Is Jecht A Dream?? (COMPLETE SPOILER)

[Little Blue]

I'm probably confused with your use of the word ghost Serapy. I take it by ghost you're refering to the Fayth.

Yu Yevon was responsible for the summoning of Dream Zanarkand, and the creation of Sin by magic. YY never drained souls from anyone. Pyreflies are likely the soul of one's soul in the mythos, but the pyreflies (or souls if you prefer) YY used to build Sin were already dissociated from people (ie, the souls were already dead and just weren't sent to the Farplane).

[cally777]

Well thats clear :rolleyes2 as mud. Lets just summarize. Tidus, an aeon from DZ, becomes "more than a dream", then fades and goes to the Farplane (still not explained IMO). Jecht, same business to start, then becomes BFA, is destroyed and goes to the Farplane - how? Most aeons when destroyed do NOT go to the FP. They disintegrate into pyre flies and reconstitute when next summoned. Why the difference?

[blackmage_nuke]

...maybe aeons live on the farplane when they arent being summoned

[Little Blue]

Cally, the difference is that Jecht was actually killed so, like Tidus' mother, he was free to go to the farplane. Tidus on the other hand went to the farplane because the gagazet fayth, who provide the template for his existence, were sent. Otherwise he would've stayed in Spira.

blackmage_nuke, I think I once read that the temple aeons spend their time in DZ when they're not being summoned or their fayth prayed to...

[Mirage]

Thank you Little Blue, for explaining these things. Saved me for a lot of typing.

[BG-57]

blackmage_nuke, I think I once read that the temple aeons spend their time in DZ when they're not being summoned or their fayth prayed to...

There's actually direct evidence of that in the game. Tidus encounters the Fayth of Bahamut in DZ right at the beginning.

On the matter of Temple Aeons, it's clear that many of them became Fayth after the destruction of Zanarkand. In particular Anima's Fayth is very recent. Do they just feed into the dream of the Gagazet Fayth, or are they dreaming separately? The implication seems to be they are connected.

[blackmage_nuke]

blackmage_nuke, I think I once read that the temple aeons spend their time in DZ when they're not being summoned or their fayth prayed to...

There's actually direct evidence of that in the game. Tidus encounters the Fayth of Bahamut in DZ right at the beginning.

Well actually he couldve just been visiting DZ, he appears in other places in the game as well.

[BG-57]

Of course, but my point is that were it not for his appearance in DZ, we'd be forgiven for assuming the Temple Fayth spend all their down time entombed in their respective Temples.

[Shinnok]

There´s only one reason Yu Yevon didn´t merge with Tidus. It´s because Tidus earned himself a soul, when he came in contact with Sin. The same goes for Jetch. This does not mean he (Tidus) had a phisycal body of a human and the proof is that he disapperead.
I mean, soul is a kind of pyrefly. The contact with Sin affected that pyrefly within Tidus, and transformed in a higher pyrefly.
OR "gave" Tidus a pyrefly of that kind, because of Sin´s Gravity spell.
That´s the key: soul. The "kind of pirefly" that exhists only in humans, never in Aeons or Dreams (Dark Aeons in FF X-2 were summoned by the corrupted fayth, as Bahamut´s fayth states in game).
My guess is that Yu Yevon NEEDS an Aeon (dream), WITHOUT a human soul, what is not the case of Jetch and Tidus. Jetch was not "the Final Aeon itself", he was THE FAYTH for the Final Aeon. Yu Yevon took control, IN FIRST PLACE, of THE FINAL AEON. THEN, he started to CORRUPT THE FAYTH BEHIND THE FINAL AEON, in this case, Jetch.
FAYTH CAN BE CORRUPTED with anger, as FF X-2 explains, like Shuyin did to the fayth in Farplane. That´s why they summoned corrupted Aeons. What I don´t get is who was the summoner for the Dark Aeons. I presume it was Shuyin, in Baralai´s or Nooj´s body. Otherwise, we would be forced to believe Summons could exhist without a summoner, and the theory would be supported by the fact that Yojimbos´s fayth "summoned Yojimbo himself" as he fought Yuna in the Cavern of Stolen Fayth.
I mean, how Yojimbo´s fayth could have made his dream REAL, without a summoner? Nobody summoned Yojimbo at the cavern.
However, that theory does not explain how Shuyin can take control of human´s souls.
We can think that the difference is: Shuyn don´t make a fusion, just a mental control on his subjects, while Yu Yevon process is all about merging totally (physically and mental) with his victims.
And Yu Yevon was in an "automatic mode"...

[White Queen]

I always thought Dream Zanarkand was just that....a dream. But Yuna and Jecht and Tidus all speak about 'going back' there...so DZ is an actual location, just no one knows where it is? I think it is in Sin or part of Sin, because Auron had to 'ride Sin' to get there...When you're fighting Sin before you go into its mouth you see what looks like a miniature city on its back. That's what gave me the idea that DZ must be somewhere where Sin is. But it's clearly being summoned by the fayth at Mt. Gagazet right?

And yes Jecht is a dream the fayth say so themselves: "you, your father, your mother...all dreams" (when Tidus collapses at the Mt. Gagazet fayth). I think that particular fayth (Bahamut) perhaps is responsible for the creation of Tidus, i.e. Tidus's guardian fayth? Because it is he who appears to Yuna at the end of X-2 and says he will continue dreaming for a little longer.

But there's no doubt that Jecht's a dream in the same way as Tidus, but the contact with the living entity of Sin and being tangible in Spira made them more than just dreams. However, they still relied on fayth to keep them alive. That's why with the destruction of Yu Yevon, the fayth ceased to dream and they vanished.

When Tidus wakes up after the credits he is clearly not in the Farplane (as that scene is intergrated into the perfect ending of X-2, making him technically below the waters of Besaid). However Yuna never goes to the Farplane in X-2 to see if he will appear so that's another question mark.

[CimminyCricket]

Who was Yu-Yevon? I know it was that thing at the end of the game, but who?

[BG-57]

He was the ruler of the original Zanarkand. A great summoner among summoners. He realized that Zanarkand was doomed when Bevelle invaded so he convinced his followers to become Fayth en masse so he could summon an idealized version of their city (DZ). Yu Yevon is protected by the armor of Sin, and has continued to summon continuously for 1000 years. It's by this point that the Fayth are growing tired of the dreaming.