Artemisia and the QM theory

[Serapy]

As we all know that Ultimecia is written as Arutimishia in Japanese, but more precisely, it's Artemisia which is a greek name. FFVIII also contain more realigious stuff (latin from the paintings). So therefore, the notions of these words must exist. Why else do you think Square implemented these things into the game?

Here goes:

In real life, Artemisia did exist a long time ago (in Greek times).
In history, there are two different Artemisias (Artemisia I of Caria and Artemisia II of Caria). I believe that Ultimecia is the representation of Artemisia II. From now on, I'm declaring Artemisia II as Artemisia.

Artemisia was a daughter of Hecatomnus.
King Mausolus (the ruler of Caria) was a son of Hecatomnus too.
At one point, Artemisia married Mausolus. They very much loved each other. Just like Squall and Rinoa.

Artemisia had an extraordinary grief (very very very very upset and angry) at the death of her husband Mausolus (he died young) and she went into despair. In FFVIII, Ultimecia also was in despair (crazy).
After his death, Artemisia drank Mausolus's ashes, all in proving herself that she survived Mausolus, similar to FFVIII, Squall almost died (revived by Rinoa, basically she survived him too).
Artemisia has built the tomb (Mausoleum of Maussollos) to honour Mausolus. Similar to Ultimecia's castle (assuming Squall died after the game) and it has a lion statue (a representation of great strength and pride). The Ultimecia castle may don't look exactly the same as the Artemisia's tomb but the notions are the same. If this is false, why do you think Ultimecia made her own castle?
Since Mausolus's death, Artemisia gained powers off him and she basically wanted to rule. Similar to FFVIII, Ultimecia (inside Edea) implied that she wanted to rule (becoming the reign).

Next explanation I'll be writing is based on this thread http://forums.eyesonff.com/final-fan...noa-smart.html

Now...

When Mausolus was alive. This particular coin was used during his reign:



The first symbolism is a lion.
The second symbolism is a star.

Squall told Rinoa about Lion and he explicitly expressed it (great strength and pride).
Ultimecia's castle having a Lion statue.
Ultimecia summoning Griever out of Rinoa's mind.
Griever on the Moon...

and as for "star".
When a special star displays in the sky, Rinoa expresses this symbolism to Squall (finger sign at the star). She did the exactly same thing in the end of the game. I also found it interesting that the 2nd symbolism looks like Balamb Garden's wheeler (4 rays).

and the paintings in Ulti's castle, most of them are based on greek.

Specific circumstances (appearances, emotions and movements) in FF8 may don't sound the same as the real story because it's a FF game, but! The notions are quite the same. Which means that Rinoa is not exactly Ultimecia at the exact same time BUT BUT you get the idea.

Now, as for this QM theory...

Read BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | New model 'permits time travel'

Basically, it states that you cannot change the past, even if you wanted to. Ellone in FF8 also said the same thing.
So this explains why Ultimecia has never successfully killed Rinoa including the others.
For example, Rinoa has suffered many experiences: she nearly died throughout the game as well as with her companions... and yet she lived, regardless of what Ultimecia did to her.

Ultimecia was crazy!
So was Artemisia!
But that wasn't the point, as I said before, White Wing is a represention of good (love) and Black Wing is a representation of bad (evil and crazy) so that gives a good excuse for Ultimecia to attempt in killing SeeDs, even Rinoa. What she doesn't realise is that she can't change the past. Artemisia died because she was in despair, just like Ultimecia (she was defeated in the end).
It's obvious, isn't it? Artemisia wanted to rule since the death of her husband, just like Ultimecia (ruling the world of FF8).

[Big D]

...

I'm both impressed and slightly fearful at the amount of thought, interpretation and extrapolation that's gone into this.

The FF games are rife with references to myth and legend, from beings like Gilgamesh and Ifrit and the names of weapons and artefacts, to the Moai that appear now and then. It can be downright perilous to read too much into these references.

As for that article on changing history... if it's possible to travel through time, then it's possible to change the past. The very presence of a time traveler in the past alters what actually happened, from the position of air molecules that their body displaces to the overall mass of the universe. It's not something that needs to be focussed on too much in an FFVIII discussion...

[BardTard]

Ultimecia was Jewish. Check out her Chanukkah decorations.

[Polaris]

...

I'm both impressed and slightly fearful at the amount of thought, interpretation and extrapolation that's gone into this.

