.Squall was in love for her.However due to her special ability she had to leave the orphanage.Squall´s heart broken hard and from that day he loses the will to depend on others.But when he meets her again his feelings start to boil.He don´t recognizes her but he starts to change due to her influence.
Squall always loved Rinoa.A simple "sister" feeling don´t produce that wreckage on Squall´s life.I grant you that.Love does.Ellone was a special girl to Squall in the same manner that Selphie was to Irvine(Love)
Squall don´t feels that way for machine Ellone (the person that appears as Ellone in the third disk).

---

HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Man, What are you on??

Not one single person so far has agreed with your retarded theories. Its because THEY DON'T MAKE ANY SENSE. You are trying to read way to far into the game, to the point where your assuming things that in no way exist in FF8.

I'd go through your posts, and point out all the things which are WRONG, but I would end up Re-writing your entire theory, and I just don't have the time, nor have the interest to do. Even if I did, it would be pointless, because everyone realizes that its all just ridiculous anyway.

Why don't you write Square and the creators and programmers of this game, with your Theories, and see what they have to say.

i always thought he was inside his mind,,,

That´s why they were called theories.They weren´t walkthroughs.

No way.I don´t wanna to contact Square.Not in my wildest dreams.
Don´t do it please(I really prefer to be banned.)

Unknows,Julia IS Rinoa´s mother.
Rinoa meets Caraway at her childhood.
But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill.
She was adopted here but her adoptive fathers were killed by Esthar.
From now you know what happens.
Due to her special ability she was forced to leave the orphanage.
It was here that Galbadia take Elle as a hostage.
I was not referring to the part in which she yelled something and left.
I refer when she had to left the orphanage at her childhood.
Meanwhile Caraway buried Julia´s body in Dingo desert.
Using some sort of mechanism she was sucked into the prision while underground.
Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).
In fact,this stresses Julia´s importance in the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

That´s why they were called theories.They weren´t walkthroughs.

No way.I don´t wanna to contact Square.Not in my wildest dreams.
Don´t do it please(I really prefer to be banned.)

Unknows,Julia IS Rinoa´s mother.
Rinoa meets Caraway at her childhood.
But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill.
She was adopted here but her adoptive fathers were killed by Esthar.
From now you know what happens.
Due to her special ability she was forced to leave the orphanage.
It was here that Galbadia take Elle as a hostage.
I was not referring to the part in which she yelled something and left.
I refer when she had to left the orphanage at her childhood.
Meanwhile Caraway buried Julia´s body in Dingo desert.
Using some sort of mechanism she was sucked into the prision while underground.
Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).
In fact,this stresses Julia´s importance in the game.

---

You seriously must be on crack.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill.

---

Where do you get proof of this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).

---

Or this?!?!?!?!?

....this page is total crazyness.....
i don't want to read more
*hits post button and leaves thread*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

That´s why they were called theories.They weren´t walkthroughs.

No way.I don´t wanna to contact Square.Not in my wildest dreams.
Don´t do it please(I really prefer to be banned.)

Unknows,Julia IS Rinoa´s mother.
Rinoa meets Caraway at her childhood.
But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill.
She was adopted here but her adoptive fathers were killed by Esthar.
From now you know what happens.
Due to her special ability she was forced to leave the orphanage.
It was here that Galbadia take Elle as a hostage.
I was not referring to the part in which she yelled something and left.
I refer when she had to left the orphanage at her childhood.
Meanwhile Caraway buried Julia´s body in Dingo desert.
Using some sort of mechanism she was sucked into the prision while underground.
Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).
In fact,this stresses Julia´s importance in the game.

---

I truly have no idea how you came up with this theory of yours...
You just modified the whole story into your own version of FF8.
Just one little question...

http://www.eyesonff.com/ff8/characters.shtml

The link above show the characters' profile but what is most important is the AGE. Since Ellone = Rinoa so Rinoa should be older than Squall. How do you explain that they are the same age?

Believe-me,Caraway managed to make it look like they had different ages.
And I don´t changed the story.
I just filled the voids between different events.

It IS final "Fantasy" and all, but this is just going overboard....

so answer my question:

Where are you getting that Caraway killed Julia, and Deling brings her back to life?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Believe-me,Caraway managed to make it look like they had different ages.
And I don´t changed the story.
I just filled the voids between different events.

---

What do you mean manage to look like they have different age?
We all know Ellone is already running and kicking when Squall is in his mother's womb.

You are making like Caraway is the main villian and yet in the game he is so minor and pretty unimportant after Disc 1.And since he is so bad, why didn't Square indented him as a boss so that the heros can finish him off?

[QUOTE]
Location: #91


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

SUGESTIONon´t look for proofs for my theories.
Just read them and keep them on your head while you play FF8.As long as you play it many times and as long as you keep listening to my theories,light will be shed in your head.You will see gradually that I am right.In fact the theories are linked like a puzzle.
They can not be seen independently of the others.They are only pieces of a big puzzle.I managed to sligtly see the overal puzzle.But it would be difficult to believe the theories until you see the whole.The theories became more obvious the most you can see this whole.This can only be achieved as long as you keep listening to them and when you start to see how they relate to each other.I can not post all of them on a single post.It would take about a month or more.And millions of lines in the post.
Since this is a game not can be proved but of course there would be some theories which would made more sense than others.This is the farthest we can go in.We can give different interpretations to the game
as long as we DON`T CONTRADICT THE EVENTS ON IT.
I am not saying I don´t make mistakes.Of course i can make.
And I don´t know everything about this whole puzzle.I need to research more to find.There were things I don´t understand yet.


You didn´t answer to this yet.This explains my philosophy on creating theories

And look,the president double was a monster that was possessed and changed it´s shape.
This is a plot hole.The game never explains how is it that a monster changes shape and helps the president.This is soo weird.This should be the matter of this topic.
I wonder how people didn´t discuss this.

This is strange even in a Fantasy game.


If a monster can do this why do we assume the president himself was not a monster?

And the general is physically equal to the president.He just looks more stronger and fatter..
If Ulti can possess Edea she can also possess a monster.

I personally believe they all were Shumi´s which evolved to monsters and then to these characters.




__________________

You still haven't answered my question, but instead posted more jibberish. The reason you haven't replied, is because its a LOAD OF CRAP, and you have no basis to prove it.

I'm pretty sure that the only people that Ultimecia can possess are other sorceress, like Edea, Adel, and Rinoa. NOT MONSTERS.

The president was not a monster. If he was, don't you think he would've fought back against Edea/ulti?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I personally believe they all were Shumi´s which evolved to monsters and then to these characters.

---

HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHAHAHA :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Now you've gone off the deep end.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

And look,the president double was a monster that was possessed and changed it´s shape.
This is a plot hole.The game never explains how is it that a monster changes shape and helps the president.This is soo weird.This should be the matter of this topic.
I wonder how people didn´t discuss this.

This is strange even in a Fantasy game.

---

It is quite obvious that the monster is a minion of the president as the president was expecting Rinoa and gang. Why I know?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Unknowns

It is based on common knowledge and logical analysis/assumption as I stated before.You dun need to see a hen lay egg to know that it will lay egg. One last idiot proof example:

It is told that Rinoa is a GIRL but there is no proof that she is a girl. So what if she looks like a girl? Must we strip her naked to proof she is a girl?

---

And Ultimecia can only posses sorceress and no one else, pls go read the story and if she can posses others, why didn't he go posses Squall?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I personally believe they all were Shumi´s which evolved to monsters and then to these characters

---

I personally dun think so.

Btw, what about the age thing?

Yet more theorys....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GooeyToast

Yet more theorys....

---

"Yet more bull[img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img]."


There. Fixed it for you.

Play nice, people.

There is a difference between a theory and making stuff up around the known story.

And for Caraway to meet Julia while she had a child, she would had to have had a child or have been knocked up when she met Laguna.

Next you'll tell us Laguna knocked her up and the whole Squall/Rinoa romance is an incest story.

I bet he will.

Rinoa is not Caraway nor Laguna´s daughter.

Quote:

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And Ultimecia can only posses sorceress and no one else, pls go read the story and if she can posses others, why didn't he go posses Squall?

---

What do you think she was gonna do to him at the prision?To possess him and the others.Of course she needs first to exploit Squall´s mind to see if he has already forgotten everything about his childhood.She uses a machine who sends electrical currents through his body scanning his mind and registering it on a tv set and a guard to force him to look for it on his memory.
Caraway rescue Rinoa to prevent her from using her ability on them.But she already has.Edea thinks she sends them to their childhood.
Elle send Zell to Ward´s body so he was able to get them out of there.
Edea plans to scan the mind of the other characters too.
She would then announce the death of Seed(I think she wanna people to think Squall was dead.´That´s why she kill Squall at the parade and then revives him.) to the world.A sealing mechanism prevents people´s conscience to be inside our heros(through Elle´s power) and see what happens there.
Our heros would stay there and (already possessed ) many hundreds of years later they would rule over the Galbadia continent using Timber as their capital.That´s what Edea plans.But before that something horrible would be performed on them by Edea on the prision.

I'm sorry.. Now Caraway ISN'T a monster? I think you are getting confused over your own "theories" now.

EDIT: And I notice you didn't mention anything about the flaw I mentioned in your theory.

Its becoming increasingly clear that future esthars trying to wind you up by taking his own theories seriously. Hey, it seems to work. Dont get too bothered over it.

I read Future's "theory" threads for entertainment. They are all SO funny that I actually laugh out loud. :D Honestly, they're hilarious!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xaven

I read Future's "theory" threads for entertainment. They are all SO funny that I actually laugh out loud. :D Honestly, they're hilarious!

---

Indeed. It's how I pass the time here at work. :D

Were do I said he wasn´t a monster? Of course he is.And president Deling also.

Please don´t stop your work for my theories.That´s bad.Your work is more important.

Can´t reveal Rinoa´s father for now.It requires you to believe that the world of FF8 is already under time compression.

Nevermind I read that wrong. But, since when is Seifer's torturing of Squall scanning his mind? Edea was never even the room, nor was implied that she was even AT the prison.

And I do Tech Support. ALOT of time in front of a computer. My work isn't affected by this, believe me.

Edea wasn´t there but she planned this.Not even Seifer knows how the machine really works.The guard knows.That´s why he asks it to Squall and gives a discharge on him before he can even talk.
Seifer don´t know the SeeD thing was to test if Squall remembers something about his childhood.

