"Dear Mr. President"

Dear Mr. Bush:
Any idea where all our helicopters are? It's Day 5 of Hurricane Katrina and thousands remain stranded in New Orleans and need to be airlifted. Where on earth could you have misplaced all our military choppers? Do you need help finding them? I once lost my car in a Sears parking lot. Man, was that a drag.

Also, any idea where all our national guard soldiers are? We could really use them right now for the type of thing they signed up to do like helping with national disasters. How come they weren't there to begin with?

Last Thursday I was in south Florida and sat outside while the eye of Hurricane Katrina passed over my head. It was only a Category 1 then but it was pretty nasty. Eleven people died and, as of today, there were still homes without power. That night the weatherman said this storm was on its way to New Orleans. That was Thursday! Did anybody tell you? I know you didn't want to interrupt your vacation and I know how you don't like to get bad news. Plus, you had fundraisers to go to and mothers of dead soldiers to ignore and smear. You sure showed her!

I especially like how, the day after the hurricane, instead of flying to Louisiana, you flew to San Diego to party with your business peeps. Don't let people criticize you for this -- after all, the hurricane was over and what the heck could you do, put your finger in the dike?

And don't listen to those who, in the coming days, will reveal how you specifically reduced the Army Corps of Engineers' budget for New Orleans this summer for the third year in a row. You just tell them that even if you hadn't cut the money to fix those levees, there weren't going to be any Army engineers to fix them anyway because you had a much more important construction job for them -- BUILDING DEMOCRACY IN IRAQ!

On Day 3, when you finally left your vacation home, I have to say I was moved by how you had your Air Force One pilot descend from the clouds as you flew over New Orleans so you could catch a quick look of the disaster. Hey, I know you couldn't stop and grab a bullhorn and stand on some rubble and act like a commander in chief. Been there done that.

There will be those who will try to politicize this tragedy and try to use it against you. Just have your people keep pointing that out. Respond to nothing. Even those pesky scientists who predicted this would happen because the water in the Gulf of Mexico is getting hotter and hotter making a storm like this inevitable. Ignore them and all their global warming Chicken Littles. There is nothing unusual about a hurricane that was so wide it would be like having one F-4 tornado that stretched from New York to Cleveland.

No, Mr. Bush, you just stay the course. It's not your fault that 30 percent of New Orleans lives in poverty or that tens of thousands had no transportation to get out of town. C'mon, they're black! I mean, it's not like this happened to Kennebunkport. Can you imagine leaving white people on their roofs for five days? Don't make me laugh! Race has nothing -- NOTHING -- to do with this!
You hang in there, Mr. Bush. Just try to find a few of our Army helicopters and send them there. Pretend the people of New Orleans and the Gulf Coast are near Tikrit.

Yours,
Michael Moore
MMFlint@aol.com
www.MichaelMoore.com


What does everyone think? I know Michael Moore is a bit beyond biased, but he does make a good point.

While a lot of it is true, I really wish people would stop bitching at Bush. And by the way, I'm anti-politic......I hate it. Just so I don't have to choose between presidents, because you'll never know how they turn out. I'm sure Bush is doing his best to help the people of New Orleans. You just can't see what the media says and just think it's true.

Michael Moore. The guy who makes his living by getting together a pack of lies and trying to pass them off as documentaries. And you expect me to read his letter and take it seriously. Yeah, right.

While I don't think Bush should be attacked either, I still think it's an extremely valid point about the war in Iraq. Yes, Bush couldn't have predicted the hurricane, and yes he's doing all he can. But the fact still remains that Bush exaggerated the immediacy of our problems in Iraq, which arguable can be non-existent and it did come to bite him back in the ass.

Bush deserves the loss in approval. But in no way should've been accused of racism.

Seriously, this guy is an idiot. Especially towards the end when he starts to talk about how apparently Bush and Co. left thousands stranded because of their skin color. I really can't stand people who complain yet offer no solutions to a problem. Right now it's important to find solutions and not try to keep the Republicans out of office in '08. I'm sure we'll see another smear campaign documentary by Michael Moore about these events soon enough.

we all know that they were left not because they were black but because they were poor and that may be linked to being black. michael moore.

now is the time to complain and find blame. before it is white washed.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

we all know that they were left not because they were black but because they were poor and that may be linked to being black. michael moore.

now is the time to complain and find blame. before it is white washed.

