FF3 - weird magic structure...

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09-16-2005, 03:57 PM
Peter_20

FF3 - weird magic structure...

I know most of you don't care the slightest about this stuff, but I found the magic "structure" in FF3 to be pretty messed up.
For example, why didn't they put Bolt as LV1 magic, while Fire and Ice were there?
Why did they suddenly do it the correct way with the LV3 magic?
And why in God's name do they put Break BEFORE Ice3?!
It's really disturbing, Ice3 has always, ALWAYS stood BEFORE status stuff like Break, Doom etc.!
The magic placement looks like this in my version, so far:

Fire - Ice - Sleep
Bolt - Venom - Blind
Fire2 - Ice2 - Bolt2 (temporarily correct order)
Break - Ice3 - Shade (Ice3 AFTER BREAK?!)

If I were in charge on this, I would make it look like this:

Fire - Ice - Bolt
Sleep - Venom - Blind
Fire - Ice2 - Bolt2
Break - Shade - Erase

This looks a lot better, and I think most of you agree with me on this.

If they, for some creepy reason, were unable to change the structure, then why didn't they just put it this way?:

Fire - Ice - Sleep
Bolt - Venom - Blind
Fire2 - Ice2 - Bolt2
Ice3 - Break - Shade

I know it's not much of a problem, but I still find this stuff pretty funny.
09-16-2005, 03:59 PM
Flying Mullet

If I remember correctly Bolt does more damage in general than Fire or Ice.

Don't forget that in FFI Ice is level two while Fire and Lit are level one. They were probably mimicing that model.
09-16-2005, 04:04 PM
Kawaii Ryûkishi

They must have been out of their minds!!!!
09-16-2005, 04:05 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

If I remember correctly Bolt does more damage in general than Fire or Ice.

Don't forget that in FFI Ice is level two while Fire and Lit are level one. They were probably mimicing that model.

Yeah, I know about the LV2 Ice, but why?
Fire, Ice and Bolt are "siblings", IMHO, and should be ordered together.
It seems so weird placing ONE of them a level HIGHER everywhere!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kawaii Ryûkishi

They must have been out of their minds!!!!

Couldn't you please stop your sarcasm already?
09-16-2005, 04:09 PM
Flying Mullet

Yeah, your sarcasm is causing small children to starve. :(
09-16-2005, 04:09 PM
boys from the dwarf

so what? in FF1 blizzard was level 2 magic. iy hardly matters.those people at sqare know what there doing so just agree with them and say "this is the way its supposed to be" because it is.
09-16-2005, 04:11 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Yeah, your sarcasm is causing small children to starve. :(

What?
09-16-2005, 06:48 PM
boys from the dwarf

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Yeah, your sarcasm is causing small children to starve. :(

What?

its called sarcasm.
09-16-2005, 07:06 PM
Momiji

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kawaii Ryûkishi

They must have been out of their minds!!!!

Everytime you go sarcastic like that, a small kitten dies. So be nice. ^_^. Just kidding.

But anyway, I think it really doesn't matter, because you get the magic when it's needed. Apparently Bolt is stronger for a reason, just like Ice in FFI.
09-16-2005, 07:31 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twilight Paladin

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kawaii Ryûkishi

They must have been out of their minds!!!!

Everytime you go sarcastic like that, a small kitten dies. So be nice. ^_^. Just kidding.

But anyway, I think it really doesn't matter, because you get the magic when it's needed. Apparently Bolt is stronger for a reason, just like Ice in FFI.

You don't get my point.
I mean WHY do they make ONE of them stronger than the other basic spells in the first place?
It's pretty unneccesary, IMHO.
And why would Fire3 suddenly grow stronger than Ice3 and Bolt3, if the Bolt spells were superior a momet ago?
It makes no sense. :confused:
09-16-2005, 07:33 PM
ljkkjlcm9

honestly it's better the way they have it, if they were all the same level, you'd use fire/ice/bolt however many times, say 5, then your level 2 magic has no damage spells, but now bolt is level 2 so you get say 3 more attack spells, in this case

THE JACKEL
09-16-2005, 07:36 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljkkjlcm9

honestly it's better the way they have it, if they were all the same level, you'd use fire/ice/bolt however many times, say 5, then your level 2 magic has no damage spells, but now bolt is level 2 so you get say 3 more attack spells, in this case

THE JACKAL

They simply could've increased the amount of times you can use the elemental spells.
Don't YOU think it looks a bit strange?
Fire/Ice/Bolt are three different elemental spells, and you expect them to be equal in strength, although superior against certain enemy types.
Sure, but why would ONE of them be GENERALLY stronger than the others?
09-16-2005, 07:37 PM
Flying Mullet