I have never seen a game creating so many theories ^^" I just don't know anymore...

[Ouch!]

...As for that article on changing history... if it's possible to travel through time, then it's possible to change the past. The very presence of a time traveler in the past alters what actually happened, from the position of air molecules that their body displaces to the overall mass of the universe. It's not something that needs to be focussed on too much in an FFVIII discussion...

Gonna be honest and admit I didn't bother reading the link, but I'd like to comment regardless. Your assumption that the existence of a time traveler operates solely on assumption (then again, so does all time travel). Personally, I'm of the mind that if someone travels into the past to change something, it has already been done. By traveling back, one would merely be fulfilling actions which have already been accomplished. Perhaps that's a bit too much of a blow if one buys into anything other than hard determinism, but it's the only thing that makes sense to me. Well, unless you want to start buying into the kind of stuff string theory (which I only understand on a superficial level) is based off of, specifically the existence of infinite alternate universes branching into an infinite number of time lines.

Regarding the actual theory itself: while interesting, I think it's a mistake to take any references made by Square at face value. While Final Fantasy is notorious for referencing mythology and history, it's also notorious for doing it badly. Shiva is the most notorious example of this (although I vaguely remember there being an explanation for that particularly obvious blunder). Anyway, their track record is so poor, I think it's more appropriate to assume that a reference is botched and thus too unstable from which to extrapolate.

[Marky Tee]

now this is realy grasping at straws to prove a theory that has more or less been declared as not true

interesting yes i have to admit

[Goldenboko]

This doesn't really prove anything. Its hardly even a reference. In fact if the name has a Greek name its bound to match up with some person in Ancient Greek History. The fact that this is based on taking to previous theories as truth also stops it from making anything 'obvious'.

[Tallulah]

... So the cops actually knew it was a set-up?

Sorry, when I get bored with threads I make up my own.

[rubah]

Then why didn't the localization have her as Artemisia? They did a pretty excellent job with the rest of the game after all.

[Serapy]

Ultimecia was Jewish. Check out her Chanukkah decorations.

I'm not sure whether she was Jewish or not because the references didn't state that she was (so I'm assuming not), although there have been organized Jewish communities in Greece for more than two thousand years.

But yes, there are a lot of 'Chanukkah' Candles in her castle...

If you remember FE's theory about the skeletons near Esthar:
Well, in that 'Flood' painting, maybe it represents one of the Kislev...

"27 Kislev - (2105 BCE) - Flood rains cease
It is said that the forty days and nights of rainfall which covered the face of earth with water in Noah's time ended on Kislev 27 of the Hebrew year 1656 (2105 BCE). The flood itself lasted a full year (According to Genesis 6-8)."

Would that explain why you see these big skeletons near Esthar?
In the past, Esthar was underwater. So this must mean flood. This disaster has brought these big monsters (skeletons) to the area, why else skeletons were there? How did it all start in the first place? Lunar Cry?
Now in the present, no more flood! no more water on Esthar! The ground is so cold, desert and almost clean. The skeletons are quite visible.

[Big D]

Then why didn't the localization have her as Artemisia? They did a pretty excellent job with the rest of the game after all.

The Japanese text could probably be transliterated as either "Ultimecia" or "Artemisia", and they chose the former for whatever reason...

[rubah]

but if they intended it to be a reference to whomever, you'd think that they would you know, name her after that.

[Serapy]

Final Fantasy VIII is very subtle, *sigh*. This game is kind of based on a love theme, right? Well, Artemisia has had the same theme, really.

The point is that if everything what I have said is proven not to be true, then what exactly are they? Are they pointless things that the developers have decided to add onto the game just to fill each disk space out of nothing? Honestly, the developers have spent valuable time on making these things and I don't think that they would spend that time on making "pointless" things. In other words, these things being irrelevant to the story/gameplay.

but if they intended it to be a reference to whomever, you'd think that they would you know, name her after that.

All I could think of is that, well, in FF7, they have named Aerith as Aeris. I'm pretty sure the other FF games have done the same thing.
Or
They just wanted to make FF8 more subtle?

[rubah]

no, the localization in ff7 was terrible. There's broken english all over that thing. whereas, with ff8 you find correct english and english slang interspersed throughout the game, an indication that people who knew what they were talking about translated the game.

[Goldenboko]

There's a large difference between something not being obvious because its subtle, and something not being obvious, because its made up