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That's the correct thing to do here all right. I'd love to hear you go down and tell the people of New Orleans "Sorry, I'm too busy bitching at Bush to help out. I hope you can swim." Can I be a part of the lynch mob?

well being a few thousand miles away i wasn't going to help anyway. like most other people.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

well being a few thousand miles away i wasn't going to help anyway. like most other people.

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How does sitting on your @$$ and not doing a damned thing give you the right to bitch at people who are doing something? They're doing more than you.

Hey, let's all bitch at Cloud No.9, he's doing less than Bush!

but then again i'm not a democratcally elected leader of the richest and most powerful nation on earth. unless you want to start taking your orders from me don't expect me to do more than your president.

I expect you to bother to make an effort before you criticize people who are trying to help.

Michael Moore is an obnoxious jackass. But I still agree with him on certain points. And it's funny that people are complaining about Moore turning this into something political when when the republicans rode 9/11 like a pack mule during the elections. You can't get much more exploitative than that.

The hurricane did not directly harm New Orleans. By Monday afternoon the hurricane had moved on it's way up into Mississippi, leaving New Orleans in the clear. People were celebrating in the streets that the hurricane missed them and that it was business as usual. It was after that that the levy broke and water started to slowly flood New Orleans. People were not evacuated because the engineers in charge of fixing the levy all thought that it would be fixed within a day and a couple of inches of water in the streets wouldn't hurt anyone, after all, New Orleans is below sea level and they're used to pumping water out of their city to keep it dry. After a couple of days did it become apparent that it wouldn't be fixed quickly and that the pumps weren't operating as intended to clear the city and by then the water had risen to dangerous levels.

I'm tired of everyone ragging about poorly this was handled in hindsight. I'm not a Bush person but when you follow the events you see that it was handled properly and only in hindsight was any of the planning wrong.

i got the impression that new orleans was hit by the hurricane. or may correctly the storm surge which broke the levvies.

The blame game doesn't actually do anything to help anyone so why play it?

I wish I could bitch like Michael... :(

the blame game does help. responsibilty breeds change. if you can stand up and say this all went tits up because of this, this and him. then you can say this, this and this needs changing. now. to prevent this ever happening again.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

i got the impression that new orleans was hit by the hurricane. or may correctly the storm surge which broke the levvies.

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Katrina skimmed the Louisiana coast and hammered the Mississippi coast, leaving Biloxi and Gulf Port in pretty bad shape.
http://www.buffalonews.com/graphics/...0830v2path.jpg

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

the blame game does help. responsibilty breeds change. if you can stand up and say this all went tits up because of this, this and him. then you can say this, this and this needs changing. now. to prevent this ever happening again.

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The problems arise when there is no one to blame. We live in a society where no one wants to be responsible yet wants everyone else to be responsible. I imagine it won't be long before someone (or someones) sue the state goverenment, federal government, etc... because they should have prevented their house being flooded. People act like they are due a perfect life with no problems and when problems arise they are due compensation. Ya know, what's why we have flood insurance. Can't afford flood insurance? Doubt it. Flood insurance is cheap, it's just that people won't make it a priority and now they're paying the price for that.

This was an "Oh " natural disaster and people need to accept that and move on rather than try to blame others.

there are blames to be found here. no free evacuation in a disaster that affects everyone. ng priority of looters rather than rescue. poor levy maintenance. warming gulf. lack of food and water after the event. no coordination.

and i don't know how it works in america but here if you live beside a floodable river then either the inusrance company will charge you masses for it or will laugh in your face.

I think people need to get up off their asses and help what's already happened rather than trying to blame people for the misfortune of others. You can sit around all day and shout "Oh we were warned we were warned and no one did anything!" but is that going to magically fix New Orleans and restore all those peoples' lives? No, it's just prolonging suffering and amplifying the pain that these people are going through.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

ng priority of looters rather than rescue

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Wrong. The NG ignored looters to rescue people. That's why there was so much looting. The NG had their hands tied because they were focused on rescuing people.

I agree that this will help New Orleans build a better game plan in the future as far as how to evactuate and levy maintenance, I just hope that that blame doesn't make others try to blame someone as responsible for this, as everyone was under the impression that everything was taken care of and they were well prepared.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

and i don't know how it works in america but here if you live beside a floodable river then either the inusrance company will charge you masses for it or will laugh in your face.

