What FF Villains Could Beat Sin?S

[Hyperion4444]

Sephiroth summoned meteor, either he lives or not, the meteor still hits ''btw, he said could defeat sin, didn't said he could defeat vuce versa, if Sephiroth tries to take it on with the masumune, then he's dead''
But it's the meteor that defeats it.

Sephiroth summoning Meteor shouldn't even count. He had to use the Black Materia in order to use Meteor, not out of his own power. Anybody could have probably done the same thing if he or she had the Black Materia.

Ultimecia lives in space, sin can't attack her, and she can do whatever she wants. She acheives her goal, all other existance denied, no more sin, and even in a 1vs1, she cast her spell and sin has 1 hp remaining, finishes sin off before he can attack. Maybe the same for Sephi.
BTW: I'm pretty sure that Eden GF would annihilate Sin.

Okay...

First off, Ultimecia does NOT live in space. She lives in a castle in the future. That's where all your characters went to go fight her in the end of the game. Secondly, it takes a long time for Time Compression to occur; my guess is over 1000 years. But before that 1000 years occurs, she only has power equivalent to any other sorceress. Her power is nothing compared to Sin and she would be annihilated. Thirdly, if you decide to include Hell's Judgement, you would be going by battle mechanics. And according to battle mechanics, Sin's Giga Graviton automatically kills anything. Ulti gets annihilated again.

By the way, there is no way to really tell whether Eden could annihilate Sin. After all, the only thing we have to judge Eden with is Eternal Breath, which doesn't actually destroy the galaxy.

And Also!
Sin Also needs to charge it's attack and takes a longer while than any other ff boss.

And as said before, it was because of the Hymn of the Faith and Jecht holding back Yu-Yevon that made Sin wait before using Giga Graviton.

The Last Ultimecia is her true form, the human one is just a cover up.
1-Technically it's space and out, it's the time compression and Ultimecia sucking up the whole universe, void, and nothing exist, not even sin.
2-Sin's gigatron takes a while to attack, several turns, she makes her first move 'Sin has 1 HP remaining' then her last to finish it.
3-ok then, if your giga graviton kills off anything, then just bring Odin'FFVIII' and finishes off Sin in an instant.
Or better yet, Seifer, he kills Odin in an instant.
(And Seifer's not the strongest of bosses... but if you are overwhelmed about battle mechanix...)


As for Eden, you want to compare sizes?
Greiver's Shockwave Pulsar is pretty strong.

As for your so called 1000 years, is impossible for her lifespawn to accomplish.
Another thing, she needed to have Elone to go further in the past to achieve it.
Took an instant. And time compression was acheive, and then Squall and co travelled in the futur, ect...

Here's a clip for you, about who's better between Ruby Vs Emerald, conclusion?....

Sephiroth summoned meteor, either he lives or not, the meteor still hits ''btw, he said could defeat sin, didn't said he could defeat vuce versa, if Sephiroth tries to take it on with the masumune, then he's dead''
But it's the meteor that defeats it.

Sin can't stop Meteor. So? It's not like Meteor can change course. Sin just flies out of its range. Meteor strikes the Planet instead, causing a wound in it, which is then healed by the Lifestream. In
FFVII, Meteor wasn't intended to destroy the Planet, just to draw the Lifestream to one point so it could be absorbed.

Ultimecia lives in space, sin can't attack her, and she can do whatever she wants. She acheives her goal, all other existance denied, no more sin, and even in a 1vs1, she cast her spell and sin has 1 hp remaining, finishes sin off before he can attack. Maybe the same for Sephi.
BTW: I'm pretty sure that Eden GF would annihilate Sin.

I'm not an expert on FFVIII's plot, so I may be disregarding plot points, but there's nothing to suggest Sin couldn't survive in space (if Ultimecia and Squall can bypass the problems of space being a vacuum and lack of oxygen then Sin certainly could). HP is a game mechanic; Ulty can't just siphon off Sin's HP with spells, she needs something to break through his armour. I don't know of any magic she would have access to that would be strong enough.

A puny army of weakly cavalry couldn't even dream of scratching the likes of sin.
But the mighty Bahamut, Lord of the Skys, annihilates huge ships in 1 hit. Boost Power to maximum, without the pesky vaan and co reducing the power of it at the tower. Well, you all know how strong Bahamut is. It can and would destroy sin's shell.

