EoFF Tournament Returns!

[Azure Chrysanthemum]

Physically as a Ronso Khimari is stronger and more agile, but we must remember that Tidus was able to take him on even footing at the beginning of FFX.

Balthier's had a good deal of training to him already and (and this is the clincher) is a gun specialist. Guns have a lot of stopping power, especially against stronger foes as they can penetrate armor and tough hides (Khimari having more of the latter than the former).

Balthier's quick enough to get a few shots off, which should do plenty to down Khimari. From the way it was portrayed, Ronso have an edge against humans in physical combat, but the gap is far from overwhelming and they don't possess an unnaturally high toughness.

[Cledarius]

Kimahri

While Balthier has to load his gun and aim for Kimahri, Kimahri has more than enough time to attack and strike Balthier down.

[Goldenboko]

Physically as a Ronso Khimari is stronger and more agile, but we must remember that Tidus was able to take him on even footing at the beginning of FFX.

Balthier's had a good deal of training to him already and (and this is the clincher) is a gun specialist. Guns have a lot of stopping power, especially against stronger foes as they can penetrate armor and tough hides (Khimari having more of the latter than the former).

Balthier's quick enough to get a few shots off, which should do plenty to down Khimari. From the way it was portrayed, Ronso have an edge against humans in physical combat, but the gap is far from overwhelming and they don't possess an unnaturally high toughness.

... Yeah what he said!

[Hazzard]

Physically as a Ronso Khimari is stronger and more agile, but we must remember that Tidus was able to take him on even footing at the beginning of FFX.

Balthier's had a good deal of training to him already and (and this is the clincher) is a gun specialist. Guns have a lot of stopping power, especially against stronger foes as they can penetrate armor and tough hides (Khimari having more of the latter than the former).

Balthier's quick enough to get a few shots off, which should do plenty to down Khimari. From the way it was portrayed, Ronso have an edge against humans in physical combat, but the gap is far from overwhelming and they don't possess an unnaturally high toughness.

... Yeah what he said!

Balthier.

Nicely explained by BtV, as expected.

[qwertysaur]

Physically as a Ronso Khimari is stronger and more agile, but we must remember that Tidus was able to take him on even footing at the beginning of FFX.

Balthier's had a good deal of training to him already and (and this is the clincher) is a gun specialist. Guns have a lot of stopping power, especially against stronger foes as they can penetrate armor and tough hides (Khimari having more of the latter than the former).

Balthier's quick enough to get a few shots off, which should do plenty to down Khimari. From the way it was portrayed, Ronso have an edge against humans in physical combat, but the gap is far from overwhelming and they don't possess an unnaturally high toughness.

That is a very valid argument, but the in game mechanics of FFXII are that guns are the slowest weapon to use. So it does come down to the gun against the spear/lancet, but this would still be a close battle.

[jammi567]

I would probally have to go for Balthier. No particular reason (except that i'm playing XII at the minute).

[Slothy]

That is a very valid argument, but the in game mechanics of FFXII are that guns are the slowest weapon to use. So it does come down to the gun against the spear/lancet, but this would still be a close battle.

True, but this isn't about in game battle mechanics since they can't be compared. Realistically, if Kimahri is stupid enough to bring a spear to a gun fight he's likely going to die. Let's not forget that Balthier is no slouch in combat. (SPOILER)He was a judge afterall.

[Ashley Schovitz]

I say Khimari he can turn Balthier into stone, fry him, spit water at him, jump him, doom which you can't cure, Bad Breath him, and Mighty Guard will definetly be effective, so as Nova. I say Balthier doesn't have a chance. Kimahri all the way.

[Slothy]

I say Khimari he can turn Balthier into stone, fry him, spit water at him, jump him, doom which you can't cure, Bad Breath him, and Mighty Guard will definetly be effective, so as Nova. I say Balthier doesn't have a chance. Kimahri all the way.

I think if we're going to give Kimahri access to every Blue Magic skill he can get then we have to assume Balthier has access to everything on the license board. Suddenly things look a lot worse for Kimahri.

[Firo Volondé]

I think if we're going to give Kimahri access to every Blue Magic skill he can get then we have to assume Balthier has access to everything on the license board. Suddenly things look a lot worse for Kimahri.

No we can't, because Blue Magic is Kimahri's natural ability, like Rydia's summons or Edgar's tools. On the other hand, the licence board contains magicks that Balthier wouldn't know in-game. A fairer argument would be Balthier whole licence grid vs Kimahri whole sphere grid. And Auto-Life > anything you can learn off the licence board.