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Well New Orleans wasn't exactly considered built next to a floodable river although it seems that way now. The idea was that they levys, pumps and such were making it just like any other non-floodable area.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

warming gulf

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I just wanted to point out that this is still a theory that is gaining more evidence every day, but it is still just a theory, not fact.

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Originally Posted by DMKA

I think people need to get up off their asses and help what's already happened rather than trying to blame people for the misfortune of others. You can sit around all day and shout "Oh we were warned we were warned and no one did anything!" but is that going to magically fix New Orleans and restore all those peoples' lives? No, it's just prolonging suffering and amplifying the pain that these people are going through.

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[img]http://home.eyesonff.com/images/smilies/heart.gif[/img] DMKA wins.

explain to me what i'm supposed to do to help new orleans just now? and DMKA, rye and skyblade. i do take it you 3 are at home right now not doing anything to help these people either?

new orleans is below sea level. and surrounded by water on 3 sides. you don't get much more floodable than that.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

explain to me what i'm supposed to do to help new orleans just now? and DMKA, rye and skyblade. i do take it you 3 are at home right now not doing anything to help these people either?

new orleans is below sea level. and surrounded by water on 3 sides. you don't get much more floodable than that.

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I'm donating money to every store with a can for it I see. My whole family is donating money to the cause as well. I'm 15. I can't exactly go drive to help people, but I'm doing what I can and not blaming everyone in my sight.

can i ask rye if you donated to sudan? niger? the cause in zimbabwe? ethiopia? rwanda? uganda?

No, actually. But I have donated $25 to Cancer Research not long ago. It feels nice to help. I'm only 15 and I don't have a job.

Here's a better question. Have you?

I think Moore exaggerates to make his point. Sure, as much as we hate every little thing being turned into a political issue, it almost has to be because all of our representatives are ever-seeking of their constituent's vote for the next election. They can't be invisible, you know.

The blame game, as it were, may not be entirely prudent right now, but I guess it has to start sooner or later. I don't necessarily agree with Moore, but more should've been done to prevent this from happening.

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Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

I'm tired of everyone ragging about poorly this was handled in hindsight. I'm not a Bush person but when you follow the events you see that it was handled properly and only in hindsight was any of the planning wrong.

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I can't help but compare this with the constant construction up in the San Francisco Bay Area. They know that, sooner or later, "the big one" is going to hit, and the state has been spending millions of dollars a year retrofitting buildings and bridges and the like to be prepared for that magnitude of a disaster. So far as I've heard, they neglected to keep the levies in top shape and paid the price for it.

so why is new orleans in more requirement of your help than 3 million in niger? the refugees from genocide in rwanda, uganda and sudan? the government enforced starvation in zimbabwe? 30,000 children a day in africa in general even.

because this storm catches the headlines. the people crying you can understand. they could have been your next door neighbour. you feel closer to them in that way. aside from the fact that there are greater disasters this very second this will catch the headlines first. and the headlines are what you donate money to. this tragedy as it is is pushed and pushed and pushed on the first item of the news and the headline of the paper day after day until you feel compelled to act.

it's not acting out of compassion for human suffering otherwise the niger crisis never would have happened. it is acting in the interest of what you are told to care about. and there lies the great problem.

i don't judge you for not giving to charity. i never will. but don't wear it like a badge of honour when you do.

Proximity. That's just humanism, really.

it's not just about proximity. i live across the ocean here and it has been headlines for the last week and first news report also.

it' not geographical proximity. but cultural.

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Originally Posted by cloud no.9

so why is new orleans in more requirement of your help than 3 million in niger? the refugees from genocide in rwanda, uganda and sudan? the government enforced starvation in zimbabwe? 30,000 children a day in africa in general even.

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And why should they be in more need of my help than New Orleans? I'll assume you think these people need more help than those on the south coast, so forgive me if this assumption is inaccurate. I don't judge or question you about who needs the help the most, I just feel glad that you have helped suffering humans (I'll also take the liberty of assuming that you have) in some way.

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because this storm catches the headlines. the people crying you can understand. they could have been your next door neighbour. you feel closer to them in that way. aside from the fact that there are greater disasters this very second this will catch the headlines first. and the headlines are what you donate money to. this tragedy as it is is pushed and pushed and pushed on the first item of the news and the headline of the paper day after day until you feel compelled to act.

it's not acting out of compassion for human suffering otherwise the niger crisis never would have happened. it is acting in the interest of what you are told to care about. and there lies the great problem.

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So because we're told about New Orleans and the rest of the south coast by the media this instantly means that the people there are not suffering and that they do not require help?