Doesn't sound like anything more powerful than what the Machina War (1000 years before the start of FFX) would've produced. And you all know how they fared against Sin.

Bahamut is not a machina

Um, yes it is. "Machina" is just another word for "machine". FFXII's Bahamut is not an Esper, or any other kind of living organism.

Bahamut is not a ship, and that ship did pierce the shield to be destroyed after, but bahamut hid itself behind Alexander.
And even the Ifrit Ship is 400x times bigger than that puny ship. Burn!

That point may be clear to someone who's finished XII, but it's not to me.

And Also!
Sin Also needs to charge it's attack and takes a longer while than any other ff boss.

FFS, how many times do I have to say it? THE HYMN WEAKENS SIN AND MAKES HIM SLOWER THAN NORMAL. WITHOUT THE HYMN, HE CAN ATTACK IMMEDIATELY.

I'm also sure that any OmegaFFVII/FFVIII-Ruby-Emerald weapon could beat that boss in an instant.

No, other way around. Sin would crush them in an instant.

1-Not quite pal, the planet gets destroyed, reson why Cloud and co must save it.
(Really want to debate this, the planet would get destroyed, ok.)
If it destroys the planet, then sin is destroyed along with it.


2-What I meant is that the real Ultimecia lives somewhere sin cannot go. (starting by futur)
She doesn't need to break it, time-compression destroys Sin.

3-Against Bahamut? Are you Crazy!? Bahamut Annihilates anything it wants to destroy. The Mega-Flare at full blast here is much stronger than sin's Giga Graviton. It's Bahamut that we are talking about here, not just some little power.


Bahamut IS NOT A MACHINA NOR A MACHINE!
To be a Machine, you need to have artificial intelligence to interact in the world being by it's own.
It's not a robot.
Bahamut is controlled by humans, so it makes it a Vessel or Airship, whatever you want to call it.

I did, Ifrit ship, surely throws Fire, so yeah, burn.
And yet Bahamut Ship is even Bigger than that.
We've seen Sin go on top of a tower, and my anylisist is that the Ifrit Ship alone is bigger than Sin, but not by too much, about 125%-180%. Yet Alexander ship is like 4-7 times the size of Ifrit. And Alexander is smaller than Bahamut.

Bahamut Ship is shaped like a huge tower. it has something like what, 2,4,7 thousand floors.
I'd say it's bigger than the DMC3 tower, where it goes up high, minus the lack of space on the DVD to create of of theses floors, forcing the game to ascent many stage.

I'm pretty sure, considering the speed of the weapons, could beat up sin.
I mean, if Tidus and Co could make a hole in it to enter, all other FF characters surely can do the same.

[Goldenboko]

Sephiroth summoned meteor, either he lives or not, the meteor still hits ''btw, he said could defeat sin, didn't said he could defeat vuce versa, if Sephiroth tries to take it on with the masumune, then he's dead''
But it's the meteor that defeats it.

Sephiroth summoning Meteor shouldn't even count. He had to use the Black Materia in order to use Meteor, not out of his own power. Anybody could have probably done the same thing if he or she had the Black Materia.

Ultimecia lives in space, sin can't attack her, and she can do whatever she wants. She acheives her goal, all other existance denied, no more sin, and even in a 1vs1, she cast her spell and sin has 1 hp remaining, finishes sin off before he can attack. Maybe the same for Sephi.
BTW: I'm pretty sure that Eden GF would annihilate Sin.

Okay...

First off, Ultimecia does NOT live in space. She lives in a castle in the future. That's where all your characters went to go fight her in the end of the game. Secondly, it takes a long time for Time Compression to occur; my guess is over 1000 years. But before that 1000 years occurs, she only has power equivalent to any other sorceress. Her power is nothing compared to Sin and she would be annihilated. Thirdly, if you decide to include Hell's Judgement, you would be going by battle mechanics. And according to battle mechanics, Sin's Giga Graviton automatically kills anything. Ulti gets annihilated again.

By the way, there is no way to really tell whether Eden could annihilate Sin. After all, the only thing we have to judge Eden with is Eternal Breath, which doesn't actually destroy the galaxy.