AH yes.. More things that are never stated, that you have no proof of. Gotcha.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

What do you think she was gonna do to him at the prision?To possess him and the others.Of course she needs first to exploit Squall´s mind to see if he has already forgotten everything about his childhood.She uses a machine who sends electrical currents through his body scanning his mind and registering it on a tv set and a guard to force him to look for it on his memory

---

Here is some little info I got from the game script:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GAME SCRIPT

In order for Ultimecia to exist in this time, she must take over
ze body of a sorceress from ze present. But ze machine must have a
limit. Ultimecia probably needs to go back further in time to achieve
time compression. Only Ellone can take her back further into ze past.
Zat iz why she iz desperately seeking her. We must take advantage of
Ellone's power. There are 2 sorceresses in our time. Sorceress Rinoa
and Sorceress Adel. Of ze two, Adel has not awaken yet. Once
regeneration is completed, neither Laguna not I will be safe. Sorceress
Adel is probably in ze process of awakening inside of Lunatic Pandora.
Ultimecia will want to possess Adel

---

it is clearly stated that Ultimecia can only possess sorceress.SO what you say of trying to possess others isn't valid.
And what about the similar in age question I asked ages ago?

I already explained the age thing.
Edea ,Rinoa,Quistis,Selphie were sorceresses.This means they were female Propagators
(the True origin and nature of Sorceress).
Seifer,Squall,Zell and Irvine were True Knights.This means they were male Propagators(the True origin and nature of True Knights).
Ulti=Edea is a propagator and can possess propagators.
By the way,despite the fact Odine is a genious he is limited and not perfect.He can make mistakes.
Ulti=Edea was possessed by someone else (I used to call this person X).
I believe X can possess anyone as long as some conditions are met.I am humble enough to admit I don´t know what these conditions are.

Now all females are sorceresses and all males are knights? Dude, are you even trying now?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I already explained the age thing.
Edea ,Rinoa,Quistis,Selphie were sorceresses.This means they were female Propagators
(the True origin and nature of Sorceress).
Seifer,Squall,Zell and Irvine were True Knights.This means they were male Propagators(the True origin and nature of True Knights).
Ulti=Edea is a propagator and can possess propagators.
By the way,despite the fact Odine is a genious he is limited and not perfect.He can make mistakes.
Ulti=Edea was possessed by someone else (I used to call this person X).
I believe X can possess anyone as long as some conditions are met.I am humble enough to admit I don´t know what these conditions are.

---

Awesome....but since you refer that all of the girls have a same family line in your other thread so it make sense that all girls are sorceress , ya?

Also, all males are the girls' boyfriend as mentioned it your other thread so it make sense that they are their knights, ya?

So this mysterious "X" person is a mystery that you dun even know, ya?

So, talking about possess, which person everyone have in mind that do nothing but possess other,ya?

Well we have YU YEVON!!!! Since person "X" and FF X both have a "X" in their name. So Yu Yevon posses Ulti = Edea and started all this,ya?

And the heros start a pilgrimage to defeat Yu Yevon which is Ulti, right? So FF VIII and FFX is kinda related, ya?

So the girls who are sorceress = summoners
The guys who are knights = guardians

As for the conditions, simple! Yu Yevon can only posses aeons in FF X but in FF VIII, only sorceress got possessed. Not only that, Yu Yevon got defeated by SUMMONER in FF X, so he hold a grudge and developed a way to possess summoners which is sorceress. There is also a high possibily that Yu Yevon is actually HYNE!!! I am working on the theory now...

I am smart, ya? :D

Quote:

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Awesome....but since you refer that all of the girls have a same family line in your other thread so it make sense that all girls are sorceress , ya?

Also, all males are the girls' boyfriend as mentioned it your other thread so it make sense that they are their knights, ya?

---

Exactly.Good to know you start to see the linking between my theories.

Quote:

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So this mysterious "X" person is a mystery that you dun even know, ya?

---

No,I know who he/she is.But you aren´t prepared yet to receive this revelation.
You need to understand first what is happening in the world of FF8.

Quote:

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Well we have YU YEVON!!!! Since person "X" and FF X both have a "X" in their name. So Yu Yevon posses Ulti = Edea and started all this,ya?

And the heros start a pilgrimage to defeat Yu Yevon which is Ulti, right? So FF VIII and FFX is kinda related, ya?

So the girls who are sorceress = summoners
The guys who are knights = guardians

As for the conditions, simple! Yu Yevon can only posses aeons in FF X but in FF VIII, only sorceress got possessed. Not only that, Yu Yevon got defeated by SUMMONER in FF X, so he hold a grudge and developed a way to possess summoners which is sorceress. There is also a high possibily that Yu Yevon is actually HYNE!!! I am working on the theory now...

I am smart, ya?

---

X is just a codename I give.It isn´t related to FFX in anyway.
It´s interesting to see how the games were related though I never played FFX.

I doubt there is a sole person who believes you "theories", so make the big reveal. Who is the mysterious "X"?

One more reason not to reveal.

I can see there is much linkage of FF8 and FF X after being "enlighten" by Future's Theories.

Hyne is the almighty god of FF 8 and the first sorceress.
Yu Yevon is the "god" of FF X and the leader of summoners.

People in FF 8 originated from the Centra civilization except for the Estharians. So that make two major civilizations in the game, Centra and Esthar but Centra was destroyed.

In FF X, Zanarkand and Bevelle was the two major civilizations and Zanarkand was destroyed.

In FF 8, Esthar speciallized in machine and technology while it is a mystery of what the Centra people specialized in.

In FF X, Bevelle specialized in machine and technology while Zanarkand their precious summoners.

Mysterious points known as "draw points" is seen popping out of the ground in FF 8 which is much believe is the point that lead to the spirit energies of the farplane in FF X.

A deep sea research center is built in the middle of nowhere to dig deep in the ground for research purposes. I believe they are digging for the passageway to the farplane.

So I assume Zanarkand is actually Centra!!! :D After Yuna save the world the second time, people begin inhabited and rebuild Zanarkand.
And Bevelle move on with its technology until the Lunar cry which wipe out the Centra. Also, Besaid island might just be Balamb.

We were told that Yu Yevon is an immortal and won't kick the bucket that easily so I assume Yu Yevon live on for centuries bidding his time. As time goes by, people will forget about Yu Yevon so he resurfaced as Hyne. Yu Yevon also know as Hyne pass his power to other sorceress and those that receive his powers is under his mercy. :)

Sorceress that receive his powers is condemned by those around her and in anger, sorceress unleash their wrath upon humans. When sorceress is upon the blink of death, they pass their powers to other sorceress and continued their terror. :eek:

See the link? This is like Spira's "Spiral of Death" and the sorceress is just other Sin used by Yevon/Hyne. :D

After getting to heard of Ellone/Rinoa, Yevon came up with a even evilier plot than the old school "Spiral of Death" which is time compression. So he picked on a suitable candidate which hold his powers to do the job which happen to be Edea\Uli\Julia. That explain why Uti\Edea\Julia can only possess sorceress. :D

So, "X" = Hyne/Yevon.

What an ingenious story...I mean theory I have. :p

LOL, Unknowns.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

One more reason not to reveal.

---

Just do it, already.

Future, before you come back in here saying how Unknowns' Post is utter bull[img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img], keep in mind that she has as much backing her mockery of you as you've got backing your perversion of the actual storyline of Final Fantasy VIII.

Your "theories" are totally baseless. You don't "fill in the gaps" in a bloody story, dude. The writer tells you what's there and anything that steps outside the realm of reasonable assumption (anything not directly supported by the game or real world logic) is not a fact and is not even open for consideration as a fact, yet you are touting this [img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img] as fact.

Future esthar that is all total BULL[img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img][img]/xxx.gif[/img] man they make no sense at all.


this is just random nonsense

I can't believe I just read all that... and, I don't understand any of it.

I'm not confused or anything... I just couldn't take any of it in.. xD :D

you're not alone shauna

Please watch the fine line between discussing theories and spreading rumors, and also that between poking holes in a member's theory and belittling them.

FE, if you have additional info you wish to present, just come out with it. Holding it back just to irritate the other members will just get you into trouble.

Quote:

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Future esthar that is all total BULL man they make no sense at all.


this is just random nonsense

---

No it isn´t.Why do you just say it´s nonsense and don´t even try to argue the points in it.
That way you can´t show me they were nonsense.
No one was even able to show it was nonsense.You just say it.They were unproved but not necessarily nonsense.I challenge you to argue and show me wrong.

Quote:

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Open up your eyes for God's sake. Damn.

---

You are the close minded one because you can not see behiond the game.
So open up your eyes for God´s sake.
You belong to a class of members which I call "Whatever members"
Whatever members never forms a theory on FF8.And they always hate when you do.It din´t matter if a theory mades more or less sense.
They always find an excuse to debunk their theories.

Can I just point out that the person doing these Theorys (Future Esthar) is the SAME person who thought that the Junction Machine Ellone was on the MD level just because he descided to change ONE leter in the Password for Ragnorok?

Quote:

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Can I just point out that the person doing these Theorys (Future Esthar) is the SAME person who thought that the Junction Machine Ellone was on the MD level just because he descided to change ONE leter in the Password for Ragnorok?

---

I never said that.I just found it interesting that the two words were on the same code.

Quote:

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and also that between poking holes in a member's theory and belittling them.

---

Forget my bad English but what do you mean with that?

Ok, whatever it is, I pretty sure of my FF8 and FFX linkage and strongly believe "X" is Yu Yevon\Hyne and I am based on a theory I have before just like how Future determined the "TRUTH" of FF8 based on his theory.

So,now "X" is Yu Yevon/Hyne, everyone agree? :D


Since I have already covered the missing loophole, do Future have any more to add?

He only adds more when people find a hole in the plot of his theories.

Frankly, Unknown's theory of FFVIII and FFX being linked is much more knowlegable and based on actual things occuring in the game. Even if he didn't, Future Esthar's theories look like he made them up on the spot.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xaven

Frankly, Unknowns theory of FFVIII and FFX being linked is much more knowlegable and based on actual things occuring in the game.

---

Someone did agree. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Xaven

Even if he didn't, Future Esthar's theories look like he made them up on the spot

---

No, I pretty sure. Go see his previous posts on this forum and you will understand.
He have all this theories up in almost a year before this.

(For your info, I read a lot of his previous posts which is truly inspire you to think that FF 8 is more than its meet the eyes...or through his eyes that is...)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Forget my bad English but what do you mean with that?

---

It wasn't directed at you so you don't have to worry. It means discuss the theories and not the member posting them.

I don´t made them on the spot.
They were the work of many years playing FF8(I have it since November 1999 and play it yet.)
By the way,Unknows,are you being sarcastic or you really believe that theory?.I became convinced that you believe.
Do you think Hyne is the possessor of Ulti?Man,that Hyne thing is a little odd.I have read his story.It says his body split in two and all that.
Do you really believe that odd Hyne possessed Ulti?I really think so.
I really believe we had already saw Thedascabar in the game.
(Or whatever is the name it is given to the guy who proved to the Zebaldas that Hyne was corrupt).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

By the way,Unknows,are you being sarcastic or you really believe that theory?.