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i don't judge you for not giving to charity. i never will. but don't wear it like a badge of honour when you do.

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If you don't judge me on whether or not I donate to charity, then why are you asking if I have? Also I'd appreciate it if you could show me an example of me bragging that I had donated to charity, because I can't seem to find what you're talking about. You asked me a question and I answered it. But for the record, I don't mind if you view me as a great hero or as a sucker for giving any amount of money for charity. I've just tried to give something back.

You missed Fresnos question, Cloud.

Personally, I think youre trying too much of acting like a hypocrite, but if I'm wrong, good for you, and into helping humanity. We gotta help ourselves before we get into anybody elses business.

Question- Why is the US obligated to help EVERYBODY else when they are in need, but when we are in need, we have to support ourselves to contain the situation? Wheres our help there?

The media will provide more coverage of the hurricane's aftermath than of places like Niger because of geographical proximity. Sad as it may be, most Americans don't care what happens halfway across the world unless it involves Americans. Why do you think after every plane crash, the news will say something like "no Americans were onboard"?

If you're gonna rage against something, you may as well rage against the media instead of individuals like Rye and myself. That's futile, of course, because the media is everywhere, but hey.

sorry i did miss fresno's question. i do give money to charity. 10% of my monthly wage.

rye i didn't say you were bragging i was warning you against the trappings of doing so.

i respect anyone that gives money to charity but i will not shun those who don't.

the people in new orleans do not help. but that help cna be gained by far without the international community. the us is not a third world state like niger or sudan. it is the richest and most powerful nation on earth and what is lacking in this disaster is not money but man power and organisation. you can't buy those. food, water, might and money america has plenty of.

hawkeye. it is not solely america's reponsibilty to help. it is all first world nations' duty to end injustice, starvation, suffering and pain in the third world. not the other way around. the us is rich and powerful enough to take car of itself. i doubt uganda is.

fresno is the media not a reflection on society?

the way i figure it is if u dont live close enough to where its happened u aint gotta complain about it, us people in houston have to take care of all these people. theres rival gangs shooting at eatchother down-town, people roaming at nite, its weird.
a lot of the people r coming to our schools too.

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Originally Posted by Rye

The blame game doesn't actually do anything to help anyone so why play it?

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Exactly.

thats exactly the way i see it, if u aint or cant do a better job then someone else then y complain? thats a big problem in America we all complain about our president or the war, when most if not all the soldiers believe in what their fighting for. we just need to support not make things worse.

that's something i would have thought i would hear in nazi germany.

don't criticise. fall in line. you need to support your country. your either for us or against us.

it's not true.

establishing blame prevents repeats of this. that's why we need it.

ok u dont live here, trust me it doesnt help at all. we were doin this years ago and it hasnt helped.

why is pointing out that your country is flawed a bad thing? it's anti-american? un-patriotic?

what???

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

why is pointing out that your country is flawed a bad thing? it's anti-american? un-patriotic?

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You're not an American, so I don't see how it could be either.

How about we're sick of others bitching about how screwed up our country is? It's our country, we know it's screwed up, so sod off back to England and work with your own government.

well first of all i'm not english. never lived in england. probably never will.

no need to be so agsressive.

people dont talk about us because were screwed up, even though were not, i speak the truth when i say alot of people just hate on America because we kick major butt.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

well first of all i'm not english. never lived in england. probably never will.

no need to be so agsressive.

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Fine. Will you please tell me where the hell you do live so that I can stop getting it wrong?!

And, yes, there is a reason to be so agressive. We don't tell you how to run your country, so don't tell us how to run ours.

no people bitch about your for:

africa
the middle east
the un
globalisation
interference
agreession

yup, but the sad thing is they aint got no military so they cant do a damn thing about it.

so the end of the argument is that america wins cos it can oppress these people? what a great country. nazi germany and soviet russia had similar ideas. an iron fist.

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

so the end of the argument is that america wins cos it can oppress these people? what a great country. nazi germany and soviet russia had similar ideas. an iron fist.

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What is America doing to oppress these people?

except from starving them and bombing them? nad supporting regimes that do the same? not a lot really...........

A) How are we starving them?

B) When did we bomb them?

C) When did we support regimes oppressing these people?

what the hell r u talkin about, why do u think were at war to stop regimes that are terrorist affiliated.ohh yeah were bombing and starving them wev'e done more than ur little scotland could ever imagine doing for other countries.

