Any thoughts on this controversial woman? I remember a lot where said about her.
So any thoughts on her and her actions?
http://www.illinoisleader.com/conten...0_thatcher.jpg
Margaret Thatcher.
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Any thoughts on this controversial woman? I remember a lot where said about her.
So any thoughts on her and her actions?
http://www.illinoisleader.com/conten...0_thatcher.jpg
Margaret Thatcher.
Well, she's British or something.
You either love or hate Margaret Thatcher, depending on how high your income is. As a pair of penniless beggars, my parents have raised me to loathe the woman with every fibre of my being.
Thatcher rules!
She's pretty hot. ;)
Seriously, I don't know much about her, but I heard she was very strict.
I think she was great, and definitely the best Prime Minister of modern times. Better than Callaghan, Major and Blair, that's for sure.
Thatcher = Hero.
and she invented the squirty cream in a can
and she was hot.
I was raised to hate her; this means inevitably that I <3 her.
Actually I've not looked deeply into her leadership, I just know it winds my mother and step-dad up to hear me sing her praises. xD
Psy loves her, so I love her. Even if he didn't, how could you say no to that face?
"She is a member of the Conservative Party and the figurehead of a political philosophy that became known as Thatcherism, which involves reduced government spending, lower taxes and regulation, a monetarist policy, and a programme of privatisation of government-owned industries." (Wikipedia)
Hell, so far, so good. Gets my vote.
Edit:"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families." - Margaret Thatcher
Yeah, I guess I kind of like her, now. We need somoene in office like that over here.
THAT is the full quote?! I wish I'd known THAT every time either of my parents had dragged out the line "Thatcher claims there's no such thing as society!"Quote:
Originally Posted by Hachifusa
Context-dropping at its finest, eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
I love Margaret Thatcher simply because of a script one of my friends came up with for a skit in our history class. The line was something about Andrew Jackson invading Florida with nothing but a sock puppet of Margaret Thatcher. That thing was hilarious.
For a second, I mistook Margaret Thatcher for Lizzie Borden. *hack-hack with an axe, fear is better than exlax*
She doesn't sound like a bad lady...I know little to nothing about her because I'm a silly American.
she was the first female britsh prime minister and although she wasnt much liked at the time she was arguably the best prime minister of all time. She didnt put a foot wrong until the end and england went downhill after she left.
she bought TB to britain all the good she done screwed up in the end
Damn straight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hachifusa
Now I'm compelled to go and look into Thatcher more.
She's hot,
and I'm sure she has a classy accent.
She was strict and wore man-clothes, didn't she?
[img]http://home.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/heart.gif[/img]
no she allways wore skirts and womens hats.
Lol,I remember when her idiot son got lost in the Sahara Desert and made her cry in public.So much for the " Iron Lady " facade.
Yes, how weak a person it is who is worried their child may be dying of dehydration.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itsunari 2000
Oh yes, she was a FANTASTIC woman.
You know, all that selling off public industries in order to make money for the government, when she had no ownership over them, they belonged to the public.
Then of course, the inevitable decline due to privatisation and companies working entirely for shareholders rather than customers, since the customers are very much a captive audience.
Oh and Negative Equity from a housing market collapse, that was LOVELY too.
Wonderful woman, almost killed Britain.
And her son is one of the most feckless and dishonest people to ever have existed, I do rather wish he had remained forever lost in the desert.
Yeah. If that's weak, then I'm about as strong as a worm. That got stomped on a few times to death.Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm my own MILF
I still know nothing about Margaret though. I just know that she was strict and oldand that she was pretty hot.;)
Edit: That was pretty mean spirited, so I decided to edit this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
It seems to me that your dislike for Thatcher stems largely from the fact that she destroyed the welfare state. However, I feel this is a virtue, and that there is no such (real) thing as "ownership of the public". Sadly, she did own them (if not in theory, then in reality) because any time an industry is owned by the people, it means that they are owned by the government.
Privatization of a company is a good thing; the government has no right to get involved in the actions of its citizens.
Sadly, the woman wasn't able to really get rid of the Welfare State (something tells me that might take awhile, anyway). However, she did seem to do some good, and other than her decline at the end, she seemed to pull Britain through a stale economy.