---

Whether I believe or not is solely up to you to decide or whether I believe or not is not the objective since my theory is not a stand alone theory but something to reinforce your theory. Feel free to argue my points if you disagree.... I mean points of my theory :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Do you think Hyne is the possessor of Ulti?Man,that Hyne thing is a little odd.I have read his story.It says his body split in two and all that.
Do you really believe that odd Hyne possessed Ulti?I really think so.

---

Here is a little info about Hyne:

Quote:

---

He created Homo Sapiens(humans) and then went to sleep.The Homo Sapiens soon rebelled against him. Hyne is said to have begun to lose the war with the Homo Sapiens who rebelled against him, and offered up half of his body to them along with his powers as a peace offering. However, he had tricked them and offered up a powerless skin of himself, taking his power with him in his escape.

It may very well be that Hyne escaped death at the hands of the Light Warriors and eventually gave up his powers unto some Homo Sapien Females. While Hyne is regarded as the creator of Homo Sapiens, the legend still retains information suggestive of him having been an asshole and that People rose up against him.

The legend goes that the Great Hyne created people. The sorceresses were given a fragment of Hyne's own power. It's hard to determine how many sorceresses exist today, for many keep their powers concealed. However, it is believed that they avoid spreading their power too thin.

---

Yu Yevon is the supreme god of the Yevonites and creator of dream Zanarkand. Almost everyone in FFX is a yevonite and worship Yevon like he is their "creator".Yuna and friends, all yevonites except for tidus which is Yevon's creation rose up again him. :D

Yevon lost and dissappeared into thin air but as told ,Yevon is immortal, not a mere unsent, so it might like he escaped. :D

From the game, we know the Yu Yevon is a complete a**h**** after the truth is revealed. To avoid being pursue, Yevon passed his powers to some random female summoner. :D

The summoner get a fragment of his dark powers and pass on until the time of summoner is forgotten and came the Sorceress. :D

All sorceress have Yevon's(which is known as Hyne through the passing of time) power and is practically Yevon's pawn. :D

So Yevon/Hyne can just pick any sorceress to do his dirty job. :love:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I really believe we had already saw Thedascabar in the game.
(Or whatever is the name it is given to the guy who proved to the Zebaldas that Hyne was corrupt).

---

I have no idea what you are talking about....

I am talking about the story the White Seed woman tell to the children when Squall gets onboard their ship.I believe Vascaroon represents Laguna Loire(it´s not Thedascar but Vascaroon.I played it now).
And it´s Zebalgas,not Zebaldas.

Future,

Do YOU even look for proof of your theories? You haven't backed not one crazy theory with real proof yet. So you must be just hauling them out of thin air.

Jeepers, can't you even sense the sarcasm in Unknowns posts? She's making up some crazy ideas, which really have no basis. Which is exactly what you're doing.

Like I said before, I'd go through all your posts, and show you how their wrong, but I'd literally have to critic EVERY sentence you've typed. I just don't have the time to do that.

People have argued the Rinoa = Ulti theory for ages (not going to open up that can of worms, however). That's because there are some points that may be able to prove it, and some points that contradict it. There are other theories that can be argued.

You, however, still haven't proved any of your points. You've come up with things like Caraway Killed Julia, everyone evolved from Shumis, Edea (Ulti) was scanning Squall's memory while he was being tortured, etc, things that have NO basis whatsoever in the game.

So are you going to even to attempt to prove your theory at all, before finishing it? All we've heard so far is a thread full of statements that in no way can be proven.

So I am asking you......CAN you prove anything at all? An answer will be appreciated :) .

Quote:

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Originally Posted by THE LEGEND OF VASCAROON

Once upon a time there was a person named Hyne. Hyne was the ruler of the world. He became lazy and decided to make a tool to make his life easier. Hyne made a neat tool. His tool could make more tools by itself. Soon there were a lot of tools in the world. These tools were actually people.

When Hyne woke up, he was surprised because there were a lot of people. Hyne wanted to reduce the number of people, and used magic to burn up a lot of small people. The small people were children. The people cherished the children very much. So the people rebelled against Hyne. Hyne used powerful magic to fight them. The people couldn't use magic, but they had wisdom.

Eventually, Hyne began to lose the war, because there were too many people to fight, and they were getting smarter. Therefore, he decided to make peace with people by offering them half of his body along with his powers. Hyne cut his body in half and gave the people half as he promised.

Then, another war started. People began to fight over the power Hyne offered them through his body. This war lasted decades. Finally, King Zebalga and the Zebalga tribe emerged victorious and demanded Hyne's body-half to get its pwers. But the body ignored their commands.

Then, Vascaroon came to the rescue. He appeared before the confused Zebalgas and revealed to them that Hyne's half-body was corrupt and possessed no real power. The body-half was actually Hyne's castoff skin. The Zebalgas were angered by this truth, and decided to destroy Hyne. The Zebalgas never found Hyne. People began to call him "Hyne the Magician" and continued to hunt him for centuries to come.


And that is the Legend of Vascaroon. I know it seems kinda hokey, but I just put here what I saw people. I hope this helps.

---

It is more or less as the info on Hyne I posted earlier. As for the war, it can be easily linked to FF X-2 of the different factions fighting with each other as the ruler of Spira. As for Vascaroon is mostly our heroines in FFX-2 who came to tell them how meaningless is to fight.

Btw, I feel pretty pointless of the "Legend of Vascaroon" as it didn't held any purposes in my theory. My theory is Hyne = Yevon and the second part of the story Hyne didn't play any role and it is mainly about internal dispute about the people.

Look at the first info I post on Hyne, it revealed most stuff about Hyne and didn't talk about unimportant or non theory related stuff like Vascaroon or Zebalga which didn't play any significant role in my theory.

Sorry if I double posted but I feel like this should be in a different post as it is a totally seperated issue from my previous post and also not to confuse others.

I went through the whole thread clearly and came up with some unanswered questions from myself and others. Pls try to answer them with concrete proof and logical explaination.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

In the beggining of the game Ellone tries to find her lover Squall.She wanna to see shooting stars with him at the flower field

---

How do you know that?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

And no,Rinoa´s appearance is not equal to Ellone´s

---

This is what was stated earlier.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

What I am saying is that if you look at each splitting (without considering the clothes) you will see they are equal to the picture of Ellone. It´s not only the "short hair".Everything is equal

---

This is what was stated later. Now you say Rinoa's appearance is equal to Ellone. Please explain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Anarchy Angel

Grr, for goodness sakes! It isn't a desert becasue there is no sand, right, just cracked ground? But what we also have to remember is that time compression is still around, so it could just be a random place conjoured up by the last magic that exploded with Ultimecia. Personally, i think it just looks like the dried up dead looking flower field

---

Agree completely.It was burned by Galbadian Soldiers, flooded by water,suffer ice catastrophes and used by ancient Estharians to construct a small village.

---

Where do you get the idea that is was burned by Galbadian and suffered so much crap and finally some Estharians came along to build a small village?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

One can see that "Machine Ellone" was created to IMITATE Rinoa.

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This make "sense" since you say Rinoa is real ellone so Junction machine Ellone is used to imitate Rinoa but it was in game it imitate her POWER and not....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

the machine was created to imitate even her physical appearance.It was transformed at her image to deceive and confuse people.Not even Doc Odine recognizes it.

---

But since Dr Odine make the machine he didn't state his machine can do this and also if he is the creator of the machine, it make no sense that he can't recognize his own creation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Basically after the real Ellone get to the White Seed ship somehow a battle begins and Elle was taken hostage by Galbadia.Edea was at the ship and (already possessed) manage to give Ellone to Galbadia.
She was adopted by Caraway who changed her name to Rinoa.

---

Edea is the one that send Ellone to the ship and after the battle that you claim she give her to Galbadia? So why didn't she give her to Galbadia straightaway instead of sending her to a ship?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

General Caraway is in fact a monster(maybe gerogero) who change it´s appearance after being possessed.

---

How do you get this idea? And so "X"(YEVON/HYNE) possessed Edea and Caraway at the same time?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

The general somehow obtained the machine and give it to the White Seed in Ellone´s place.

---

What do you mean by somehow? Dr Odine created the machine and it is in Esthar. And also, what make you think the White SeeD will believe that the general who took away Ellone the first time now give her back just like that? Dun you think the White SeeD will suspect something?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

But Watt´s and Zone managed to free Rinoa.

---

Why will two random person pop up in the General's mansion and free Rinoa?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Fishermans Horizon-The sorceress wanna to scare the citizens so that they hate you and you are forced to leave the city.That way she prevents you to reach the future and at the same time she keeps the citizens in complete ignorance about what happens in the outside world.

---

What have reaching the future got to do with Fisherman Horizon?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

The sorceress orders Raijin and Fujin to stay at the hotel.That way,the sorceress prevents Elone from sending the conscience of the citizens to the "orphanage" time.She also order the soldiers to knock out people if they sleep

---

Is a hotel only place in the world you can sleep? How about a nice comfy bench?
Is there proof to prove no one can't sleep in Balamb during that time?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

However Ellone somehow(I don´t understand how up to this day) enable the soldiers at the station to the past.One of them see the flower field and the other was in the body of his grandma

---

How do you know they see the flower field and grandma thingy when you dun understand?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Rinoa meets Caraway at her childhood.
But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill

---

You say Caraway caught Ellone/Rinoa in the White SeeD ship earlier and now you say Rinoa meet Caraway at childhood? So if he already capture Rinoa before the White SeeD ship incident why did he release her to Winhill only to recapture her again?

IMPT NOTE: Ellone is first at Winhill then to orphanage then to the White SeeD ship.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Meanwhile Caraway buried Julia´s body in Dingo desert

---

Why Dingo desert? not anywhere else?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Using some sort of mechanism she was sucked into the prision while underground.
Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).

---

Why did they suck her and what soft of magic can bring someone to life? Why didn't anyone use it to bring Raine or the Unknown King to life or the president himself back to life?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I personally believe they all were Shumi´s which evolved to monsters and then to these characters

---

Is this just a personal comments or you have a some backing behind this theory? if not, pls dun confuse others with this kind of comments.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Edea ,Rinoa,Quistis,Selphie were sorceresses.This means they were female Propagators
(the True origin and nature of Sorceress).
Seifer,Squall,Zell and Irvine were True Knights.This means they were male Propagators(the True origin and nature of True Knights).
Ulti=Edea is a propagator and can possess propagators

---

Why are they propagator? (And why aren't they PuPu instead? he is so CUTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!)

You also stated that the characters evolve from Shumi and now they are propagator? So Shumi evolve into propagator? It doesn't make sense. Pls kindly explain.

I will continue on with his other thread next time. ;)

Well Furutre - i think you are making great progress here. It is a great theory and one that should be explored. I see you are taking a ton of heat and people may be disproving some things but then you try to like it back into the theory. That is awsome work imo. Sure it is just a theory, but imo ripping apart the game and every little detail only makes it greater.