[leeza]*snip*

This post was not necessary. ~ Leeza[/leeza]

starving with trade subsides, debt and lack of aid in third world disasters and crisis's

bombing them, iraq, afghanistan, before in somalia, sudan, libya,

supprting those who do it. israel, russia, zimbabwe, egypt, turkey, uzbekistan.

hello were liberating iraq freeing them from the tyrant sudammmmmmm!!!!!!
of course were bombing them were at WAR with them. the point is wev'e helped al ot of people or countries.y dont u guys do somethin?????

we did. we fought in iraq, afghanistan, bosnia, falkands, korea, burma, israel back in the UN held days.

why not free zimbabwe? uzbekistan? north korea? burma? nepal? sudan? lacking in something?

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

starving with trade subsides, debt and lack of aid in third world disasters and crisis's

bombing them, iraq, afghanistan, before in somalia, sudan, libya,

supprting those who do it. israel, russia, zimbabwe, egypt, turkey, uzbekistan.

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So, by not letting them have our food cheap, we're starving them. Go teach them how to grow their own.

Actually, the ones oppressing them there are their own governments, not the US. Besides it's a WAR. You don't fight those by handing out flowers.

Wow, supporting Israel, who is simply trying to hold it's own territory against a group of insurgents trying to kill them is supporting opression. You're a deluded fool.

And you still haven't said where you're from, so don't bitch at me for getting it wrong anymore.

what r u tryin to say WERE JUST IN IT FOR THE DAMN OIL???????? ill have u know we have plenty of reserve oil in Alaska, and wev'e been using some. were over there cuz of terrorists. GOT THAT.

oh and skyblade hes from scotland, or the UK

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Originally Posted by Cloud No.9

and DMKA, rye and skyblade. i do take it you 3 are at home right now not doing anything to help these people either?

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That's correct, but you see, I'm not saying "OH BUSH KNEW BLAME HIM FOR IT!" or "ITS GOD'S WRATH FOR GAY PEOPLE! BLAME THE GAYS!" or "THE GOVERNMENT JUST PROLONGED HELP BECAUSE OF THE HIGH BLACK POPULATION IN THE AREA! THE GOVERNMENT IS EVIL!"

My point isn't "Oh I'm better than you because I'm helping and you aren't." but rather "If you're going to do something shut the hell up and act. Bitching all day isn't going to do anything but further hurt people emotionally."

i'm scottish if you need to know.

actually that's now what subsidies do. they pay farmers for production not selling those producing artificially cheap food. xheaper than what can be produced in africa (where it would actually be cheaper if subisidies were removed). this puts african farmers out of jobs. no farmers = no food. on top of that are trade tarriffs preventing exports.

jerusalem, the west bank and the gaza strip are conquered jewish lands taken after the pre-emptive 6 day war. shelling refugge camps isn't a nice thing to do.

actually iraq is about land location and iran.

and before we started bombing them thee were no terrorits in iraq. al-qaeda had declared a jihad on the secualr state. had offered to defend saudi from it. had offered iran support as wel. they were not best friends.

so thats y the terrorists r gettin bombed.

because they weren't there before? and it's hard to pick out a terrorist from a few thousand feet up.

ur not makin sense.

you posted "so thats y the terrorists r gettin bombed."

"i'm scottish if you need to know.

actually that's now what subsidies do. they pay farmers for production not selling those producing artificially cheap food. xheaper than what can be produced in africa (where it would actually be cheaper if subisidies were removed). this puts african farmers out of jobs. no farmers = no food. on top of that are trade tarriffs preventing exports.

jerusalem, the west bank and the gaza strip are conquered jewish lands taken after the pre-emptive 6 day war. shelling refugee camps isn't a nice thing to do.

actually iraq is about land location and iran.

and before we started bombing them thee were no terrorits in iraq. al-qaeda had declared a jihad on the secualr state. had offered to defend saudi from it. had offered iran support as wel. they were not best friends."

we're you not referring to iraq (and my last paragraph) with that statement?

ok and ur arguing what????

well im out for today, peace out.

that first of all bombing terrorists from the air is quite random as they are quite hard to pickut from your normal run of the mill garden variety iraqi.

and that the terrorists weren't there before we started bombing iraq anyway.

(last post of the night)

This thread is about Katrina and nothing else. If you all wish to discuss terrorists, Iraq or anything else...go to another thread please.