And no one should bring up her son; she has no control over the actions of another.
With the privatisation of industry, the entire infrastructure fell into dissarray, prices for services rocketed and quality plummeted. Only now with the railways and buses being more closely monitored have they started to rise out of the mire that woman dumped them in.
Oh, and another thing, where did the money from all the sale of public industry go?
Why, to tax cuts for the rich!
The welfare state and public services are what separate us from a chaotic, capitalistic mess of a country, a land where profit is the only goal. That, to me, sounds more akin to dystopia than anything else.
The woman culled industry and tried to convert this country into an entirely service-based economy. Now how can you think that is a good thing? Because of Thatcher, the previously ironic term of "Coals to Newcastle" now ACTUALLY happens, it's disgusting.
She did NOTHING to help the British economy, and neither did her hopeless successors, the point of negative equity is a fairly heavy one, people left with next to nothing in a society that was turning into one where money was the only thing that mattered.
And when you're left bankrupt in a profit-based society, what's the point?
The reason her reign of terror ended was because her own party had her removed, even they hated her.
I remember some racist statements by her... >:O
And she failed to understand how radio works.
Stating "I can't see you, where are you?" when recieving a call from a person phoning to talk to her.
I don't have an opinion, but I've heard mostly good things about her. Reading through this thread, it seems to be because she had a capitalistic take on things, which would naturally ally her with the States, so there ya have it. :\
Which is why America, which is far more evil in its capitalistic (i.e. free) approach to things, will always be steps ahead of Britain, drowning in socialism.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
I don't think a society that caters to all of it's members instead of just the rich can ever be described as "drowning".
My thoughts exactly.So you consider Margaret Thatcher to be a national hero of some kind ?A credit to the British people in the face of economic recession ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
Well she isn't - think about it, nearly undermining the original aims of the health service,dismantling the Welfare State,declaring the miners strikes of 1985 " illegal ",imposing the poll tax on her guinea pigs, Scotland,trying to tax Live Aid for Christ's sake and if that's not enough publicly supporting the figurehead of a regime responsible for the suppression and murder of thousands of innocent people !
If the current British Prime Minister finalizes his cabinet's policy then she surely Thatcher dictated it in what we call " Thatcherism ".That roughly translates as the suppression of the poor for the benefit of suburban living snobs.
Now I'm no authority on political criticism of any kind,but I know fine well that Margaret Thatcher could NEVER be considered a national hero among the vast majority of working people in Britain even more than a decade on since she was finally forced out of government by her own Cabinet.I've read all of your posts and understandably,the vast majority of you being American, seem to have very little idea of the situation under Thatcher's government in the 1980's and her effect on the country as a whole - the truth is that some of you seem to hail her as a champion of American style capitalism on British soil.Well here's my response.
Ideally,if it were up to some of you,Britain under Thatcher would be like a" little America", yeah that's right just an extension of the world's self-proclaimed hyperpower into the world while Bush " liberates " people in distant lands, all the while under the god almighty shell of so-called American morality where there is " justice " and " equality ", the streets are teeming with FedEx, and McDonalds and oh , not to mention , violent drugs and gun crime,racial tension,MTV, and a floundering education system all courtesy of an organization of senile, self-righteous, totally corrupt and incompetent scumbags that we call " Congress" where a superior,simian looking twat sings the praises of the Lord on his all-conquering armies while they are slaughtered in their thousands for the pursuit of liberty,justice and oil as a rich economic resource to be reaped and later dumped in the Atlantic with no regard to environmental issues ... oh , oh excuse me , did I say that ? OIL ?! Oh no no, it's ok it's ok let's just get Canada to stop leeching off us and brutally murder some innocent seal colonies while we hoard our cash to fund our multi-million dollar corporate industries which ruthlessly crush all opposition and suck up natural resources to further pollute our environment so some fatcat can get his paycheck every Friday.
Oh my god, I guess some of you are going to be really pissed off with me,basically criticizing your great,great nation's entire society and all , me being an ignorant little " Britisher " and therefore,the citizen of a inferior socialist government, which,did I mention occupied large parts of American soil at one point !? Face it - Britain will always be Britain -America will always be America so damned be the day,that all conquering American capitalism replaces the catering of the needy and poor in these dangerous times.