And Also!
Sin Also needs to charge it's attack and takes a longer while than any other ff boss.

And as said before, it was because of the Hymn of the Faith and Jecht holding back Yu-Yevon that made Sin wait before using Giga Graviton.

The Last Ultimecia is her true form, the human one is just a cover up.
1-Technically it's space and out, it's the time compression and Ultimecia sucking up the whole universe, void, and nothing exist, not even sin.
2-Sin's gigatron takes a while to attack, several turns, she makes her first move 'Sin has 1 HP remaining' then her last to finish it.
3-ok then, if your giga graviton kills off anything, then just bring Odin'FFVIII' and finishes off Sin in an instant.
Or better yet, Seifer, he kills Odin in an instant.
(And Seifer's not the strongest of bosses... but if you are overwhelmed about battle mechanix...)

No the only reason Sin's Giga Gravatron took several times was because the Hyme of Faith allowed Jecht to hold off Yu Yevon. So yeah she would die before compressing time. Next Odin is battle pure battle mechanic it has NOTHING to do with Ultimecia.

As for Eden, you want to compare sizes?
Greiver's Shockwave Pulsar is pretty strong.

As for your so called 1000 years, is impossible for her lifespawn to accomplish.
Another thing, she needed to have Elone to go further in the past to achieve it.
Took an instant. And time compression was acheive, and then Squall and co travelled in the futur, ect...

Here's a clip for you, about who's better between Ruby Vs Emerald, conclusion?....

PuPu already said his point had nothing to do with thousands of years, just that time compression did take time. The time compression that Squall and Co. survived wasn't a full compression, she was compressing time DURING YOUR BATTLE, and if Squall and Co. could kill her fast enough, so could sin.

Sephiroth summoned meteor, either he lives or not, the meteor still hits ''btw, he said could defeat sin, didn't said he could defeat vuce versa, if Sephiroth tries to take it on with the masumune, then he's dead''
But it's the meteor that defeats it.

Sin can't stop Meteor. So? It's not like Meteor can change course. Sin just flies out of its range. Meteor strikes the Planet instead, causing a wound in it, which is then healed by the Lifestream. In
FFVII, Meteor wasn't intended to destroy the Planet, just to draw the Lifestream to one point so it could be absorbed.

Ultimecia lives in space, sin can't attack her, and she can do whatever she wants. She acheives her goal, all other existance denied, no more sin, and even in a 1vs1, she cast her spell and sin has 1 hp remaining, finishes sin off before he can attack. Maybe the same for Sephi.
BTW: I'm pretty sure that Eden GF would annihilate Sin.

I'm not an expert on FFVIII's plot, so I may be disregarding plot points, but there's nothing to suggest Sin couldn't survive in space (if Ultimecia and Squall can bypass the problems of space being a vacuum and lack of oxygen then Sin certainly could). HP is a game mechanic; Ulty can't just siphon off Sin's HP with spells, she needs something to break through his armour. I don't know of any magic she would have access to that would be strong enough.

A puny army of weakly cavalry couldn't even dream of scratching the likes of sin.
But the mighty Bahamut, Lord of the Skys, annihilates huge ships in 1 hit. Boost Power to maximum, without the pesky vaan and co reducing the power of it at the tower. Well, you all know how strong Bahamut is. It can and would destroy sin's shell.

Doesn't sound like anything more powerful than what the Machina War (1000 years before the start of FFX) would've produced. And you all know how they fared against Sin.

Bahamut is not a machina

Um, yes it is. "Machina" is just another word for "machine". FFXII's Bahamut is not an Esper, or any other kind of living organism.

Bahamut is not a ship, and that ship did pierce the shield to be destroyed after, but bahamut hid itself behind Alexander.
And even the Ifrit Ship is 400x times bigger than that puny ship. Burn!

That point may be clear to someone who's finished XII, but it's not to me.

And Also!
Sin Also needs to charge it's attack and takes a longer while than any other ff boss.

FFS, how many times do I have to say it? THE HYMN WEAKENS SIN AND MAKES HIM SLOWER THAN NORMAL. WITHOUT THE HYMN, HE CAN ATTACK IMMEDIATELY.