[Slothy]

No we can't, because Blue Magic is Kimahri's natural ability, like Rydia's summons or Edgar's tools. On the other hand, the licence board contains magicks that Balthier wouldn't know in-game. A fairer argument would be Balthier whole licence grid vs Kimahri whole sphere grid. And Auto-Life > anything you can learn off the licence board.

Technically though, Kimahri only starts with jump, and has to learn the rest of the abilities later. If we assume base character with normal stats and starting abiliies then he won't have his other blue magics. Giving him access to all of them would also present unfair advantage over just about any character if you limit them to only the abilities they would naturally learn. I prefer to look at these as what would happen in the real world if these characters meet and fight with the abilities they can get. I stand by my "bring a spear to a gun fight" argument. And if you want to go nuts with the abilities, then Quickenings are better than anything Kimahri brings to the table.

[Firo Volondé]

Technically though, Kimahri only starts with jump, and has to learn the rest of the abilities later. If we assume base character with normal stats and starting abiliies then he won't have his other blue magics.

Then, we cannot assume Balthier has anything beyond Attack and Steal.

Giving him access to all of them would also present unfair advantage over just about any character if you limit them to only the abilities they would naturally learn.

Correct, that's why I had a problem with Kimahri only having his innate abilities (comparable to having just Quickenings) while Balthier has the whole licence grid.

I prefer to look at these as what would happen in the real world if these characters meet and fight with the abilities they can get.

I prefer not to deal with abilities, just their real-world statistics.

I stand by my "bring a spear to a gun fight" argument.

You can hardly call Balthier's weapon a gun in the modern sense of the word. The kind of gun he uses is very slow and wouldn't be much use against a swift melee fighter. Balthier's (SPOILER)training as a judge would rely on him wearing armor, which he doesn't since he became a sky pirate. Besides, Kimahri hasn't exactly been sitting in Besaid twiddling his thumbs, either.

And if you want to go nuts with the abilities, then Quickenings are better than anything Kimahri brings to the table.

That's true, but I'm not suggesting we go nuts. I was merely saying what would be a fair compromise if both of them were given their full abilities.

[Azure Chrysanthemum]

On the Quickening vs. Blue Magic, remember Khimari must reach Overdrive before he can use his Blue Magic, whereas Balthier can use his off the bat.

Also, just by personality, one could assume that Balthier would have an alternate melee weapon if he were going into single combat like that. Taking an alternate melee weapon into account, the power gap further widens. As Tidus was able to fight evenly with Khimari as an untrained whelp (albeit reasonably talented), Balthier with his prior elite training should be more than a match.

Balthier's gun is likely the rough equivalent of a flintlock. It may be slow to fire, but it has a decent stopping power to it. A few shots is all he needs. Also, aiming the gun need not be taken into account, if Khimari is closing for combat Balthier's skilled enough to hit him with ease. If Khimari's running around, Balthier can still draw a bead on him and Khimari can't make any attack.

[Treasure Hunter Locke]

I'm glad I've joined up this soon to join in with this tournament. There is a tournament on another forum that has nearly ended but was never as big as this (Didn't include FFII and FFXII characters and only the temporary characters of FFIII).

I love the dragoon class of characters but I'll for Balthier. He has a mean hoverbike and could easily take care of Kimahri from a distance. Also as pointed out, Balthier can use a Quickening as soon as the battle starts and can possibly chain a few aswell.

EDIT: I just realized that Kain, one of the best and well known characters throughout Final Fantasy is not in this tournament?

[Slothy]

You can hardly call Balthier's weapon a gun in the modern sense of the word. The kind of gun he uses is very slow and wouldn't be much use against a swift melee fighter. Balthier's (SPOILER)training as a judge would rely on him wearing armor, which he doesn't since he became a sky pirate. Besides, Kimahri hasn't exactly been sitting in Besaid twiddling his thumbs, either.

Behold the Void essentially summed up the gun aspect. Even if he only gets one shot, against a melee fighter like Kimahri who has to come into close range to be effective, Balthier only needs one. As for the (SPOILER)how can we know what is training really involved? We can assume though that it would make him one badass fighting machine, quite capable of taking care of himself in any combat situation. And of course, as Void said, we must always come back to the fact that Tidus with no training beat Kimahri. No matter how naturally gifted he may be, that's still a point that isn't in his favour.