Don't worry about it. It's a game. It doesn't have to make sense. You're in a world of dragons and magic already so it's kind of hard to argue the physics of it all. Maybe magic grows differently there, where bolt starts off strong but doesn't grow in power fast and fire grows exponentially.
09-16-2005, 07:41 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Don't worry about it. It's a game. It doesn't have to make sense. You're in a world of dragons and magic already so it's kind of hard to argue the physics of it all. Maybe magic grows differently there, where bolt starts off strong but doesn't grow in power fast and fire grows exponentially.

Well, since Fire/Ice/Bolt are "siblings" (starting in the second part, where all of them are buyable for equal prices in the first town, Altea) it would feel better if all of them were equal in general strength as well.
Putting ONE of them on a higher level just seems pretty weird to me.
09-16-2005, 07:43 PM
Flying Mullet

Maybe they did it so that there's a useful spell at just about every level. I know in FFI I tend to skip levels of spells because there's nothing useful, Level 2 White Magic for instance.
09-16-2005, 07:58 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Maybe they did it so that there's a useful spell at just about every level. I know in FFI I tend to skip levels of spells because there's nothing useful, Level 2 White Magic for instance.

Well, that could be a reason (although that doesn't change my views of the looks of it all).
That also explains why the magics are always "equal" when there is this "normal" MP system.
They were equal in FF2 cuz there were no "level spells", right?
If so, then THAT makes sense!
09-16-2005, 08:01 PM
Flying Mullet

Yeah, perhaps they did spread them all out so that you don't chew up all of your magic in one level.

Also, I haven't played D&D in years, but isn't it set up similarly where you have levels of spells? Perhaps they were modeling their magic after that.
09-16-2005, 08:52 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Yeah, perhaps they did spread them all out so that you don't chew up all of your magic in one level.

Also, I haven't played D&D in years, but isn't it set up similarly where you have levels of spells? Perhaps they were modeling their magic after that.

Eh, "D&D"?
09-16-2005, 08:57 PM
Flying Mullet

Dungeons and Dragons
09-16-2005, 09:36 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Dungeons and Dragons

Dunno, man, I don't even know what D&D actually *is*.
09-16-2005, 09:53 PM
ljkkjlcm9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flying Mullet

Dungeons and Dragons

yeah but D&D has spells like magic missle, not fire, ice and bolt

THE JACKEL
09-16-2005, 10:00 PM
Flying Mullet

Well they can't use the same spells or it'd be copyright infringement. :rolleyes2

They might have based their magic system design off of D&D's.
09-16-2005, 10:25 PM
DocFrance

It's a well known fact that FFI was heavily based on Dungeons and Dragons.
09-16-2005, 10:36 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by DocFrance

It's a well known fact that FFI was heavily based on Dungeons and Dragons.

Don't you mean Dragon Quest? :D
09-17-2005, 06:52 PM
abrojtm

No, he means Dungeons and Dragons.
09-17-2005, 07:37 PM
Peter_20

Quote:

Originally Posted by abrojtm

No, he means Dungeons and Dragons.

Where's the smiley? :eek:
Don't be so serious! :D
09-17-2005, 09:59 PM
KoShiatar

He's serious. I'm a D&D player and you can find a LOT of things in common. I shall make a small random list.

-Some classes, like the Thief which is one of D&D's most classic classes. Also, the basic Mages (White, Black and Red) are the same of the basic Dragonlance campaign setting.

-A lot of spells, sucha as Haste, Levita(tion) and the like.

-Monsters galore. These include Sahagin, Ghoul, Wraith, Mind Flayer (one of D&D's most famous monsters!), dragons (duh), Lich (in FF 1 , it is the Fiend of Earth, and in FF IV the Fiend of Earth is an undead creature as well), and Tiamat, which in D&D is the goddess of evil dragons and is represented as a many-headed dragon.

This is just something to begin with. I'm sure Kishi or someone else will come and make a more complete list. Actually, I always wondered why those who have the rights over D&D didn't sue Squaresoft back then.
09-17-2005, 11:47 PM
Kawaii Ryûkishi

Quote:

Originally Posted by KoShiatar

Actually, I always wondered why those who have the rights over D&D didn't sue Squaresoft back then.

Legend has it that the reason Square changed the appearance of the Beholder in every version of the game after the original Japanese version was due to fear of just such a lawsuit.

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