In your opinion, who is the most smart and manipulative main villain in the FF series, and why?
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In your opinion, who is the most smart and manipulative main villain in the FF series, and why?
Sephiroth would be the best.
This isn't for the best villian, it's for the most manipulative.
Sephiroth isn't even manipulative. He's not involved for half the game and it's Jenova that's doing any manipulating of the clones and whatnot.
From the poll, I'd have to go with Kuja, as he's behind the scenes for much of the game, truely manipulating what happens in the world of FFIX.
OK, I had to add other to this poll. Because really, none of those villains hold a candle to the likes of the FFT villains.
So in this case, I'd say Dycedarg or (if you want to count him) Delita. They raise manipulation to an art form.
for all the ones which i have played (from PlayStation and up) - Ultimecia. taking control of other sorceresses. that's why Final Fantasy VIII was such absolute fun.
In my opinion, Ultimecia is the most manipulative. Manipulated President Delling and the entire Galbadia army, become ruler of Galbadia, make her enemys(Gardens and Seeds) fight against each other, created a very cool plan to free Adel(Lunatic Pandora going to the Lunar's Point, Ultimecia/Rinoa freeing Adel, the Lunar Cry hapening, and throwing Adel inside the LP. All of this hapening in the same time, with a perfect precision), and in the end, she needed time to complete the process of Time Compressio(to be capable of absorbing time) and because of this, she make the monsters of her castle steal the abilitys of the heros, to make them waste their time fighting against them, while the Time Compression was hapening.
She is very manipulative.
Bantam said:
"Sephiroth isn't even manipulative. He's not involved for half the game and it's Jenova that's doing any manipulating of the clones and whatnot."
The Ultimania Guide said that Sephiroth was controlling Jenova during the game.
Edit by Kishi: Don't double-post.
SCREW YOU ALL!!!
Why must you dis Sephie like that.
Behold the Void said:
"OK, I had to add other to this poll. Because really, none of those villains hold a candle to the likes of the FFT villains.
So in this case, I'd say Dycedarg or (if you want to count him) Delita. They raise manipulation to an art form."
I don't put the FFT villain in the poll, exactly because of this. They will win for sure. Puting the FFT villain in a poll like this, is the same thing as puting Sephiroth in a poll that said "Who is the more badass villain?".
Except that putting Sephiroth in a "Who is the more badass villain?" poll doesn't compare because he would get some votes, but not a majority.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Crystal
Bantam said:
"Except that putting Sephiroth in a "Who is the more badass villain?" poll doesn't compare because he would get some votes, but not a majority."
Do you think so? Because in another forums, when someone create a poll like this, Sephiroth allways win.
PS: How i can answer someone with the quote of this someone? Because the "Reply with quote" link, is not working.
Every thread we've had on the topic here has always resulted in a three-way split between Kefka, Sephiroth and Kuja with a few random others sprinkled in. Are you visiting FFVII fan sites? That might explain why there is so much love for Sephiroth wherever it is you frequent, because I've never seen one villian "sweep" the rest of the competition. That's part of what makes the series so great, as there isn't a clear-cut winner or loser and there's always room for debate.
As to the quote function not working, the forums were just updated, so the bugs are being worked out. See the announcements for more information.
I agree with Void about FFT. That game was full of manipulaters. Hell, one of the chapter titles has the word manipulater in it, I believe. Dycedarg, Vormav, Delita. They win the Most Manipulative Villain Award.
I'm kind of holding out for Vayne. FFXII was written and directed by Matsuno, the same guy behind FFT and Vagrant Story, and the game's cast allegedly have a number of underhanded political agendas between them.
Ultimecia.
How could you not put Seymour in? He takes over the church of Yu Yevon and makes everybody in Spira trust him.
I bet you the "Others" are all him.
2nd most manipulative is Kuja. Theres a very large gap after that.
I kind of like the whole "Kain is being manipulated by Golbez, who is being manipulated by Zemus, who is in turn being controlled by his anger: Zeromus" that FFIV had going on.
But really, none of these character come close to ExDeath. He manages to take out the first set of Crystals in World One without even having a body, half the time getting the protagonists to do most of the work for him. He then takes out the rest of the Crystals in world 2 in much the same way, followed by merging the worlds back into one (manipulating dimensions is quite a lot of manipulation). Then you think he's dead by OH SNAPZ HE'S STILL ALIVE HE TURNED HIMSELF INTO A THORN.
You know I can't really remember why Exdeath is manipulative now, but he's such a tank that there is no way he couldn't be the absolute greatest at everything. Man Exdeath is awesome. I'm going to go jerk off to how awesome he is.
brb
In that you acknowledged FFT in such a manner, you are now decidedly awesome :D
But yes, I do agree with 'Kishi, I've high hopes for XII.
The most manipulative FF villain is probably Ultimecia. She manipulated Seifer, Edea, Rinoa, and other sorceresses throughout the game in order to get what she want. She was the real villain from the very beginning, and controlled one person after the other to make them seem like the villains.
