Quote Originally Posted by TyphoonThaReapa View Post
It matters not what they accomplished. What Their capable of is what this thread is about.
Everything matters on what they have accomplished. They could have all been capable of doing more under certain conditions. But they are not given the conditions on what they would have liked, so wouldn't we look at what they were able to do? A person being capable of doing something doesn't matter at all if they didn't do it.

Quote Originally Posted by The Crystal View Post
ignore the evidence presented in FFVIII
You mean the one sentence of scan information?

Also, I do think Zeromus should get mentioned. Zeromus was after all, the epitome of Zemus' hate and he was "invincible." What I mean is, the party was unable to hurt him and he was also able to take down the party, like Kuja (Though they were revived by their friends). But somehow, by Cecil using The Crystal (no, not the person who posted on this thread ) he was weakened.