wizard rant

So I'm making my way through the Marsh Cave with no real difficulties at all. I've got a well-balanced party of a Fighter, Red Mage, Black Belt, and White Mage (which I consider to be the second strongest party in the game). I've got a nice supply of HEAL and PURE potions. Everything is going smoothly. The only thing left is to take out these wizards so I can grab the crown and move out.

I step in front of the chest and, as expected, two wizards approach. My fighter and black belt queue up to attack the first one and my red mage prepares to cast LIT on him. My white mage gets ready to put INVS on my fighter. I'm feeling pretty good. I figure I've got a decent chance of taking out one of the wizards by the end of the first round and, depending on when my white mage gets off the INVS, a reasonable chance of dodging an attack on my fighter (about a 75% chance that at least one of the wizards will attack him). Not to mention, there's only 2 wizards - I could just as easily be up against 3 or 4 of them, which would make the battle considerably more difficult. This battle should be a push over, right?

WRONG. My red mage hits the wizard with LIT and deals...11 dmg. 11! I could understand if he only hit for like 25 or 30, maybe he just got a bad hit or something...but 11 - that is NOT weak against LIT. That's strong against LIT. What if I use FIRE, is that only supposed to deal like 5 dmg or something?? At least my fighter gets off a decent hit for 50 or so, but guess what? The wizard isn't dead, because my red mage only hit him for 11. Even my white mage comes through and shields my fighter with INVS in time, and not one, but TWO wizards attack him. The ideal situation for me, except for one problem. INVS doesn't do Jack McDick. Both attacks hit my fighter multiple times, for a combined total of over 80 dmg.

And why the hell are they even called "wizards" anyway? As far as I can tell, the only thing these guys are good at is bashing the crap out of my fighter with their staves. Admittedly, I probably shouldn't be trying to take these guys on at level 6, but still. You're telling me that these wizards can repeatedly beat my fighter over the head with nothing but physical attacks? Unbelievable.

They are really named PiscoDemons. Bad translation stuff.
Is this your first play through?

I'd recommend Dr. Unne's site.

they can cast spells too, but clearly they don't need to bother in your case.

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Originally Posted by Decessus

They are really named PiscoDemons. Bad translation stuff.
Is this your first play through?

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First time with this particular party. I've beaten them before with a black mage but not with a white mage. INVS is just a lousy spell as far as I'm concerned.

I admit I probably over-reacted a bit. Next time I'm going to get LIT2 and hope for better results. It didn't seem worth it at 1500 G for 1 shot, but LIT just isn't cutting it at 11 dmg.

Your best bet if you don't have level 2 spells is to take the marsh cave one room at a time; Go in, come out, heal, go in, come out heal, etc.

Your better off having your Red Wizard attack than using LIT. Wizards aren't too terribly weak against LIT (it's just more effective than the other spells), and the Red's lower black magic power isn't stong enough to make up for it. His attack is stronger.

That's my favorite party.

I like physical attacks more because you don't run out of them. I only ever have a mage cast a spell if I really need it.

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Originally Posted by theundeadhero

Your better off having your Red Wizard attack than using LIT. Wizards aren't too terribly weak against LIT (it's just more effective than the other spells), and the Red's lower black magic power isn't stong enough to make up for it. His attack is stronger.

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I could understand if it said they resisted FIRE and ICE, but didn't resist LIT, but weren't weak against it either...that would make more sense to me. You're right though, at some point it just isn't cost effective to use FIRE or LIT with a red mage because his physical attack becomes as good or stronger (probably would have done around 20 dmg instead of 11). That's the main reason why I prefer a black mage over a white mage - so I can use the red mage for white magic instead, which is largely done outside of battle.

I know this is a late response, but...

Yeah, LIT is the weak point. If you cast LIT2 as opposed to FIR2 or ICE2, you'll see that LIT will do the most damage.
Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to have the same damage ratios as it would against a Sahag. Sorry, what can I say.

But you read the book right, and it's the truth. LIT magic does more damage to a wizard than fire or ice, and LIT2 is the best ticket through that fight (other than a silver sword). It just isn't a hard-core weak point, I guess. And the numbers tell all.


EDIT: I just, like, said the EXACT same thing twice.

Clarification time. Piscodemons are not weak to lightning, it's that they aren't resistant to it. (Whereas they are resistant to Fire, Ice, and damn near everything else.) They also have an absurdly high Magic Defense. Really, you're better off just attacking.

Try beating them at level 4...

how do you use a party with both a redmage and a blackbelt. Come to the end of the game and one of them will have really crappy absorb. unless you get them up to really high levels of course. i played through with the default party(Fi,Th,BB,RM) and i had put my master on the bottom spot and had my red wizard with the opal bracelet among other stuff. but still when the master would get hit by a ghost or a dragon of some sort he would be on his knee. I this was at like level 30-32. I had to get this party around lvl 40 to beat it. I like that party but replace the black belt with a thief. It gives some extra defense and a little more black magic. And all the characters at the end of the game are red which is pretty cool i think.

I easily beat the game with a KN, BB, RW, WW (in that order) at mid-twenties on the NES version. Don't give the BB any armor, or a weapon.

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Originally Posted by Nerevarine

how do you use a party with both a redmage and a blackbelt. Come to the end of the game and one of them will have really crappy absorb. unless you get them up to really high levels of course. i played through with the default party(Fi,Th,BB,RM) and i had put my master on the bottom spot and had my red wizard with the opal bracelet among other stuff. but still when the master would get hit by a ghost or a dragon of some sort he would be on his knee. I this was at like level 30-32. I had to get this party around lvl 40 to beat it. I like that party but replace the black belt with a thief. It gives some extra defense and a little more black magic. And all the characters at the end of the game are red which is pretty cool i think.

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Yeah, the BB has bad defense, and is prone to dying. That's why smart players use knights.

The thing to remember is this:
1. BB does the most damage, even more than a knight with Masmune at high levels like 45-50.
2. The game can easily be beaten with knights at lv. 30 or so by killing enemies and not taking personal damage, even if they don't overkill Worms by 200-300 damage.

So, you have a decision to make. Do you take the BB who will kill the bosses faster IF he's alive, because he will probably die, or do you take the knight who will kill the bosses unconditionally.

You know the answer.

ya know i always see everyone talkin bout how hard the wizards are. ihave never had a lot of trouble with em. it all the poison and paralysis in the cave that gets to me

have you tried leveling up more beforehand? if you can't cast LIT2 by the time you're in the Marsh Cave, you shouldn't be in the Marsh Cave.