Michael Moore is quite biased, but everything I've seen of his presents a valid and thought-provoking point. While I don't agree that Bush deserves the blame for everything in the letter, I think he deserves at least partial blame for some of it. Plus, it's damn funny.

The sexy guy above in agreement with I am.

One thing I did learn later today is that the levys were only designed for hurricanes up to category 3. They were never designed to stand up to category 4 or 5 hurricanes.

technically Katrina was a Cat 3 when it hit New Orleans. The levies weren't designed to withstand the huge storm surge associated with a Cat 4 or 5. Katrina's surge wasn't too huge in New Orleans, and thus the problems with the levies didn't appear initially. The breaches developed after the storm passed.

What a lot of people don't know is... The governer of Louisiana has literally 2,000 busses in sequence to remove the less fortunate in situations when weather may prohibit or damage the lands. When notified the situation may become rather vile it was ignored. Now those busses are underwater. The source to evacuate everyone, especially those without transportation was astonishingly denied. The federal leisure cannot step in and make decisions for the state. That is not their job. That is up to the governer of Louisiana.

So bitching and misguiding your angst torwards the president completely defeats the purpose. I apologize for handing out a rude awakening but anyone with the guts to defile the president on behalf of a lacking attitude provided by the governer is quite ignorant. Go do your research. The transportation was there. It was the fault of the state, not the government.

source?

It's located in the washington post. A full section devoted to pointing out Louisiana's ignorance when dealing with the situation. It's sort of hard to ignore a hurricane coming, then aid would be delayed atleast 3 days? I'd have to say, if aid is delayed then it'd be best to use the transportation. It's no secret, the transportation is there.

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"Other federal and state officials pointed to Louisiana's failure to measure up to national disaster response standards, noting that the federal plan advises state and local emergency managers not to expect federal aid for 72 to 96 hours, and base their own preparedness efforts on the need to be self-sufficient for at least that period. "Fundamentally the first breakdown occurred at the local level," said one state official who works with FEMA. "

Did the city have the situational awareness of what was going on within it's borders? The answer was no."

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what about the June 2005 $71.2 million cuts to the Army Corps of Engineers' funding to strengthen levies in and around New Orleans? Those cuts probably didn't have much effect in the last few months, but it indicates a total dismissal of the need to strengthen the levies for the inevitable storm that came last week and was expected to come any year now.

Statement issued by the White House on August 27, 2005:

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The President today declared an emergency exists in the State of Louisiana and ordered Federal aid to supplement state and local response efforts in the parishes located in the path of Hurricane Katrina beginning on August 26, 2005, and continuing. The President's action authorizes the Department of Homeland Security, Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), to coordinate all disaster relief efforts which have the purpose of alleviating the hardship and suffering caused by the emergency on the local population, and to provide appropriate assistance for required emergency measures"

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Bush goes on to say: "Specifically, FEMA is authorized to identify, mobilize, and provide at its discretion, equipment and resources necessary to alleviate the impacts of the emergency."

So two days before the hurricane hit, the President assumed responsibility for coordinating ALL disaster relief efforts. He then specifically gave FEMA the responsibility to head this effort, giving it presidential authorization to mobilize any and all resources necessary to "alleviate the impacts of the emergency."

The government on all levels severely mishandled this whole situation. Hell, the people themselves didn't help matters by refusing to leave when they had the chance. But as soon as the President made that statement, the responsibility was placed in the hands of the Bush administration, and they screwed up royally.

How can anyone claim that pointing the finger at Bush is ignorant?

Because once again it was the state's business before the incident occured. The federal levels cannot interfere without permission from the governer hence Bush leaves vacation after the incident had already happened.

Can you name these levels of government that supposedly messed up? The fact that the public and government did not take proper precaution and actions in advance is not in the hands of the president.

And further more, can you source this? Atleast by media if anything? I've shown my source yet it's pretty much evident. Louisiana's officials were given ample time to make preperations and announcements on the situation. Those were neglected. Sorely said the president could not just ignore a situation and get away with it. It just appears as if another meager attempt to slander the leader of a nation hated by so many.

It's been on so many levels I really get sick of discussing it. The last huge hurricane striking foreign lands. People were upset with Bush and the amount of help offered. Upset about the Middle East pruning, and finally upset with the values a republican shares different from others. It's just ridiculously sought that people attack the president when they can. Not because he is president, but because of whom he is.

