Not So Good...

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11-11-2005, 01:10 AM
TurkSlayer

Not So Good...

I was reading the review for Romance SaGa in GameInformer (I think that was it, anyway) and they were talking about how terrible it is. So I started thinking, most SquareEnix games outside of FF (And even some of those) aren't that great. The KH series is good, SO3 wasn't bad, and Chrono Trigger/Cross and Vagrant Story are pretty good, but the rest of what they make hasn't been that great. Unlimited SaGa, Romance SaGa, The Bouncer, Crystal Chronicles, X-2, and others aren't well known as being too good. Not to mention much of the stuff Squaresoft made before FF. King's Knight made me want to jump off a bridge. I don't know, what do the rest of you think?
11-11-2005, 01:27 AM
DJZen

Yeah, Xenogears was a TERRIBLE game. Square should NEVER have made THAT.

Square games are hit or miss. Most of their games aren't really as good as they're cracked up to be, but they get so much praise from fanboys that you'd never know it.
11-11-2005, 01:29 AM
Spatvark

The Mana series are probably the best thing Square ever did as a collective whole (as in, best series of games, though individually they're not the best games Square have ever made). Crystal Chronicles, for what it was, was actually pretty good, it just requires you to, y'know, have friends to play it with. XD We all know the Chrono games owned as did Vagrant Story.

When it comes down to it, Square haven't released that many bad RPGs lately, it's in their forays into other fields that they've failed miserably. Which is why Dirge of Cerberus is likely to suck XD

As for the Enix games, they've churned out a fair few awesome games, but I have to admit, I know far less about them than the Square ones, so I can't comment too well on their progress, so yeah, back to the point I made about Square's non-RPG games. I guess that's the point of my post XD
11-11-2005, 01:29 AM
TurkSlayer

Sorry, I always forget about Xenogear. I've never played it myself, so I don't really know much about it.
11-11-2005, 05:38 AM
Lord Chainsaw

It really depends on the reviewer. Some reviewers really aren't that good. I haven't played Romancing SaGa, nor have I played the remake, but it wouldn't surprise me if the sentiment they held for it was similar to the rest of the series, which is misguided.

Final Fantasy games are good in themselves, but they are nowhere near the only good games produced by Squaresoft, and definitely not Enix. Dragon Quest alone carries Enix in Japan. Although I really don't see why. Personally, although DW1-4 were really cool for their time, I think the Dragon Warrior series on the whole is bland, stale, repetitive, and needs to die out. Think of level grinding in an MMORPG. Now think of doing that in Dragon Warrior... except with nobody else around. Regardless, it is a titanic series along with Final Fantasy.

While Final Fantasy is definitely the most popular RPG franchise outside of Japan, that doesn't mean it is the only thing Square has to offer. They do more than just FFVI, FFVII and Chrono Trigger. Try looking past the extremely popular games from these companies and you'll uncover some real gems:

(I'm personally going to star the ones I think better than the majority of the Final Fantasy series)

SaGa 1*, 2, and Frontier 2
Actraiser 1* and 2
EVO: The Search for Eden*
The Soulblazer Trilogy*
The Secret of Evermore*
Secret and Legend of Mana
Xenogears*
Vagrant Story*
Chocobo's Mysterious Dungeon 2

I like the respect that Final Fantasy gets as a series, but it is a little disheartening as well, because it discourages Square from going outside the series. We have Matsuno who did an incredible stand alone game outside the series, but now even he is being dragged into it. Square-Enix cannot operate solely on Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy.
11-11-2005, 05:48 AM
Spatvark

The good thing about Matsuno being dragged into FF12 is that if he does it well enough, and if he so wishes, he could probably get to do a Vagrant Story sequel =D?
11-11-2005, 08:08 AM
Vyk

Isn't he the one that had the breakdown though?
12-11-2005, 05:10 AM
SoulTaker

Not so good
12-11-2005, 06:48 AM
Ishin Ookami

Square was pertty consistant in the quality of their titles during the 8-bit and 16-bit era's, its just that during the 32-bit era their focus shifted. They had always been a company that could do some grand production values, but with the CD medium they could really go nuts, and they did. Add to that their plan to take over RPG's outside of japan, by dumbing the whole thing down with FFVII and well... they sort of shot themselves in the foot. Now they are a company that focuses primarily on graphics, and less on gameplay and solid storytelling. Alot of their key staff during their more consistant days have left, and those that remain just aren't as gifted as sakaguchi, amano, Uematsu, Mitsuda, ect.

The 32-bit era they were just all over the place, I loved the first bushido blade but almost threw up when I saw the second. Einhander was a great shooter, Final Fantasy VII was a decent RPG overall, but way too overhyped. All the way through I kept asking myself where was the challenge that was present in VI? Why arent there any epic battles that require the use of all your party members as there was in VI? Where were the uber deep character development that I loved so much in VI? Why is the battle system now way too simplified? But FFVII, for the most part, was alright. It was VIII that made me want to throw up for all its crapness, then IX came along and reminded me of why I onced loved the series so much (welcome back sakaguchi and amano).