Off all FF's I played and finished, Kuja. And because I kinda spoil myself too much I already know Ultimecia must be ver manipulative, controlling Edea and all those others. So yeah, those two.
Kuja. Hands down. :D The "Light" version of the Emperor is a pretty close second, though.
How was Emperor Lite especially manipulative? His trickiness didn't extend beyond saying, "I'm actually not evil, so you shouldn't want to fight me. Seriously. Really."
watch your tongue. no ones "dissing" sephiroth but it is true. its mainly jenova who is doing the manipulating and sephiroth doesnt do much for most of the game. why dont you explain your reasons for saying that sephiroth is the most manipulative? i think kuja. he so easily decieves brahne and reigns terror upon the world without anyone noticing most of the time. he also does some great stuff on disk 3. ultimecia is manipulative but i dont think shes as good at it as kuja. E.G. kuja just walks into alexandria castle and fools everyone but ultimecia is doing it in the future where no one can touch her. and im not sure if mind control is as clever and interesting as the things kuja does. ultimecia might be more effective when manipulating but kuja is better at it in my opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by FiragaBreak
As much as I thought Tactics' story wasn't too radically different from the other FF stories (with more...betrayal, everywhere), I would have to agree it's villains were a step up from the others (in about everything, especially manipulation), even with the game's inadequate localization. I also have high hopes for XII's villain. (I've only seen one video of him.)
Ultros.
Though Kefka is my favourite FF villain of all time, he isn't that manipulative. For this one I'd have to go with Kuja, what with the (SPOILER)causing a massive war and all.
Ulty!!!!
I thought Shuyin was pretty darn manipulative, for obvious reasons.
I picked Yu Yevon. He convinced an entire nation for 1000 years into turning him into a religion and doing whatever he says while he rips the place to shreds.
I voted for Kuja.
Let's see......
Seymour-Need I say more?
JENOVA-Need I say EVEN MORE?
Ultimecia-Need I say EVEN EVEN MORE?
Kuja-NEED I SAY EVEN EVEN EVEN MORE?
Yes, please say more. :p
it would be nice to know your reasoning and also firaga breaks reasoning for sephiroth.
Your only real choices here are FFIV, VIII, IX and T, cause they're by far the manipulative villians.
THE JACKEL
Sephiroth, Ultimecia and Yu Yevon.
Guys, you have to remember that the Ultimania Guide said that Sephiroth was controlling Jenova.
I suppose Yu Yevon, because he was able to trick people into becoming his followers. And they all bought into it.
I'm going to say Kuja, he manipulated an entire nation to start a continental war.
Though these people in FFT sound like manipulative bastards.
Regardless of whether Sephiroth was controlling Jenova or vice-versa, neither was that manipulative, so it doesn't matter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Behold the Void
Seymour is definitely manipulative. Think back to what he told wakka right before Operation Mi'ihen. "Pretend you didn't see them." "Pretend I didn't say it"
I can't remember sephiroth manipulating anyone. He didn't say much of anything for that matter, he just stabbed people. Edea/Adel and Ultimecia brain washed people, but that's hardly true manipulation. That's just puppetry. Seymour is sly and disconcerting.
Kefka wasn't so much manipulative so much as whiny and insano.
I vaguely remember Golbez having a bit of a manipulative streak in that he kidnapped Rosa, but I haven't played ff4 in a while :p
But really, I think seymour wins the prize for this one.
rubah said:
"Edea/Adel and Ultimecia brain washed people, but that's hardly true manipulation. That's just puppetry."
Well...
"In my opinion, Ultimecia is the most manipulative. Manipulated President Delling and the entire Galbadia army, become ruler of Galbadia, make her enemys(Gardens and Seeds) fight against each other, created a very cool plan to free Adel(Lunatic Pandora going to the Lunar's Point, Ultimecia/Rinoa freeing Adel, the Lunar Cry hapening, and throwing Adel inside the LP. All of this hapening in the same time, with a perfect precision), and in the end, she needed time to complete the process of Time Compressio(to be capable of absorbing time) and because of this, she make the monsters of her castle steal the abilitys of the heros, to make them waste their time fighting against them, while the Time Compression was hapening.
She is very manipulative."
Note that i don't said anything about controlling the sorceresses. Ultimecia is a puppeter AND a manipulator.
I always felt Kuja, Kefka, Zemus, and Cloud of Darkness were very manipulative
I disagree; remember that time that Sephiroth killed Aeris? Before she was stabbed, he manipulated Cloud into almost killing her; however, Cloud caught himself in the last minute.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bantam
I just finished Disc I of Final Fantasy IX and Find Kuja quite manipulative.
EXACTLY! However thus far, Ultimecia is the most manipulative; controlling Sorceress Edea then Rinoa and Adel accross different time periods all at the same time? She pwns everyone!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Crystal