I commend you on a job well done - granted it was hard to take in with all the rude posts and such, but you nearly kept your cool and got it all out. I would persoanlly like to hear of this X person (forgive me if you did reveail it).

I am glad to see that this Final Fantasy actually made us think more.
I do have to admit that the theory does have merit, and you have nearly sold me on it as being a plausable theory.

Before i get heat for saying that, let me jsut remind you that small minute details in a game, often say more than naming and enemy Bad Guy. These details are part of what brings the game to life and make us think. Final Fantasy VIII was very enjoyable and i think it left a lot more room for the imagination than did other final fantasies.

I do stick merit into the fact that the girls may have been sorceresses. Its not like square to make a huge deal over the heros all being friends when they grew up. That is just lazy and very sitcom - not final fantasy. There had to me a lot more to it than that.

Keep up the good work! And thanks to all posters for letting me observe your behaviors! so i know what to expect from whom ;)

Bipper GOES!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

I commend you on a job well done

---

You have got to be kidding me.

Yes, he has guts, but none of his theories in this thread make sense. At all. I'm not being rude, just honest.

I don't know what everyone is talking about now, but this is about the first couple of posts. In the opening FMV when it shows the different places (starting with a beach and ending at the flower field), on the way there, it shows that dry ground that squall is on at the end. Just thought I'd point that out, so make of it what you will. And if this has already been said.....well.....I don't have time to read every post.

Maaaaany thanks,Bipper.It´s good to know someone hear me out with open minds.
Those are always looking for proofs like that´s really possible in this game(Which isn´t.One can not even proof Laguna and Raine were Squall´s fathers nor R=U).

Quote:

---

Before i get heat for saying that, let me jsut remind you that small minute details in a game, often say more than naming and enemy Bad Guy. These details are part of what brings the game to life and make us think. Final Fantasy VIII was very enjoyable and i think it left a lot more room for the imagination than did other final fantasies.

I do stick merit into the fact that the girls may have been sorceresses. Its not like square to make a huge deal over the heros all being friends when they grew up. That is just lazy and very sitcom - not final fantasy. There had to me a lot more to it than that.

---

That´s why this is my preferred game.Even though the story of FF7 seems better than 8´s at first glance when we think about it deep we will find secret´s about it´s storyline that show 8 is better.
Of course I know one cannot debate people´s preferences.Everyone is free.

Quote:

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I would persoanlly like to hear of this X person (forgive me if you did reveail it).

---

I granted you will be the first.
As you said,minute details are better than other things to find evidence for theories.
One can tell who is X by looking at a very single detail about him.A little detail no one noticed yet.Just looking at this denounce the person.
I will show it to you through a series of images.You will have to guess.
I am gonna play the game now to make them.
Had no patience to discuss Unknows posts now.
Maybe tomorrow(or later at night).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

One can not even proof Laguna and Raine were Squall´s fathers...

---

Yes, we kind of can. It's called "Assuming the writer knew what he was doing when he wrote the story."


By the way, does anyone else find it a little... oh, I don't know... suspicious... that this "Bipper" person has a join date of yesterday... and is obviously not someone that is paying attention to the story of the game, either?

I don't know... I've got to say it's a little suspicious. Not that I'm hinting at anything. Obviously not.

You can read posts even before you register.At least he knows about the sorceress girls thingy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
Originally Posted by The Anarchy Angel :
Grr, for goodness sakes! It isn't a desert becasue there is no sand, right, just cracked ground? But what we also have to remember is that time compression is still around, so it could just be a random place conjoured up by the last magic that exploded with Ultimecia. Personally, i think it just looks like the dried up dead looking flower field
Agree completely.It was burned by Galbadian Soldiers, flooded by water,suffer ice catastrophes and used by ancient Estharians to construct a small village.


Where do you get the idea that is was burned by Galbadian and suffered so much crap and finally some Estharians came along to build a small village?

---

This theory is based on another theory of mine which is based on another theory.
You have to be patient to see how my theories were linked between them.I will prove strong theories with weak theories.Eventually you will understand this one.

Quote:

---

the machine was created to imitate even her physical appearance.It was transformed at her image to deceive and confuse people.Not even Doc Odine recognizes it.


But since Dr Odine make the machine he didn't state his machine can do this and also if he is the creator of the machine, it make no sense that he can't recognize his own creation.

---

It was Caraway who changed the machine´s appearance to look like Ellone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
Basically after the real Ellone get to the White Seed ship somehow a battle begins and Elle was taken hostage by Galbadia.Edea was at the ship and (already possessed) manage to give Ellone to Galbadia.
She was adopted by Caraway who changed her name to Rinoa.


Edea is the one that send Ellone to the ship and after the battle that you claim she give her to Galbadia? So why didn't she give her to Galbadia straightaway instead of sending her to a ship?

---

As you heard Edea and Caraway were both possessed by X.
Edea just guided the ship and that way she were able to perform her plans.X wanna to deliver Elle to Caraway without people knowing Edea was possessed.Hence the plan.
Galbadians had the tecnology to made the locking sealing room at Caraways mansion and to change JME´s appearance .Edea not.

Quote:

---

The general somehow obtained the machine and give it to the White Seed in Ellone´s place.


What do you mean by somehow? Dr Odine created the machine and it is in Esthar. And also, what make you think the White SeeD will believe that the general who took away Ellone the first time now give her back just like that? Dun you think the White SeeD will suspect something?

---

The general don´t give it.He places ME in Ellone´s place to confuse them when they save her.
It´s like if Bowser creates a machine that imitates Daisy´s appearance and hides the true one somewhere on the castle.When Super Mario goes to SAVE her he will SAVE a machine without knowing it(And Daisy will still be arrested after that).

Quote:

---

But Watt´s and Zone managed to free Rinoa.


Why will two random person pop up in the General's mansion and free Rinoa?

---

Let me help you to guess.
The Watts and Zone we see in the game were not the true ones.
After Watt´s and Zone´s fathers died they were adopted by the woman who lives near Timber maniacs.These guys then tooked their place.This undercover can not be break.They knows Deling´s real plans unlike Zone and Watt´s fathers.But their true identity can not be revealed to Deling.That would be very bad.
So,who were they?

Hint1:Zone has pains on his stomach too much times isn´t ?I really believe this is used to undercover another deficiency of him.
Hint2:Zone dresses blue.Watts dresses a bandage on his head.
Hint3:They imitate Galbadian Soldiers too well don´t they?The Galbadians can´t really tell the difference.
Hint4:Who do you think would risk his life to save Ellone?
(this one answers your question).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
The sorceress orders Raijin and Fujin to stay at the hotel.That way,the sorceress prevents Elone from sending the conscience of the citizens to the "orphanage" time.She also order the soldiers to knock out people if they sleep


Is a hotel only place in the world you can sleep? How about a nice comfy bench?
Is there proof to prove no one can't sleep in Balamb during that time?

---

I had to research more about this.
I believe the sorceress don´t wanna people to see the orphanage time.
But maybe she is just worried with events happening on the bedroom or the "main" room of Edea´s house.She is not worried with events that happened at the beach or the flower field.
And maybe X knows Ellone would perform her ability at middle day when no one sleeps.
And neither the sorceress nor Raijin nor Fujin nor Seifer knows that Squall and company would be able to enter the city.They weren´t supposed to.She plans not to let them in.And how can she guess that Zell would purposely go to his room to sleep.I really believe Zell knows about the sorceress true plan and purposedly go to his room to rest.It was unpredictable because she knows Zell would never do that.His room is sacred to him and he don´t wanna you in.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
However Ellone somehow(I don´t understand how up to this day) enable the soldiers at the station to the past.One of them see the flower field and the other was in the body of his grandma


How do you know they see the flower field and grandma thingy when you dun understand?

---

It appears on the game.

Quote:

---

How do you know they see the flower field and grandma thingy when you dun understand?


Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
Rinoa meets Caraway at her childhood.
But Caraway "Killed" Julia and sent Elle to Winhill


You say Caraway caught Ellone/Rinoa in the White SeeD ship earlier and now you say Rinoa meet Caraway at childhood? So if he already capture Rinoa before the White SeeD ship incident why did he release her to Winhill only to recapture her again?

IMPT NOTE: Ellone is first at Winhill then to orphanage then to the White SeeD ship.

---

It goes like this:
Julia marries Caraway and he takes care of Ellone along with Julia.
Caraway "kills" Julia and sent Ellone to Winhill.
READ THIS:
X needs Odine´s genius brain to research Ellone´s mind.He is the one who knows more about these things.
So X possess Adel to go to Winhill to look for Ellone.
To easy Adel´s task,X possess a monster which becomes General Caraway.This monster is interested in Ellone so he approaches Julia.X also wanna to transform Julia into sorceress Edea.That´s about it.
Laguna saves Elle and sent her to the orphanage(Sorceress Edea goes there meanwhile).
Elle is sent to a ship due to her powers.
Edea guides this Ship.
Then the Galb´s take Elle hostage.
Elle meets with Caraway again and is locked in his house long time.
Since Odine had already researched her X only needs to seal her powers forever.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
Using some sort of mechanism she was sucked into the prision while underground.
Deling bring her to life using some magic and then she became....(try to guess).


Why did they suck her and what soft of magic can bring someone to life? Why didn't anyone use it to bring Raine or the Unknown King to life or the president himself back to life?

---

Maybe she was not even killed.It was Media manipulation.
She probably was on a sleeping state like Rinoa.
She need to be sent to prision because this is a facility witch has the technology to transform Julia into Edea.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar:
Edea ,Rinoa,Quistis,Selphie were sorceresses.This means they were female Propagators
(the True origin and nature of Sorceress).
Seifer,Squall,Zell and Irvine were True Knights.This means they were male Propagators(the True origin and nature of True Knights).
Ulti=Edea is a propagator and can possess propagators


Why are they propagator? (And why aren't they PuPu instead? he is so CUTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!)

You also stated that the characters evolve from Shumi and now they are propagator? So Shumi evolve into propagator? It doesn't make sense. Pls kindly explain.

---

I didn´t said that Shumis evolved to the characters.I said that they evolved to monsters and then to Deling and Caraway.

I argued on another thread that we can see how Edea looks like a Propagator on the 3rd disc.
Also,there were 8 Propagators distributed in 4 pairs.
These characters were 8 and can be distributed on 4 man-women pairs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bipper

Sure it is just a theory, but imo ripping apart the game and every little detail only makes it greater.

---

Actually, I prefer to enjoy the story as shown.. Obsession does not sound like an enjoyable time to me. Anyway, the point is.. Most of his theory has no merit with the actual details of the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Squall of SeeD

By the way, does anyone else find it a little... oh, I don't know... suspicious... that this "Bipper" person has a join date of yesterday... and is obviously not someone that is paying attention to the story of the game, either?

I don't know... I've got to say it's a little suspicious. Not that I'm hinting at anything. Obviously not.