Oh and don't forget ... GOD BLESS AMERICA !!!! * drapes himself inthe stars and stripes and dances in an outrageous show of patriotism*
PS :
I'M MY OWN MILF , whatever the hell your name is/ supposed to be, Margaret Thatcher's son is a deceiving,arrogant bastard who deserved to be left in a West African prison cell to contemplate his stupidity and all, along with all the other so-called celebrities and the " Royal family " that continually piss me off with their absurd public appearances.
If you don't like the fact I found the desert incident vaguely amusing then sue me or go to hell.
:) Thankyou !
I found the whole "I wasn't part of a coup, honest" incident a lot more amusing than the incident in the desert, but to be frank, they're both hilarious.
Fixed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itsunari 2000
Ok, no problem. If your family or friends are ever in a dire situation, I'll be sure to laugh at your weakness for giving a crap about them.Quote:
PS :
I'M MY OWN MILF , whatever the hell your name is/ supposed to be, Margaret Thatcher's son is a deceiving,arrogant bastard who deserved to be left in a West African prison cell to contemplate his stupidity and all, along with all the other so-called celebrities and the " Royal family " that continually piss me off with their absurd public appearances.
If you don't like the fact I found the desert incident vaguely amusing then sue me or go to hell.
:) Thankyou !
Lord, and people think us Capitalists are the heartless ones?
I was just saying,Thatcher was only demonstrating her deepest humanity by crying in public.Not the Iron Lady typified in the media.
Yes, well, I don't care who you are, I'll forgive you for crying (In public or private) if your sun is missing in the middle of the desert. And I won't care about what the media has made you out to be, either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itsunari 2000
Edit: Of course, I meant 'son', but the irony is too delicious to be deleted.
Thatcher may be a b*tch but she is damn sexy
I've only heard bad things about her, but I know nothing of British politics.
Thatcher didn't adopt an american style of captilism she simply reintroduced the pro buisness attitude of the country at it's height during the mid to late 19th century. American economic attitude as with most things in America is based on the British model. The introduction of the welfare state was in the mid 20th century and mostly on accepted due to the poverty caused by the second world war. It has far outstayed it's welcome and created an workforce that is lax in it's own initative.
P.S Thatcher was forced out only over her dislike the further European intergration an issue which i may point out the majority of the country agrees with her on.
Oh, Miss Thatcher. I hate her, of course. Basically, she represents the opposite end of the spectrum in my political beliefs.
Funny how Alan Moore did V for Vendetta in the 80s. In the introduction, he said before miss Thatcher got to the goverment, he would have never believed England could fall into fascism. Yet, with Thatcher on the goverment, he said he felt like "we are getting close to it".
So yes, the good thing of Margaret Thatcher is that she inspired Alan Moore.
My god I hate most British people
Because we're not right-wing, heartless capitalists?
What a shame there, we're so hurt you hate us.
I'm the opposite. xD I think I like British people too much, they're the only people I talk to anymore.Quote:
My god I hate most British people
No, because you're heartless, greedy socialists who would enslave its own people. I mean, what the hell kind of brainwashing program were you raised on? "Capitalist" is hardly an insult.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
Lol, greedy socialists.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hachifusa
Who said I was trying to insult you?
How is aiding the weakest member of a society heartless anyway, when the capitalist concept would just leave them in the gutter. And you just can't call socialism greedy, I mean, come on, what kind of brainwashing program were YOU raised on?
Anyway, England is neither capitalist, nor socialist, there is a modicum of government control over the key industries (though there should be more over some), and sensible controls over corporations (prevention of collusion and price fixing). The welfare state is a sensible thing, as is the idea of free healthcare for everyone. It's the nature of balance, neither one way nor the other.
I just don't see where you get the idea of being enslaved from, when in a society like Thatcher's we'd be slaves to the wage, with money being the entire focus of life.
Cool it, people. Debating is fine, insulting is not.