And now, Last game by them I liked was FFX. Thats it. They are in a real slump lately and hopefully they can pull out.
12-11-2005, 11:48 AM
UWAOOOOU

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurkSlayer

I was reading the review for Romance SaGa in GameInformer (I think that was it, anyway) and they were talking about how terrible it is. So I started thinking, most SquareEnix games outside of FF (And even some of those) aren't that great. The KH series is good, SO3 wasn't bad, and Chrono Trigger/Cross and Vagrant Story are pretty good, but the rest of what they make hasn't been that great. Unlimited SaGa, Romance SaGa, The Bouncer, Crystal Chronicles, X-2, and others aren't well known as being too good. Not to mention much of the stuff Squaresoft made before FF. King's Knight made me want to jump off a bridge. I don't know, what do the rest of you think?

Crystal Chronicles and X-2 were very good games. The bouncer wasnt exactly meant to be awesome. It was like, this is what we're easily capable of on the PS2. SaGa games usually suck. I dont think they make them, themselves, they just publish them. Same goes for Star Ocean, although thats a nice series to have your name on. Same goes for Grandia. KH, FF and DQ are all awesome series. Radiata Stories which they published was also pretty good.
12-11-2005, 03:43 PM
crashNUMBERS

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJZen

Yeah, Xenogears was a TERRIBLE game. Square should NEVER have made THAT.

You never know. Maybe the kid hasn't played Xenogears. And if he has then it's his opinion...

And for the record on Gamespot's staff opinions...

Kingdom Hearts - 8.2
Kingdom Hearts: Chain Of Memories - 7.7
Star Ocean 3: Till The End Of Time - 7.9
Chrono Cross - 10.0
Vagrant Story - 9.6
Unlimited SaGa - 4.3
Romancing SaGa - 6.0
The Bouncer - 6.7
Final Fantasy: Crystal Chronicles - 8.0
Final Fantasy X2 - 8.1
12-11-2005, 03:48 PM
TurkSlayer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos Prophecy.Crash..

You never know. Maybe the kid hasn't played Xenogears. And if he has then it's his opinion...

Crash, your calling ME a kid!? :mad2: :mad2: :mad2:

No, I had just forgotten it was a SquareEnix game.
12-11-2005, 06:06 PM
Dreddz

Romance SaGa is good, I am not regretting forking out £40 on it.
The only game I believe they truely messed up on was Unlimited Saga, damn that game was bad........there other games are good or to personal taste .....
12-12-2005, 11:53 PM
DJZen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami

Square was pertty consistant in the quality of their titles during the 8-bit and 16-bit era's

I'm going to have to disagree with you on that. Have you ever played
3D Worldrunner? Before FF came out Square really didn't know what to do with themselves. Even after that they sometimes seemed a little... iffy. Some people curse Square for only giving us some of those games, others thank them.
12-27-2005, 06:04 PM
Ilyn

The Bouncer got a 6.7?! XD

I guess it isn't that bad. It's just... there's not much too it. And right now I'm stuck and can't beat that psycho guy who had that crazy operation and it makes me angry because even if I skip all the cut scenes it still takes me 20 minutes to get back there. Graaargh.

It's like... watching a movie. And then some button mashing. Then more movie.
12-27-2005, 07:03 PM
Omnislash07

Quote:

Final Fantasy VII was a decent RPG overall, but way too overhyped. All the way through I kept asking myself where was the challenge that was present in VI? Why arent there any epic battles that require the use of all your party members as there was in VI? Where were the uber deep character development that I loved so much in VI? Why is the battle system now way too simplified? But FFVII, for the most part, was alright.

It is true that FF7 was easy to us the hardcore that find every item kill every secret boss and do every sidequest but to the average joe who just buys the game to have a little fun the game is probably a challenge. Square-Enix is a company meant to make money and that means finding the largest audience for their games that they can, so they make the core game less difficult but then add in lots of sidequests that the hardcore will find more difficult. The lack of epic battles was a good thing, unless you spent a lot of time levelling up all of you characters equally then those battles always turned out to be your main party running around killing everything while the rest of your people sit back and watch. How was the character development so deep in 6... you could teach each person magic and that was about it. The same goes for 7 but it is the materia that learns the magic and not the characters which is nice so you can switch out party members and not have to relearn a bunch of spells. How did they simplify the battle system? It was exactly the same except instead of each character haveing 1 special ability you could give each character a bunch of special abilities using yellow materia.

Quote:

It was VIII that made me want to throw up for all its crapness, then IX came along and reminded me of why I onced loved the series so much (welcome back sakaguchi and amano).

8 was crap and 9 was awesome...omg you are messed up dude.
12-28-2005, 04:31 AM
TurkSlayer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omnislash07

8 was crap and 9 was awesome...omg you are messed up dude.

I agree with Ishin on this.
12-28-2005, 04:47 AM
Winter Nights

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurkSlayer

I agree with Ishin on this.

I don't on the grounds that VIII was the better of the three. VII was decent and IX was good, but hard to get into at times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami

(welcome back sakaguchi and amano)

And I distinctly remember reading that Sakaguchi wasn't as involved with IX, due to working on FF: The Spirits Within. And he directed and was heavily involved with VII and at least more so involved with VIII than IX, due already explained reasons.
12-28-2005, 05:06 AM
TurkSlayer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autumn Rain

I don't on the grounds that VIII was the better of the three. VII was decent and IX was good, but hard to get into at times.

I found VIII harder to understand than IX, but that might be because I was so bored.:D

Seriously though, VIII is among my least favorite in the series, beaten only by X-2 and maybe V. About level with I.