---

Quoted for.. Hell, it all just seems really off.

How can I made my signature pictures appear little?

Change the size in a picture editting program.. And this has nothing to do with the topic on hand.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

This theory is based on another theory of mine which is based on another theory.
You have to be patient to see how my theories were linked between them.I will prove strong theories with weak theories.Eventually you will understand this one.

---

What in the world of Yevon, this is not answering, this is just playing with words to show that you have answer but you didn't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It was Caraway who changed the machine´s appearance to look like Ellone.

---

From the game, we know that not many can understand Esthar's technology so meaning not many can even understand the use of the machine not to mentioning changing it. And also, the machine is ONLY avaliable in the FUTURE.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dr Odine

It may only be a toy
right now, but in ze time of Ultimecia, it iz an impressive working
machine! Which means there iz a machine which imitates Ellone's power.
It iz I who made ze first model of zat machine. I named ze machine
'Junction Machine Ellone'! It iz a vonderful thing to know that my
invention is used in ze future!

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

As you heard Edea and Caraway were both possessed by X.
Edea just guided the ship and that way she were able to perform her plans.X wanna to deliver Elle to Caraway without people knowing Edea was possessed.Hence the plan.
Galbadians had the tecnology to made the locking sealing room at Caraways mansion and to change JME´s appearance .Edea not.

---

Like I say, she can just secretly send her to Caraway, what is the point of making up the White SeeD and the fight?

How in the world do you know Galbadians had the technology when a 3 year old can see that from the game that Esthar is far more advance than Galbadians and since Dr Odine is the one that make the machine, only Odine himself understand the machine. So not any Tom, Dick or Harry can modifiy the machine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

The general don´t give it.He places ME in Ellone´s place to confuse them when they save her.It´s like if Bowser creates a machine that imitates Daisy´s appearance and hides the true one somewhere on the castle.When Super Mario goes to SAVE her he will SAVE a machine without knowing it(And Daisy will still be arrested after that).

---

You still dun get it? HOW DO CARAWAY OBTAIN THE MACHINE WHEN IT IS IN ESTHAR AND BEING LOCKED IN ODINE LAB? And if Caraway stole it, Dr Odine will have realize it stolen, but why didn't he make a big fuss about it when he was talking about the machine. Also, there is no telling in the game that the machine is stolen so you are just saying this base on your imagination.

White SeeD didn't go SAVE machine Ellone but you say the general GAVE the machine back to white SeeD. So back to the original question, dun you think a person with an average IQ will suspect something fishy?

Quote:

---

Let me help you to guess.
The Watts and Zone we see in the game were not the true ones.
After Watt´s and Zone´s fathers died they were adopted by the woman who lives near Timber maniacs.These guys then tooked their place.This undercover can not be break.They knows Deling´s real plans unlike Zone and Watt´s fathers.But their true identity can not be revealed to Deling.That would be very bad.
So,who were they?

---

How did you get the idea of being adopted by the woman in Timber maniacs? Like I say in my previous posts, Pls explain with CONCERTE PROOF AND LOGICAL EXPLANATION.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Hint1:Zone has pains on his stomach too much times isn´t ?I really believe this is used to undercover another deficiency of him.

---

And I believe Zone is actually Kefka...PROVE IT!!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Hint2:Zone dresses blue.Watts dresses a bandage on his head.

---

Cyan dress blue and Locke wear a bandage on his head. So, they are RELATED too???

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Hint3:They imitate Galbadian Soldiers too well don´t they?The Galbadians can´t really tell the difference.

---

Anyone can imitate that WELL when almost your WHOLE BODY is covered with armour and no one can see your face and all you have to do is "no sir" and "yes sir". So when Selphie and gang went to the missile base and go undercover as Galbadian Soldiers, didn't they do as well as Zone and Watts? So are you saying those that imitate Galbadian Soldiers are inter-related by the stars in the galaxy?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Hint4:Who do you think would risk his life to save Ellone?
(this one answers your question).

---

Let me guess, Cloud!!! No,,,Sephiroth...nah...arghhh....this is mind blowing. I know!!!! Kuja!!!!! Kuja wanna take a bride!! And no, they aren't Laguna nor Wards, not by the way you prove in with THAT kind of evidence...and is Laguna only one in the game allow to wear blue and Ward only one that can wear bandage? So later you will be saying whoever that have brown hair is Squall?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I had to research more about this.
I believe the sorceress don´t wanna people to see the orphanage time.
But maybe she is just worried with events happening on the bedroom or the "main" room of Edea´s house.She is not worried with events that happened at the beach or the flower field.
And maybe X knows Ellone would perform her ability at middle day when no one sleeps.
And neither the sorceress nor Raijin nor Fujin nor Seifer knows that Squall and company would be able to enter the city.They weren´t supposed to.She plans not to let them in.And how can she guess that Zell would purposely go to his room to sleep.I really believe Zell knows about the sorceress true plan and purposedly go to his room to rest.It was unpredictable because she knows Zell would never do that.His room is sacred to him and he don´t wanna you in.

---

You still didn't answer the question but came up with a new question, why do you BELIEVE Zell know Edea's plan? Pls explain with logic and concrete proof.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It appears on the game.

---

Oh ya? so how do the SOLDIERS SEE THE FLOWER FIELD AND GET INTO THE BODY OF WHOEVER GRANDMA and no i didn't see any soldiers of having image of seeing flower field and get into body of his Grandma.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It goes like this:
Julia marries Caraway and he takes care of Ellone along with Julia.
Caraway "kills" Julia and sent Ellone to Winhill.
READ THIS:
X needs Odine´s genius brain to research Ellone´s mind.He is the one who knows more about these things.
So X possess Adel to go to Winhill to look for Ellone.
To easy Adel´s task,X possess a monster which becomes General Caraway.This monster is interested in Ellone so he approaches Julia.X also wanna to transform Julia into sorceress Edea.That´s about it.
Laguna saves Elle and sent her to the orphanage(Sorceress Edea goes there meanwhile).
Elle is sent to a ship due to her powers.
Edea guides this Ship.
Then the Galb´s take Elle hostage.
Elle meets with Caraway again and is locked in his house long time.
Since Odine had already researched her X only needs to seal her powers forever.

---

You still didn't quite answer the question, why do Caraway send her to Winhill when he already capture her. And if he send her to Winhill only to capture by Adel, why didn't he just send her to Esthar straight away?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Maybe she was not even killed.It was Media manipulation.
She probably was on a sleeping state like Rinoa.
She need to be sent to prision because this is a facility witch has the technology to transform Julia into Edea.

---

Now you say she MAYBE isn't killed????? You just keep changing your theory here and there by "I believe" or all this stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I didn´t said that Shumis evolved to the characters.I said that they evolved to monsters and then to Deling and Caraway.

---

Shumi evolve to monsters so now shumi is a MONSTER. MONSTER cannot evolve, only Shumi evolve. so monster cannot evolve into Deling or Caraway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I argued on another thread that we can see how Edea looks like a Propagator on the 3rd disc.
Also,there were 8 Propagators distributed in 4 pairs.
These characters were 8 and can be distributed on 4 man-women pairs.

---

And there is five main character in FF V meaning they are the Power Rangers? I dun see any link of your theory and the 8 propagators. And how do you know they have different sex? Pls Prove it.

And also:

What about the shooting star question?

What about the Rinoa appearance is not Ellone but you later say Rinoa appearance is Ellone?

Also, I have proved that "X" is actually Yevon/Hyne and FF VIII and FFX is inter related unless you have some backings that say it is not. :D

What shooting star question?
Let me explain this.Understand this one for all.
When Rinoa splits into many Rinoas these Rinoas were a younger Rinoa(hair grows you know?).These younger Rinoas looked like Ellone.Clear?
And X is not Hyne.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

In the beggining of the game Ellone tries to find her lover Squall.She wanna to see shooting stars with him at the flower field

---

This is what you say in one of your posts. So, how do you know that?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Rinoa´s appearance is not equal to Ellone´s

---

This is what was stated earlier.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

What I am saying is that if you look at each splitting (without considering the clothes) you will see they are equal to the picture of Ellone. It´s not only the "short hair".Everything is equal

---

This is what was stated later. Now you say Rinoa's appearance is equal to Ellone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Let me explain this.Understand this one for all.
When Rinoa splits into many Rinoas these Rinoas were a younger Rinoa(hair grows you know?).These younger Rinoas looked like Ellone.Clear?

---

And this is what is stated later on. You say Rinoa's appearance is not Ellone and now you go back on your words. I notice you just keep changing stuff here and there by "I believe" and making riddles.

Here is some little info I got from the game script:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GAME SCRIPT

In order for Ultimecia to exist in this time, she must take over
ze body of a sorceress from ze present. But ze machine must have a
limit. Ultimecia probably needs to go back further in time to achieve
time compression. Only Ellone can take her back further into ze past.
Zat iz why she iz desperately seeking her. We must take advantage of
Ellone's power. There are 2 sorceresses in our time. Sorceress Rinoa
and Sorceress Adel. Of ze two, Adel has not awaken yet. Once
regeneration is completed, neither Laguna not I will be safe. Sorceress
Adel is probably in ze process of awakening inside of Lunatic Pandora.
Ultimecia will want to possess Adel

---

It is clearly stated that Ultimecia can only possess sorceress, so can you explain why since you make the statement(stated below) that Edea which is Ulti try to possess Squall.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Our heros would stay there and (already possessed ) many hundreds of years later they would rule over the Galbadia continent using Timber as their capital.That´s what Edea plans

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And if you want to say this...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Ulti=Edea is a propagator and can possess propagators.

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I am a human and Xaven(Sorry, if I keep using you as an example but your name is just so easy to remember and come in mind all the time. :D ) is also a human. Does that mean I can possess him?

And in the game it never suggest that Edea is a propagator or anything, you just based in on your own imagination. If you want to back up with the hand theory, you will have to first answer the questions that is post on your other thread. And lastly, what about the others, in what sense do they look like propagator?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Believe-me,Caraway managed to make it look like they had different ages.

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You say Caraway do something with the age and now you say...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

But weren´t them about the same age?
If this is true and Selphie is at its young,Edea should be at her´s 80´s
And Squall at its 60´s
And Quistis at her 40´s
Or something near that.
To explain this,let´s assume Julia is Edea.And Ulti is Julia(as i posted on another topic)
This means that Edea is...
Then she performs time compression.
But we know there is a time loop there in the end.
I will argue till the end on that topic in which i talk about time compression.
I will argue that TC was not supposed to end,that TC never happened at Lunatic Pandora and the first signal of time compression in Ulti´s time would be a geological catastrophe caused by the Lunar Cry in the continent.
The fact that TC ended was an ilusion from Ultimecia.
That big mess we see in the final battle was not Time Compression.Ulti deceived you well here.What smart she is.
Since the world of FF8 was already compressed it´s easy to see how do they have the same age.
Ulti even manipulated her own life in Galbadia (different state of present?)