I'm also sure that any OmegaFFVII/FFVIII-Ruby-Emerald weapon could beat that boss in an instant.

No, other way around. Sin would crush them in an instant.

1-Not quite pal, the planet gets destroyed, reson why Cloud and co must save it.
(Really want to debate this, the planet would get destroyed, ok.)
If it destroys the planet, then sin is destroyed along with it.


2-What I meant is that the real Ultimecia lives somewhere sin cannot go. (starting by futur)
She doesn't need to break it, time-compression destroys Sin.

3-Against Bahamut? Are you Crazy!? Bahamut Annihilates anything it wants to destroy. The Mega-Flare at full blast here is much stronger than sin's Giga Graviton. It's Bahamut that we are talking about here, not just some little power.


Bahamut IS NOT A MACHINA NOR A MACHINE!
To be a Machine, you need to have artificial intelligence to interact in the world being by it's own.
It's not a robot.
Bahamut is controlled by humans, so it makes it a Vessel or Airship, whatever you want to call it.

I did, Ifrit ship, surely throws Fire, so yeah, burn.
And yet Bahamut Ship is even Bigger than that.
We've seen Sin go on top of a tower, and my anylisist is that the Ifrit Ship alone is bigger than Sin, but not by too much, about 125%-180%. Yet Alexander ship is like 4-7 times the size of Ifrit. And Alexander is smaller than Bahamut.

Bahamut Ship is shaped like a huge tower. it has something like what, 2,4,7 thousand floors.
I'd say it's bigger than the DMC3 tower, where it goes up high, minus the lack of space on the DVD to create of of theses floors, forcing the game to ascent many stage.

I'm pretty sure, considering the speed of the weapons, could beat up sin.
I mean, if Tidus and Co could make a hole in it to enter, all other FF characters surely can do the same.

No, no other party could hurt Sin like Tidus and Co., because Tidus and Co. had a personal connection with Jecht, the rest (including Ulti) lack this key advantage, so Sin would obliterate them with Giga Graviton.

[Firo Volondé]

1-Not quite pal, the planet gets destroyed, reson why Cloud and co must save it.
(Really want to debate this, the planet would get destroyed, ok.) If it destroys the planet, then sin is destroyed along with it.

The Planet's destruction was merely an unfortunate side-effect of Sephiroth's actual goal. When Meteor struck the Planet, the Lifestream would gather at the wound to try and heal it. Sephiroth would be waiting there, and absorb the Lifestream. Without the Lifestream to heal it, Meteor's assault would be fatal. However, if Sin killed Sephiroth, the Lifestream would do its job, and heal the Planet. So both the Planet and Sin would survive.

2-What I meant is that the real Ultimecia lives somewhere sin cannot go. (starting by futur)
She doesn't need to break it, time-compression destroys Sin.

Couldn't Sin could just destroy Ultimecia when she was in the past or present? Time travel is always tricky to try to work out. Incidentally, the first post specified that it's a 1-on-1 fight, so I don't think Time Compression counts as 'beating' Sin.

3-Against Bahamut? Are you Crazy!? Bahamut Annihilates anything it wants to destroy.

It doesn't want to destroy anything. It's an inaminate object.

The Mega-Flare at full blast here is much stronger than sin's Giga Graviton. It's Bahamut that we are talking about here, not just some little power.

Giga Gravitron is gravity based, meaning it doesn't rely on brute force. It cannot be compared to a mere airship attack. Even if it is powered by nethicite.

Bahamut IS NOT A MACHINA NOR A MACHINE!
To be a Machine, you need to have artificial intelligence to interact in the world being by it's own.
It's not a robot. Bahamut is controlled by humans, so it makes it a Vessel or Airship, whatever you want to call it.

No, you're getting mixed up between a machine and a robot. Unless all the machina used in Operation Mi'ihen are no more sentient than the Sky Fortress. And just for the record:

Airship:A self-propelled, lighter-than-air aircraft with means of controlling the direction of flight; dirigible.
Aircraft: Any machine supported for flight in the air by buoyancy or by the dynamic action of air on its surfaces, esp. powered airplanes, gliders, and helicopters.

From the dictionary.

I did, Ifrit ship, surely throws Fire, so yeah, burn.