I think you're buying into the right wing campaign to pawn the "guilt" off on the locals and act as if the federal government have no culpability. Clearly there were screw-ups all around, and it's despicable, but trying to say "hey it's not our fault, the governor of Louisiana is a dumbass and screwed up, look how great the (former GOP chairman and lobbyist) Governor of Mississippi is by comparison." It's disgusting.

Well that's a better statement. I'm not proclaiming Bush is a saint. By no means do I agree with him fully but to primarily blame the situation on Bush would be a sad assumption. And that is what it seems pouring out of these 3 threads already discussing this issue one way or another.

They knew one day this would come but once again it's not the president's responsibility to make sure Louisiana is protected against weather. That is why the governer and staff over Louisiana is in place. If not, then what are their jobs?

I agree everyone has played a factor in this incident. But I do not agree that Bush carries the load of this catastrophe.

He doesn't carry the load of the this but he will end up doing so because he is the leader of this country and he is failing to lead in a huge crisis. When others can't get their together he is suppose to come in and make them get their together and do everything in his power to make sure things get done ASAP. He waited to do anything and then even when he did come back he still didn't do a whole lot of anything other than touring the damage. It isn't like he told Homeland Secuirty/FEMA to get their act together and mobilize everything in site to get the citizens to safty immediatly no matter the cost. That clearly didn't happen as well as a great many other things.

He might not have had to be there for the start of this mess but as the top dog it is up to him to come in a take care of everything we those who were suppose to take care of the mess failed to do so and find others capable of doing the job.

The text I quoted comes directly from the White House website.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LyingEyes

I agree everyone has played a factor in this incident. But I do not agree that Bush carries the load of this catastrophe.

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Dude, I agree with this. But your posts indicated that you think that Bush shouldn't claim ANY of the responsibility which clearly isn't the case. He's the President of the United States and he did a piss-poor job of leading our nation through this disaster.

Also, I love ed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by edczxcvbnm

He doesn't carry the load of the this but he will end up doing so because he is the leader of this country and he is failing to lead in a huge crisis. When others can't get their together he is suppose to come in and make them get their together and do everything in his power to make sure things get done ASAP. He waited to do anything and then even when he did come back he still didn't do a whole lot of anything other than touring the damage. It isn't like he told Homeland Secuirty/FEMA to get their act together and mobilize everything in site to get the citizens to safty immediatly no matter the cost. That clearly didn't happen as well as a great many other things.


He might not have had to be there for the start of this mess but as the top dog it is up to him to come in a take care of everything we those who were suppose to take care of the mess failed to do so and find others capable of doing the job.

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Well it takes a mistake to happen to notice it period. Proper steps are being taken to correct the ones made. It's not like he knows "this person will make a mistake, replace them." Those whom did not take responsibility are now being replaced by those who can.

It's easy to talk and critisize but I've yet to see any opinions on what one would have personally done. (:

What I would have personally done? For one I wouldn't be on a 5 week vacation ever as president. I would have looked into how prepared we were going to be for a worse case senerio of the any disaster the hurricane would have caused(that means the flood in N.O. wouldn't have been accounted for. In essence everything would have been done differently. You can't place yourself in someone elses position like that when they came into something they should have had a firm grasp on from the start.

They are now replacing people...it is a little late to be doing that. You don't have to fire people on the spot but if they couldn't handle if as it was happening they need to be replaced then. Also why bother replacing those who are not taking responsibility? Why not just replace everyone who is resposible whether they claim to be responsible or not.

As for it takes a mistake to notice it...there should not have been a mistake...or if there was one then not 20 bazillion mistakes like there was. The federal gov shouldn't just leave something like this up to the state. The should help to make sure they are prepared. They can handle the sitch(thank you Kim possible for shortening situation) on their own if they want to but make sure they have the ability to do so and be prepared to step in right away if it turns out they can't do it. If all of this was taken into account then it sure doesn't show. I have a hard time believing this was done at all during Bush's vacation.

If I was a screw up like Bush I would probably be doing about as much as he has...because you know

"Its hard work" - GWB

Haha, I loved how Bush had the nerve to say "I'm cutting my vacation short because of the disaster!" when he had one day left of vacation and has already spent nearly a quarter of his time in office on vacation. He's broken Reagan's record as laziest most vacationing president ever in less than five years that took Reagan his whole eight years. Plus Reagan had Alsheimers. x)

I'd consider staffing the top rungs of FEMA with political cronies with absolutely no disaster management experience to be a big mistake on the part of the President.