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TIME COMPRESSION is the culprit. So what is there to do with Caraway?

And how do you prove X is not Hyne/Yevon?
Some points to add, do you notice that when Griever is defeated, he got turned into a small black ball which is pretty similar to Yu Yevon when he go around possessing Aeons. Yevon is just using the same trick again.

Finally, the name is UNKNOWNS and not UNKNOWS. I am taking this seriously. :mad2:

At the Final FMV what if when Rinoa finds Squall he is dead, then she would live in greif and insanity.Think of the similarities and opposites rinoa in the beginning is seen in a flurry of white flowers and is seen with white wings(a.k.a. angel wings) yet ultimecia too hass wings(a.k.a. hell's angel wings) that are black the hair is the same the appearance is way different except the eyes. think of adel she wasn't born like that she was possesed by an earlier sorceress or sorcerer like Hyne quote" Sorceress Rinoa...Hyne's descendent" she was torn bye insanity and changed, bodie and mind.............Just think about the possibilities then you'll understand

Rinoa is the child of Julia and Caraway they named that child Rinoa
Ellone was born before Caraway and Julia married
no offense but pay atention tho the third dream sequence and ask Kiros all options

Don't double post, please. --foa

Seriously. I think Future must take a few "Purple Butterfly" pills before he sits down to play FFVIII.

Hence, he hallucinates, and comes up with all these baseless, moronic theories.

That's my theory.

Yep, thats right - I was created only yesterday and there for have no idea about anything to do with final fantasy. -_- Seriously, I was just looking around for info on final fantasy and stumbled here. Joined up - and I am pleased to say that i really do like it here - sorry if that bugs anyone :)

Anyways, What i was commending Furture on was a well done job at sticking to what he belives. Working his theories around other peoples theories and facts. In a game like this where so many different things are happening, and so many creative minds are working on it - I cannot belive that the game has anyone ending. Sure we all see the same images, but its how we precive them that counts. Mabey it was all a dream of clouds? Prehapse Cid is more than he appears - how will we ever know all people can post is biased complaints, and such. I admit i may have missed a post or two while I was skimming, but most of the rebuttles seemed like garbage to me - no real offence is intended here.

To all those who just bicker and point to me it seems like those who said the world was flat. There is always somthing going on behind the scenes, good games are not made lightly. How the authors and artists depicted the game is not always what we see. Symbolism is always obscured when a game goes from one crew to another - I have been working on my own projects which evolve with other's creative input.

Simply being a smart ass and Saying that both Cloud and Squall have abnormal swords so they must be the same person - really doesn't do much but add heat to a simple debate. The ability to open our minds and express intelligence and interpetations are two very important human gifts. (Both intelligence and interpetations are very different mind you)

I really do enjoy this theory as a lot of it seems to click. I appreciate Futures post because it is giving me the motivation to take a second look at a game that I thought was so simple. Square did too good of a job on this game (IMO) where they blended so much symbolism and allowed your mind to ride along with a very simple story. It really brought the game from the Movie style of FFVII to a more subjective video game that allows for people whom like diging - to dig :)

Bipper GOEs

who actually lets these people post these baseless utterly crap theories. why can't you make up your mind future? not to long ago i think you were on about julia been ultimicia based on the fact that there was a piano in her castle... your theories are something like what one of those stereo typical people living on the streets come up with about the goverment or aliens or whatever... and i was just playing final fantasy 8 myself yesterday and i was at the part where rinoa is in space when ultimicia posses her there is no ellone there and its just an effect of showing rinoa in a disjointed way

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Originally Posted by bipper

Yep, thats right - I was created only yesterday and there for have no idea about anything to do with final fantasy. -_-

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You completely missed the point. In any event, I apologize for suggesting you were a mule account of our resident conspiracy theorist.

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Originally Posted by Bipper

Anyways, What i was commending Furture on was a well done job at sticking to what he belives. Working his theories around other peoples theories and facts.

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You don't "work around" facts. They're impenetrable walls of God-reinforced Adamantium.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bipper

In a game like this where so many different things are happening, and so many creative minds are working on it - I cannot belive that the game has anyone ending. Sure we all see the same images, but its how we precive them that counts. Mabey it was all a dream of clouds? Prehapse Cid is more than he appears - how will we ever know all people can post is biased complaints, and such. I admit i may have missed a post or two while I was skimming, but most of the rebuttles seemed like garbage to me - no real offence is intended here.

To all those who just bicker and point to me it seems like those who said the world was flat. There is always somthing going on behind the scenes, good games are not made lightly. How the authors and artists depicted the game is not always what we see. Symbolism is always obscured when a game goes from one crew to another - I have been working on my own projects which evolve with other's creative input.

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What you're failing to acknowledge here is that the story of the game is a written work. It had a human creator. A creator with an idea. An intent. And they created this story based on that and used the story itself to convey that intent. That's what writers do.

When symbolism is in play, the writer conveys that by using an aspect of that symbolism to get the intent across, whether it's just a name, or a theme, or an event incorporated into the storyline.

VIII works with a good bit of Christian religious symbolism. Rinoa represents that which is good and so she has an Angel theme (her big white feathery wings, her ultimate weapon, Shooting Star, the wing design on the back of her outfit, her Angel Wing limit break, etc.). Ultimecia represents that which is evil, and so has a dark Angel theme (black spiny wings, an attack called "Hell's Judgement," etc.).

Seifer and Squall also play into the symbolism. One of them wears a lightly-colored coat brimmed with darker shades at the collar and within, while the other wears a dark coat brimmed with white at the collar.

Further, Seifer wears crosses on the sleeves of his coat, just as the Teutonic Knights wore crosses on their mantles. Further still, his name is of German origin, as were the Knights.

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Originally Posted by Bipper

Simply being a smart ass and Saying that both Cloud and Squall have abnormal swords so they must be the same person - really doesn't do much but add heat to a simple debate.

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You do realize that what you just said is pretty much entirely what Future's been doing this entire time? Look at the "Rinoa splitting into Ellone" thing. "They both have dark hair, they're both girls, and when those translucent doubles of Rinoa appear, it's hard to see the full length of her hair, making it look shorter like Ellone's, so they must be the same person."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bipper

I really do enjoy this theory as a lot of it seems to click.

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How? It requires ignoring everything that the game outright tells and/or shows to us and requires assuming that the writer failed to convey his intent on every level.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

admit i may have missed a post or two while I was skimming, but most of the rebuttles seemed like garbage to me - no real offence is intended here.

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You certainly missed more than a post or two to give this statement...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

There is always somthing going on behind the scenes

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Maybe there is just too much of a something going on behind the scenes from his theory.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

I appreciate Futures post because it is giving me the motivation to take a second look at a game that I thought was so simple

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You need more than a second look, I am quite certain....

Yes it all does seem strange I admit. I can't say that I can stand here and belive everything that he is saying 100%. But it is his theory.

Nothing is wrong with that - bottom line.

Sorry here for my lack of knowing how to quote correctly - i will work on this when i dont feel like i will get "fried" for making a mistake...

Mr Squall said:

Quote:

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You don't "work around" facts. They're impenetrable walls of God-reinforced Adamantium

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Well here we go with what i have been saying all along. We don't know the facts. What we know is what we were told - that is fact so far. But it was once a fact that the world was flat. It was once a fact that the solar system rotated around the earth. This is because people just went with what they heard.

From what I have seen here was people finding a whole in Future's theory - Ok so the Earth isn't a perfect sphere... Well?

Future is merely walking beyond what he knows and his exploring other possibilites. While I do admit it to be a little gullish of him to title the forum (Wonder how people didn´t notice this.)

Sure he gets defensive here too - can ya blame the guy. When everyone jumps down his throat over posting theories.

I know certain people don't like em and yadda dah - well - then don't post. If you have no intrest your not gonna give it a chance. See, I even take a step and commend him for sticking with a theory and seeing how it could work - and now i am getting the same raction. /shrug

IMO this is the reason i would never post on forums before now. I am sure you seen one thing in the game. Hell so many people swear that squall and seifer are gay - whatever floats your rainboat i guess. I am not gonna jump out and call the guy an idiot and anyother words i can remember from the third grade. thus the theory of open mindedness.

I can tell you straight up that I have some buddies who are like that - you explain the significance of speroths name corralating with the galaxy and such and they tell you your full of bull.

Bottom line is i dont expect everyone to aggree - then the world would still be flat. I just want to see some open minded posts and such.

The post by unkowns saying that prehaps there is too much going on behind the scenese is just the small non sence post that is not backed up that i have been talking about. Personally, I would like to see some facts and evidence backing up your rebuttle besides nah nah nah boo boo.... That whole last post got nothing accomplished besides some minor bickering at me. I guess I must of offended you too by having an opinion. The world is a small place with minimal facts.

Mr Squall, I did very much appreciate your post :) You supported your last ideal very well. However, I would just like to add is that the story that gets burned on the gold cd - is not all the writer's story. I just know this from working on a couple old school muds, and a current game that there is a _TON_ of additions and deltions going on all the time.

Prehapse there was a scene in the story where the author wanted to develope the characters past even more and connect some of these dots - but it never made it bacause of all the work that would be entailed or because they wanted us to have somthing to play with.

From what I hear - square loves the fan base to talk about these things, and to dig into the game. IT creates Fanficts and generates a whole sub culture of creativity off of one game. I dunno bout you but if i ever inspire that kind of game - i would be infinately happier than with a game with a decent storyline, graphix, etc.

Also what i was replying to before - was when people were saying that Seifer and Squall had blonde hair so they are related - that was not even remotley ment in a productive light - it was a stab at the fact that Future's theory has to do with the spit Rinoas. If you do look too, it does seem that different sprites are used and its nto pixel shaded/filtered - but i can only specualate as i have never seen the game on a development level.

See somthing like that a designer would do and see what he means, then we see it and we are like wow - multiple Rinoa's. Even when you look at the clothes that squall wears vs seifer. The hero wears black while the villan wears white wit a cross none the less /shrug i dunno where to go with that, but i am sure it was discussed or thought up and did not just happen with the assumption that it would not be noticed.

Woe - alright well I am gonna go nurse the carpel tunnel and head out..

Lates,
Bipper GOEs

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Originally Posted by bipper

Well here we go with what i have been saying all along. We don't know the facts. What we know is what we were told - that is fact so far. But it was once a fact that the world was flat. It was once a fact that the solar system rotated around the earth. This is because people just went with what they heard.

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Lemme get this straight.. We should hear out and accept Future's theories, despite what is stated to be fact in the game, because what is stated may be false?? What the smurf? That negates paying attention to the story at all, if it's all really a facade. And despite what the original writer wanted.. The final project is the story. That's like stating all deleted scenes from a movie are still part of the story. Somewhere along the line of creation, someone didn't like something and it got yanked. It no longer exists for the story, unless they decide to make a Final Fantasy VIII: The Director's Cut. And even in that case, it only exists for that version of the story.