Poetic, but severely lacking in an actual point.

And yet Bahamut Ship is even Bigger than that. We've seen Sin go on top of a tower, and my anylisist is that the Ifrit Ship alone is bigger than Sin, but not by too much, about 125%-180%. Yet Alexander ship is like 4-7 times the size of Ifrit. And Alexander is smaller than Bahamut.

Bahamut Ship is shaped like a huge tower. it has something like what, 2,4,7 thousand floors.
I'd say it's bigger than the DMC3 tower, where it goes up high, minus the lack of space on the DVD to create of of theses floors, forcing the game to ascent many stage.

Well, according to my analysis, I'm right and you're wrong. Evidence would be appreciated. Even so, size isn't everything.

I'm pretty sure, considering the speed of the weapons, could beat up sin.

Sin is infinitely more powerful than the Weapons, and extremely fast without the Hymn or Jecht's will slowing it down

I mean, if Tidus and Co could make a hole in it to enter, all other FF characters surely can do the same.

No FF character knows Jecht. Basically what GB said.

[PuPu]

1-Technically it's space and out, it's the time compression and Ultimecia sucking up the whole universe, void, and nothing exist, not even sin.

The fact whether IF Ultimecia was absorbing the universe is arguable. If the FFVIII characters could exist, then Sin could too.

2-Sin's gigatron takes a while to attack, several turns, she makes her first move 'Sin has 1 HP remaining' then her last to finish it.

Once again, Giga Graviton only took time to charge because the Hymn of the Fayth and Jecht held him back.

3-ok then, if your giga graviton kills off anything, then just bring Odin'FFVIII' and finishes off Sin in an instant.
Or better yet, Seifer, he kills Odin in an instant.
(And Seifer's not the strongest of bosses... but if you are overwhelmed about battle mechanix...)

Why would Odin come into this fight? This has nothing to do with what we are talking about.

As for Eden, you want to compare sizes?
Greiver's Shockwave Pulsar is pretty strong.

There is no proof that Shockwave Pulsar can instantly kill anything like Giga Graviton can.

Here's a clip for you, about who's better between Ruby Vs Emerald, conclusion?....

Again, what does this have to do with anything in this thread?

[Hyperion4444]

OK, First, the only way Squall and Co could survive and travel in time, in time compression was because...
Laguna: As friends, believe in one another.
As friends, love one another, believe in there existance and they'll believe in yours.
It's all about Love, Courage and Friendship.

By doing so, it was the only thing they could do to survive in time compression, and sin is the embodiment of none of that.


HAHAHA
You really wanted to debate the meteor...
Lucrecia/Shelke: Omega is the same type of lifeform as the weapons we encoutered 3 years ago. Normally, Omega poses no threat, it only manifest itself when the planet detects something that may cause a danger.

The reason why the planet has weapons is to defend itself.
Without Aeris' Holy Materia that absorbed the Meteor, the planet would have been destroyed.
Or, if you so insist, without the holy materia of Aeris, the planet would have been drained of it's life force and died anyway.
Without Aeris' Holy Materia the planet would have been destroyed.

[Goldenboko]

OK, First, the only way Squall and Co could survive and travel in time, in time compression was because...
Laguna: As friends, believe in one another.
As friends, love one another, believe in there existance and they'll believe in yours.
It's all about Love, Courage and Friendship.

By doing so, it was the only thing they could do to survive in time compression, and sin is the embodiment of none of that.

GOErly? Then why when you use scan her it says that she is absorbing time existance as during the battle?

Anyway, that is beside the point. The point this thread asked for a 1 on 1 battle, in which Sin would crush her.

[ff is da best]

now im just saying....
what if vayne used nethictie on sin.
Im pretty sure sin would be obliterated.

[Hyperion4444]

So, there you go.
You asked me if another vilain could beat Sin, and they could.
There's no use trying to deny that fact.
But what should have been written is if another vilain could overpower Sin in versus Combat. Based on Size and force display abilities without the game mechanic of battle of the game.
Then, I'd say no to maybe.
Except for Bahamut who's technically not a villain.
I'd go with Omega Weapon, Or another weapon from FFVII.
As for Machines who could destroy Sin, either SHINRA's military cannon or FFXII's Bahamut. 'oh and by the way, there attacks proved to be one hit kills too'

[Forsaken Lover]

FFVII's Weapons are pretty good in durability but their overall offensive capabilities suck.