I don't believe that the government has a right to my money, nor anyone's. It's a noble goal to help the poor, but it's done at the cost of rights to the individual in a socialistic enviornment, which is abhorrent. "Greedy" was perhaps not the right word, but certainly I don't believe that socialism is a form of government based on a love for man, no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
Balance is better than pure socialism, of course, but that's only because the more capitalism, the better. Once again, it's less about the results of a government then the sacrifices it commits along the way. I don't think that the rich, who have earned their money, have to give a higher percentage of taxation because the poor demand it. That's inhumane to ask. The form of government I advocate is where each and every individual has the ability to go as far and high as they can. Which is, more or less, capitalism.Quote:
Anyway, England is neither capitalist, nor socialist, there is a modicum of government control over the key industries (though there should be more over some), and sensible controls over corporations (prevention of collusion and price fixing). The welfare state is a sensible thing, as is the idea of free healthcare for everyone. It's the nature of balance, neither one way nor the other.
I'd rather not have to rely on a government who tells me how to live my life, that's all.Quote:
I just don't see where you get the idea of being enslaved from, when in a society like Thatcher's we'd be slaves to the wage, with money being the entire focus of life.
Believe me, your nation is brainwashed more than ours.Quote:
I'd rather not have to rely on a government who tells me how to live my life, that's all.
Yet another USA vs UK thread....
This is getting too much now, it's a saturday night and I'm really not in the mood to debate systems of government.
Lets just agree to disagree.
Fair enough. But, let me deal with something else, if you don't mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
I'm rather a fan of the UK: I'll make that clear now.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomamar04
And how is the US more brainwashed?
There's no point in arguing about the UK against the US, it's apples and oranges, I'd rather live in either country than, say, Ethiopia.
Just be happy with what you have, rather than trying to argue which country is better.
Anyway, I'm done, and thank you for respecting my wishes rather than pushing it, rare thing on the internet.
Agreed fully. The only question I would still like answered is how in the hell we're brainwahed masses in America. Is that a common misconception?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindy
All I can think of is that the news media in America is just a teensy bit on the side of scaremongering, at least from what I've seen anyway, watching broadcasts of ABC and CNN.
But then, it's only people who follow those like a religion that you could consider "brainwashed".
I consider Nazi Germany to be "brainwashing", and since neither the UK or US run under anything like that regime, I doubt you could say either country was brainwashed.
And hey look, I'm not done, damned internet, oh well.
I never said either was brainwashed, it's just how can you say the UK is brainwashed.
I feel the American government has more control over daily life than the UK government.
And why do you think the UK is brainwashed?
I don't think the UK is "brainwashed", but I do think that the UK is under the same, er, "education" that the US is under. See, the people here in America are hardly being taught propaganda, though we recognize that there is some "propaganda" in our media. However, we have the freedom of press in the States, and therefore its' not really a product of our government, but a bunch of ass-kissing media people who produce scaremongering tactics.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomamar04
Likewise, on the basis of capitalism v. socialism, it seems that the majority of people in the UK probably don't give a damn about issues like that, but most would say (without base) that socialism is just and ideal, and that capitalism is a greedy system. Likewise, in the states, among the common man who doesn't give a damn about any of this, it's still the prevaling idea that (without base, once again) capitalism is free and just, and that socialism is more-or-less a slave society.
Really, my argumentation is that the United States is hardly a hell of a lot worse than most other western civilizations. It's just that our subtle, "collective" political ideals centers more around capitalism, not socialism.
The only freedom capitalism stands for is the economical freedom. If you live in a socialist or a capitalist country is completely irrelevant when it comes to social freedom. Personally I disagree with the idea that you have the right to "your money", which you "earned" yourself. There is no such thing as generating economical wealth. Everything you obtain is obtained on the expense of someone else, and I don't believe you have the right to have it any more than whoever turned slightly poorer by your success.
Well, true, and I think freedom is the point. Which is why I am a Libertarian - I want a society that's based on both social and economic freedom.Quote:
Originally Posted by jrgen
And how is my making money at the expense of another? I rendered a service for it; I didn't steal it from their hands.
Isn't Britain the most heavily monitored country in the world?Quote:
I feel the American government has more control over daily life than the UK government.