Theories are fine and dandy, as long as they have some valid proof or at least fit with the stated story. Future's theory can't do either.

How has this thread lasted this long?

Because Future keeps insisting his theories have some merit and Unknown keeps proving them wrong. It's basically become an endless cycle.

I don´t have proofs but they fit with the story.
Good post bipper.
Unknowns,you act like i should take a microscope or a glass amplifier to the game to EXACTLY proof things.
But that´s impossible.This is not real world.This is a game.No one can find a knife in the game and then see if Caraways digital prints were there and analyse the blood sample in the knife to see if it was Julia´s blood(using all the necessary techniques of course).That can not be made on a game.We can just think on the best possibility for a theory basing on script,events and the most important,GRAPHICAL DETAILS.
Of course I know you hate when people uses GRAPHICAL DETAILS to back up theories.You tend to believe more on scripts and main events.

Graphical details for a game that had crappy graphics doesn't say a whole lot. And god forbid we use details like actual events in the game script to prove that your theories have little to no merit in the actual story.

Whaaaaaaaat?I always thought the graphics of FF8 were the best.

You say your theories fit into the story. They don't. They contradict the story immensely.

Edit:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Whaaaaaaaat?I always thought the graphics of FF8 were the best.

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Are you stupid or something? Do you even know what FFIX, and a PS2 are?

Yeah,but they were not crappy in anyway.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Yeah,but they were not crappy in anyway.

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The FMVs are completely awesome, but the in game screens are quite crappy.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Autumn Rain

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Yeah,but they were not crappy in anyway.

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The FMVs are completely awesome, but the in game screens are VERY quite crappy.

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I fixed it! Go me! :)

Relying on FFVIII's not-so-perfect graphics to back your theories up probably isn't the best idea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

Personally, I would like to see some facts and evidence backing up your rebuttle besides nah nah nah boo boo....
That whole last post got nothing accomplished besides some minor bickering at me. I guess I must of offended you too by having an opinion. The world is a small place with minimal facts.

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And the last post is not certainly directed to start a fight with you. It was meant for you to really take a good look at the whole theory and to be fair to other posters that rebuttle. Having an different opinion and face my wrath is never my intention around here or else I will have rebuttled on your first post.

I never believe you were a mule account of Esthar's because I read your other post concering Sephiroth and Kefka in the FF VI/General FF section which make sense and you took time to research on all those.

I researched on Esthar's theories clearly,went to see all his previous posts to get to know more about his theories,went through the game to take a few more "looks" and go through several game related infomations so as to clearly list out the points that doesn't seem right in Esthar's theories.

I just want you take a clearer look at the whole thread of what the other posters post. Look, I did homework before I "nah nah nah boo boo boo" here. If I offended you anyhow, I apologize. :cry:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Unknowns,you act like i should take a microscope or a glass amplifier to the game to EXACTLY proof things

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This is what you say to me about the camera thing in the parade...(below)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It doesn´t matter,you don´t have proofs.End point.

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You were the one that want detailed proofs and now you are just going back on your words...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

Of course I know you hate when people uses GRAPHICAL DETAILS to back up theories.You tend to believe more on scripts and main events.

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I dun hate people using Graphical Details to back up the theories but pls back in with concrete proof like that Ellone split thingy. Up till now, who agree with that?

Those are reference of what is actually going on in the games, using them as a guideline, what is wrong?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Unknowns

I dun hate people using Graphical Details to back up the theories but pls back in with concrete proof like that Ellone split thingy. Up till now, who agree with that?

Those are reference of what is actually going on in the games, using them as a guideline, what is wrong?

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Yes, exactly that. These video games could be compared to a book with pictures. Basing stuff on the pictures alone isn't too reliable as the artist and author may have different views on the story. We rely on dialouge and the actions of characters rather than soley graphical detail. Your theories are changing the story not by using the actual plot portrayed by the game, but by drawing up random ideas from trivial things like how a character may look at a certain point. The graphics in this game have many flaws, like characters passing though each other, Irvine's jacket when climbing ladders, and all sorts of things that literally don't matter. I could just as easily say that all of the characters are merely dreams of Ellone or someone because "Look at the way they pass though each other! FFVIII was supposed to have such unriveled graphics for a reason, right? Wonder how people didn`t notice this." Guess what. Rinoa's hair appearing to be shorter when the game splits her image for effect is just an error. Like I said, FFVIII's graphics have many errors and this is just one of them.

Also, stop saying that you don't need any proof to back up your theories. If you don't find some, why should we believe them? Don't say that they're right because they seem to fit. Well guess what. They don't fit. They directly contradict what the game is telling us/you. It's like a jigsaw puzzle. Just because it looks like the piece will fit doesn't mean it will. So, again, stop saying that your theory (theories?) actually makes sense and fits perfectly with the story, because I have read them, and they don't.

With square - they have always done such a great job working the graphics into the story and collaberating to make a master peice. Tjere fpor the graphix are just as important as the script. The game did not have crappy graphics by any measure. For what the PSX could do, the game pushed the envelope. The planning on color usage with the lighting effects seemd a little dreary and distracting - but that is purly subjective.

I am reading through the whole forum again now - before i do - let me say i do belive two things (that COULD be)

1: The girls could all be sorceresses and guys thier knights
2: Rinoa and Ellone definatley have some connection - call it strange but I am seeing it in the pics that future put up. The have to be different sprites and not simply traced and transparently shaded.

/shrug those really caught my attention and got me into the thread.

Like i said earlier - Square is not about to give the warriors a deep past - just to say that they grew up together :( way to sitcom. The is IMO as well as who knows - mabey it was rushed and they did that. But its my opinion which would make it a fine fact to me to use in my theories for fun! :)

One thing is forsure - this funness made me take out my old version of 8 so we can all pat our selves on the back since we accomplished somthing good out of it all :)

Whelp lates again,

Bipper GOEts?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

With square - they have always done such a great job working the graphics into the story and collaberating to make a master peice. Tjere fpor the graphix are just as important as the script. The game did not have crappy graphics by any measure. For what the PSX could do, the game pushed the envelope. The planning on color usage with the lighting effects seemd a little dreary and distracting - but that is purly subjective.

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When has the graphics been worked into the story? :erm: The graphics are nice and pretty, but they've never contributed to the script.

And I'm sorry, but did you just say that the in-game scenes pushed the envelope? How do you figure? Certainly the FMVs did, but the in-game scenes were crappy, even by the standards of the day. Hell, the backgrounds in FF7 looked better. And the characters.. Can we say "overpixelated"?

Quote:

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When has the graphics been worked into the story? The graphics are nice and pretty, but they've never contributed to the script.

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Oh ok, so I may have been vague on that. When the company tells you that character a and b are in "love" but wont admit it - would it be as cool for the main character just to say " Wow.. they are in love but the will not admit it! HA HA!". Nope - you graphically represent it in different ways. (Hell remember the question mark bubbles, and such from 6?) In that way the graphics do contribute to the script as we interpet it.

AND

Prehapse whole all of the areas were being built, they decided that Esthar should be located in a barrent type area instead of a jungle or w/e.

AND

When square may want to hint at somthing they can use graphical symbolism and just hope that someone might catch on - then get ripped appart on the boards! See square really like laughing at people like future Esthar because he is not affraid to dig - but he will get blasted for it!? The irony of it all.

And yes the online graphics did push the envalope. Over pixeled - entirely correct but you are not seeing over pixulated images - that is why i said this :

Quote:

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The planning on color usage with the lighting effects seemd a little dreary and distracting

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What you are seeing is the result of shaders and filters being processed to the sprite image. This is what made it so graphically appealing. The sprite was so Dynamic and could fit into any enviroment. sure final fantasy IX was remastered and better, but hey- it takes a few tries to get "Hello world!" To look good sometimes. (programming joke - he he snort snort)

In the dymanticity of sprites and everything but the world map - ffVIII was very suppirior to anything before its time... sept mabey donkey kong - you just cant beat the king -_-

Bipper GOeS

graphics only show a small representation of facts its the story themselves that you need to pay attention to if you spend your time going oooooh pretty everytime you see something new and not pay attention to what they are saying then you miss many many things like future did maybe thats why he keeps coming up with these things

In reply to Bipper, (also addressing Future Esthar)

Okay, so what are you trying to say? That Square worked really hard to make the graphics very detailed? Does that mean they did not make mistakes? Does that mean that the ability for characters to pass through each other was intentional because Square worked so hard on making it realistic? If anything, that just helps support my "theory" in my other post. Squall and friends are obviously all just dreams of Ellone or someone. I mean, Square made it SOOO realistic for a reason, right? I thought so. Graphics are for looks and appeal.

Oh, and by the way, the question mark bubbles in FFVI were actions by the characters, not mere graphical details. Graphical details are how someone/thing looks, not what they do and how they act.

Also, if this really is the true intended story of FFVIII, why has nobody except Future Esthar actually figured it out? If FE's theories really are the true story of FFVIII, why didn't Square say so? Why did Square tell us the opposite of what FE is? If Square really did want this to be the true story of FFVIII, they wouldn't have made clues so utterly random and minute that only one person has actually been able to see them. How can you believe something that, again, directly contradicts what the story is telling us?

"Hello, my name is Mary."
"No, your name is obviously Hlymsr, because that's what you get when you put every third letter of that sentance into one word! Wonder how people didn`t notice this!"
"What the...? I just said my name is Mary."
"Well, you are obviously hiding something!"

This is comparable to the outrageous nit-picking that FE is doing the storyline of FFVIII.

Wow - yet more pointless rebuttles -
If you want to attack what i am saying then attack what i said. I am simply saying that we need to have an open mind - and TO ME it makes sence.

If that seriously is your theory then grats - i dont buy it and it shouldn't really matter /shrug

Basically we can agree on one thing - the game leads as to assume a few details here and there. When you open up asumptions you open up theries.

Quote:

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"Hello, my name is Mary."
"No, your name is obviously Hlymsr, because that's what you get when you put every third letter of that sentance into one word! Wonder how people didn`t notice this!"
"What the...? I just said my name is Mary."
"Well, you are obviously hiding something!"

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This is the kinda crap I was writing about earlier - completely baseless to the forum. Future Esthar has prdouced a few shreds of evidence and tryed to work it all together. Acting like a 5 year old is not getting this anywhere.

Quote:

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Oh, and by the way, the question mark bubbles in FFVI were actions by the characters, not mere graphical details. Graphical details are how someone/thing looks, not what they do and how they act.

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Yes, if a character blushes it is and action... if the character blushes it may even point out traits that they are shy, embaraced, or mabey some one in the room let one fly and it stinks ... every action and detail can be explained in different ways. Who cares if they are "Out there"

seeing this :confused: in a post makes you see someone is confused... you see to many :confused: :confused: :confused: then you begin to know that the person just might not get it.. you see a final fantasy char do that alot in VI - then you know they are an idiot.