The damage Saphire was taking was impressive but when it finally attacked with a charged beam of energy, it wasn't anything I'd say that could pierce Sin's barrier.

I'd personally say FFIX Odin could take Saphire and most of the Weapons we saw in FFVII but he couldn't take Sin.

[ReloadPsi]

Anyone who can seize control of Vegnagun becomes able to completely obliterate the world (and therefore Sin), thus I say Shuyin. Or any other nut at Vegnagun's helm. Kefka might stand a chance with his Light Of Judgement, or so I was thinking until I remembered Operation Mi'hen. There are some valid points about Zemus being in with a damn good chance, but nobody likes a stalemate... then again he could mainpulate Golbez (or someone else) into getting a buncha people to sing Hymn Of The Fayth, assuming he manages to dive into a mind that knows about it, and if he's here for a deathmatch with Sin, odds are they'll be in Spira.

Wait, is Vegnagun meant to be destroying the world in that "bad" ending?S

[Renmiri]

Problem with Vegnagun is that it was never tested against Sin. It might not work too well

[Serapy]

Just you know, Sin doesn't HAVE to take a long amount of time to charge Giga Graviton because Sin can charge Giga Graviton VERY quickly when needed. There is an evidence for this. Look at the cutscene in FFX of Sin using Giga Gravition against the dark village (forget the name) and it didn't take long for Sin to use it. AND when we were fighting against Sin, it took Sin a long time to use GG. Plus, if Sin casted a powerful protect spell around it, then it's almost impossible to break it.

The effects of Giga Gravtion are used in a radius. Quite a big radius, there's NO way that FF villains can dodge if they were in that radius at the exact second when Sin used GG because it's extremely fast.

Also, it's impossible to find out if it's ACTUALLY charging GG. We only found out about that because of the top message on your screen, telling you when is Sin gonna use Giga Gravition. But in reality, it doesn't tell you. Meaning, it's pointless for FF villains to dogde all the time worrying if SIn is going to use GG.

Even if Sin dies, it will be reborn again.

Other villains are very small, compared to Sin. So none of them can beat Sin, it would be a miracle if they did.

[PuPu]

As for Machines who could destroy Sin, either SHINRA's military cannon or FFXII's Bahamut.

By SHINRA's military cannon, do you mean the Junon Cannon or the Sister Ray? Junon cannon is a no. Sister Ray probably could though, since it skewered Diamond WEAPON and destroyed Sephiroth's barrier.
Also, I still don't understand your argument or proof as to how Sky Fortress Bahamut could defeat Sin.

But what should have been written is if another vilain could overpower Sin in versus Combat. Based on Size and force display abilities without the game mechanic of battle of the game.
Then, I'd say no to maybe.

Aren't you the one who said Ultimecia could just reduce Sin's HP to 1?
Besides, Giga Graviton is not just battle mechanics. We've seen Sin use it outside of battle and cause lots of destruction with it. Ultimecia's Hell's Judgement only appeared in battle, so it's power can only be judged by battle mechanics.

'oh and by the way, there attacks proved to be one hit kills too'

What proof? The fact that they can kill something in one hit does not mean they can kill anything in one hit.

Even if Sin dies, it will be reborn again.

But I thought that Sin only gets reborn if you use the Final Aeon to kill it?

Other villains are very small, compared to Sin. So none of them can beat Sin, it would be a miracle if they did.

Size doesn't really doesn't have that much influence on power. After all, Yu-Yevon himself is pretty small too.

[Forsaken Lover]

When Sin is destroyed, Yevon possesses the nearest Aeon That aeon is made into a new Sin.

If there is no Aeon to possess, I have no idea what happens to him.

[Firo Volondé]

When Sin is destroyed, Yevon possesses the nearest Aeon That aeon is made into a new Sin.

If there is no Aeon to possess, I have no idea what happens to him.

At the end of X, when you have defeated your Aeons, Yu-Yevon in his true form fights your party. It's impossible to gauge his strength, since you have Auto-Life on at the time, but since he relies on possessing aeons to fight, he's probably pretty weak.