Haha ... who would've thought my tub-thumping could have provoked such fierce political debate... amusing.
Yes, Hard to imagine an actual civilized debate could occur, even with your completely baseless anti-American stance throughout the whole ordeal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itsunari 2000
GOD SAVE THE QUEEN *prances around drinking tea and stealing money from the rich in a flagrant show of nationalism*
Margret thatcher the milk snatcher.
I despise her, everything to do with her and her "views".
Apart from her tory pro middle class anti working class views, her stance on Prisoners of war was disgraceful. In 1981 the Irish hunger strikers (the IRA) where in prison as criminals, instead of POWs. They went on hunger strike for thier rightful POW status and where still denied, under Thatchers government. 10 men died. But ofcourse, once her son is lost in a desert, the British army is right out to find him, which is disgraceful and sick.
Amonst other things to do with Thatcher was the Protection for the wealthy, and defence of the privileged, but what do you expect from a tory government?
I put her on par with Hitler. While she didn't openly kill thousands, she wanted it and even raised it in Parliment (The ethnic cleansing/removal of republican irish in northern ireland)
She'll die standing.
Over here, Thatcher, was, is & always will be loathed. My father called her 'Mussolini in tweed', it was fascism with a small 'f'.
She did nothing for the Catholics here, her policies here led to more deaths than in any other PM term. She sat by and let Political Prisoners die in a hunger strike when all they wanted was Political Status and to wear their own clothes. She made Martyrs out of 13 simple Irish Catholics who were willing to die for what they believed right. Naturally she is loved by the middle classes & Unionists here as she 'made the rich richer and the poor poorer'. Let's not even start on the Poll Tax debacle & the Minor Strikes which caused the biggest civil unrest seen in Britain since WWII, or her backing of a Peruvian dictator called Pinocet who regularly massacred anyone who opposed him just to re-conquer a group of small islands in the south Atlantic. Lastly her deep flow of prejudice against anything that didn't agree with her.
So to answer the original question as to if she is liked or loathed, it very much depends on your racial, social and financial status.
Yes. More security cameras and such than any other nation on Earth.Quote:
Originally Posted by nik0tine
Best thing I've read on this thread, and likely the forum. Sums it all up very concisely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hachifusa
What is going on? ignoring the posts by Gerry Adams and Martin Mcguiness. Britain is the most un-socialist country in Europe mostly due to 18 years of Tory rule and 8 years of Labour rule under tory economic ideals. We have one of the lowest tax rates in europe and are an highly competative Captilist society, with low levels of regulation. We are not as some seem to have concluded an stalinist commie country.
Ignoring posts by Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness? Aye, alright Prince Harry :rolleyes:
Just what is your problem mister ? Am I not entitled to my beliefs , that overzealous American style capitalism is the bane of the poor and needy or am I wrong ? Is your society perfect,and moral and just ? Or am I just going to sit back and shut up while everybody maintains the illusion of " the Land of opportunity " - yeah, America the fabulous mountain of gold - you can take it, it's yours ! Oh , that is, if you're white.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hachifusa
I'm not saying that either government is perfect , but I oppose anybody who considers a socialist government inferior because it doesn't thrive on corporate greed !
To answer that: I am against any government that thrives on human sacrifice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Itsunari 2000
To get on the actual topic: I was annoyed with your "tone", not your words. Well, your words were annoying, too, but I recognize your right to your opinion. But you didn't disagree with America - you mocked it, which is why I made the parallel (did you miss that?).
Hate capitalism for whatever reason, but don't make a public mockery of every American who lives (happily) under it.
The last time I checked, I had been told that her protege was none other Tony Blair (due to the fact that Tony worked for her during his high school days).
The legitimate beef I have against her was the fact that she was actually more xenophobic than what the BBC claimed about Jean-Marie Le Pen back in 2002 about his xenophobic act (--sometime during the Thatcher administration, she had been targeting Filipinos when they were escaping Martial Law, which was blessed primarily by Richard "Tricky Dick" Nixon, Henry Kissinger, and occasional support from Ronald Reagan, Gerald Ford, and that speaking of the devil, Margaret Thatcher).