You know this may be the true story or not - who knows - at least he is looking and producing instead of pointing and laughing...

By the way - the satire of you avatar aside - I think it is very suiting Xaven :)

Also no the graphix are not for looks and appeal .. .well they are.. but the are alot more multipurpose than other posts around here...
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Mr. Liamo - I do agree with you that some things said here do neglect tha base storyline. Who really knows - but you can be looking too deep and forget about some bases no dobut. However, looking to deep should not matter - instead of ripping someone arpart, bring it up and mabey they can work with it or mabey it will disprove them.'
I think Unknowns has been fair at doing this till later in the tread, but most other's i have seen post just to... post i think /shrug.

Bipper gOEs!

I like how you ignored his entire post, took a quote out of context and bashed it, then called his entire post a pointless rebuttle. I think what you and Future seem to be missing is that these threads are for discussing things. If we find that your theory doesn't work, we're gonna discuss why we think it doesn't work. You can't start a discussion on something and then state that everyone is attacking you, if they don't see your way. If you want someone to just pat you on the head and tell you how creative you are, without actually giving it a real look over, go show your theories to mommy and daddy. Otherwise, we have the right to call it baseless and nonsensical, then explain why we feel that way.

Yup, I ignore the whole thread -
It's easy enough to the pot calling the kettle black here. Anyways, rain - your the worst of all the posters that has been urking me here.

A: its not my theory, i am just looking at it
B: Read what the hell i am saying - Keep an open mind is my argument and be productive - i HAVE seen a few good rebuttles but i creadit em to unknowns.
c: I never said that you can't speak - i would like to see the bs that doesnt belong here not posted.

What the hell ever though rain - have the damn forum back and post what ever the hell you think is right to post. I could really give a rats ass on here anymore. Putting words in my mouth and telling me where i stand? Nope - I jumped in cause i seen a few valid points--

People like you are the whole reason I never joined a forum.
Now rot in hell i am outta here

EDIT: Now that's not very necessary. If you do come back watch how you conduct yourself. -Murder

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bipper

Yup, I ignore the whole thread -
It's easy enough to the pot calling the kettle black here. Anyways, rain - your the worst of all the posters that has been urking me here.

A: its not my theory, i am just looking at it
B: Read what the hell i am saying - Keep an open mind is my argument and be productive - i HAVE seen a few good rebuttles but i creadit em to unknowns.
c: I never said that you can't speak - i would like to see the bs that doesnt belong here not posted.

What the hell ever though rain - have the damn forum back and post what ever the hell you think is right to post. I could really give a rats ass on here anymore. Putting words in my mouth and telling me where i stand? Nope - I jumped in cause i seen a few valid points--

People like you are the whole reason I never joined a forum.
Now rot in hell i am outta here

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DRAMA!!! :rolleyes2

Anyway.. As I fail to see any recent posts that don't make some sort of rebuttle, I'm still not sure what you are in a huff about. Everyone has been listing why they have a problem with Future's theories and you jump to his "rescue". Great. You find his theories insightful. That doesn't mean the rest of us should suddenly pat him on the back, despite the fact that much of it doesn't make any sense.

He explains why he believes things, we (especially Unknown) point out what we see wrong with it. Excuse me for not having the time to post three page rebuttles, like Unknown. I'm on mostly at work, so my attention isn't completely on EoFF. I just jump in with what I see wrong with it right off and leave it at that.

I'm sorry that you don't like how adamantly people express their opinions, but please.. Getting in a huff and stating that you are leaving a forum because of it is just to get attention.

[To Bipper]
So, did you actually read what is post by other posters before making all those statements like I advised you to? I think you have roughly did but did you just choose to read a few lines of Xaven's reply then came up with a conclusion of your own?

You know by doing this is not showing respect to Xaven as he did put up the effort to write the entire post. :(

You know I read every single of Future's posts before coming up with a rebuttle/comments/statements. It is to show that I have studied and understand his theories and also a sign of respect to him.

I aprecciate your attention but don´t offend members here bipper.Calm down yourself.
FF8 graphics were good enough to hint at the story.
It´s wonderful how they use the graphical details to give a bunch of hints about the storyline.They are so realistic.
I don´t use graphical details to hint theories at RANDOM.
I thought about them too much and of course I use the game scripts and events to state them.
My theories are the result of many years playing FF8 and I start to get intuition to see the game as a whole.
A theory of mine is also a result of the thoughts I have on many events.
As you saw I backed up the Rinoa=Elle theory with graphical details but also discussed events of FF8 like time compression,Ultimecia´s real plan on the game ,etc.. to show that what really happens on the game requires Rinoa being Ellone.
I am no stupid.I know the save points were not Gardens where hunts study to be a seed.
Nor the switch icons at Ulti´s castle were green materia or special draw points which only exists on the future.
My "graphical theories" were very well thought in the CONTEXT of the game.

It just happens that many things that appears on the script were purposedly the result of the lies of some of the characters of the game.
Sometimes they even manipulates the events of the game to make their lies seem true.
That happens almost any time on FF8.
In fact this is the reason why X looks for Ellone everytime in the game.
Because she can see the past and show people how things really were.
(Something X try to destroy performing Time Compression).This is the same reason for Deling trying to shut down Timber Maniacs.
_
And I appreciate your respect for trying to argue with me Unknowns.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

As you saw I backed up the Rinoa=Elle theory with graphical details but also discussed events of FF8 like time compression,Ultimecia´s real plan on the game ,etc.. to show that what really happens on the game requires Rinoa being Ellone.

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Let me quote an example. In a game the main character look like a cat through what was displayed by the graphics in the games to the eyes of the players. The players realized that the main character is a cat.
But the in game scripts and main events say that the main character is a DOG but not a cat. Dun you think it is contradicting since what you SEE dun TALLY with what the game actually suggest? Same apply with your theory. They dun tally and for the graphicial details, I still cannot agree cause I still dun see how Rinoa is Ellone in those pictures and by playing the game myself.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It just happens that many things that appears on the script were purposedly the result of the lies of some of the characters of the game.
Sometimes they even manipulates the events of the game to make their lies seem true.
That happens almost any time on FF8.

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Mind quoting an example from the script or something to prove it. Since the script is a lie, what is there left to believe in anyway?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

In fact this is the reason why X looks for Ellone everytime in the game.
Because she can see the past and show people how things really were.
(Something X try to destroy performing Time Compression).

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The purpose of time compression is to absorb all the powers of the sorceress, past, present, future to one sorceress which mean a tremendous powerful magic wielding being, something like a God, something like Hyne. Try scanning Ultimecia final form and the description will tell you she is absorbing everything to boost her powers and the fact of "X" or whoever is searching for Ellone is she is the only that can perform all this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

And I appreciate your respect for trying to argue with me Unknowns.

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Thanks.

Lastly, you still haven't answer a single question that I pointed out earlier that contradicts with your theory.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Unknowns

Lastly, you still haven't answer a single question that I pointed out earlier that contradicts with your theory.

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Nor mine (which are WAY back earlier in this thread).

Post this questions again please.

Check Page 6 of this thread. Almost the whole page is full of my unanswered questions....

But what really interest me is this line:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

I don´t have proofs but they fit with the story.

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and this is what you say about the camera thing in other thread:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

It doesn´t matter,you don´t have proofs.End point.

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What you say now really contradicts with what you say earlier on dun you think? You say you want proof but now you say there is no need for proofs.

As for crazybayman's question, just give me some time to search this thread...

I was just saying that your opinion and mine were equally probable since none had proofs.I know you can´t really proof that.

So I admit and go along with your theory of the parade is kept to the Galbadian since I can't prove that.

But what about you, you still insisted and claim that it fit into the story.

Let's just say a lot of other possiblity can just fit into the story.
Like Hyne is Yevon from FFX.

Cloud from FF7 is living in Esthar and have opened up an item shop. The reason he open up a item shop is blah blah.......

Also Ultima Weapon have Cloud's sword. Cloud must have mutated into Ultima Weapon because of the JENOVA's cell in his body and blah blah blah......

See what I mean?

We can´t proof theories.But that is exactly the fun.If we were able to proof theories there would be no fun because it will break the chance for other theories.But as long as there is no proof people can made theories (using reasoning of course) and share them on the Internet.And they will be endless.This is funny since it adds infinite replayability to the game.And this is the objective of games like FF7 and 8.The hidden things on these games weren´t supposed to be proofed but to be hinted by little unimportant events mainly those that do not belongs to the main story but to secondary stories (like the sidequests or Shumi Village story).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Future Esthar

We can´t proof theories.But that is exactly the fun.If we were able to proof theories there would be no fun because it will break the chance for other theories.But as long as there is no proof people can made theories (using reasoning of course) and share them on the Internet.And they will be endless.This is funny since it adds infinite replayability to the game.And this is the objective of games like FF7 and 8.The hidden things on these games weren´t supposed to be proofed but to be hinted by little unimportant events mainly those that do not belongs to the main story but to secondary stories (like the sidequests or Shumi Village story).

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Look, we also need some FACTS to SUPPORT the hints and there is no FACTS that support your theory so far and this isn't theory but instead should go into the Fan Fiction section.

So your theory is actually just a side story and not linked with the main storyline?

What is required is that no fact from the game denies the theory.
Up to now no one denies my theories.
And the script things that seem to deny were purposefull lies.
And there is nothing on the game that proofs that the last statement was wrong.
And if it is it must be without any doubt a GRAPHICAL DETAIL.
Words from a person A weren´t enough to spot if a person B is telling the thruth or not since you don´t know if person A is telling the thruth.
Even events can be manipulated to look thruth (this is the purpose of WOTC).
So in the end let GRAPHICAL DETAILS determine the thruth.And you must consider the one´s who seems the less important (the most important ones are so visible that it´s like someone is imposing it to you through manipulation).The less important ones are like the "tail" of the "hiding cat" as in the proverb "Hidden cat with tails showing".
The cat really don´t know that the tail is showing or he would hide it.

K, I stopped reading at the 4th page, so I dont know what happened from there, so excuse me if this thread has died and what-not.


However, Futre Esthar, in all honesty, and excuse my fierce emotions, you my friend, are an idiot. I apologize on my behalf for "flaming" him by saying he is an idiot, but I think mostly everyone would agree with me.

land changes over time. he isn't really in a specfic palce. he is going through time compression(decompressoin at the end). he is not really on soil from one place he is just there.and it could still be a desert if it gets no rain.
:tonberry:

If I were a mod, I'd say, "Don't double post."

But, since I'm me, I say, "Be more specific with your first post and don't be a total jurk to FE."

Also, don't only read the first page before you post like you apparantly did.

Edit:

Oh, it seems someone deleted greiver's second post.