I'm really sick

[arcanedude34]

of people who criticize TA for having 'too kiddy' of a plot. Imo, TA has a much darker plot than Tactics. What people fail to realize is that TA is the only game where the bad guy wins.

In FFTA, you play the villain. You are the dark side. Congratulations. Let's look back at some of my favorite Villains in FF history, shall we?

Fiends- Wanted to destroy the world by instinct (I guess)
Dark Cloud- Same deal^
Zeromus- Wants to wipe out the Earth's population so the moonmen can inhabit the Blue Planet
Kefka- Wants to wipe out the population (and eventually the owlrd) because he feels there's no point to existance
Sephy- WILL get what he wants, how many innocent people die in the meantime is no concern of his
Kuja- Destroys TWO worlds to take everyone with him when he dies
Seymour- Wants to destroy the world so he can save others from life (which he feels is nothing but endless torment)
Marche- Wants to destroy the world (against all the wishes of everyone except him) just because he doesn't feel right in the new world

You get the picture. TA, in my eyes, is just about the exact same story from FFI from the villain's point of view. Think about it- in I a foreign race (Fiends in I/people from St. Ivalice in TA) start to show up, start messin' w/ the crystals in order to wipe out the population of the planet (TA to make way for the 'real' Ivalice inhabitants/FFI for the lulz I guess). If you look at it this way, the Totema from TA are, in fact the Light Warriors of TA, only this time, they fail to protect the crystals. This would also mean the Mewt is, in fact, the hero of TA, as it he who created the utopian world, and is the only thing that sustains it. Only in THIS version of the story, the villain (Marche) succeeds in convincing Mewt that he is on the wrong path. Then the world is destroyed, despite the fact that Marche is the only one that wants to go home.

You may argue that his motives are what make him a hero, but in the end, he sows destruction in Ivalice, causes everyone to have to return home when they don't want to just for personal desire. This makes TA the only FF you play as the villain, and the only FF in which the villain wins.

Discuss.

[NeoCracker]

That world isn't real though. While no one wants to go home, they are simply wanting to live in a fake reality.

Marche is the one who sees this as wrong, and convinces Mewt that they shoudl return to the real world, as this world is nothing but an illusion.

Mrche is hardly the bad guy here.

[arcanedude34]

But he is. If the story was told through a neutral perspective, at the very least it could be said that Marche and Mewt are neither hero nor villain, but two soldiers on opposing sides with opposing ideals. Marche's ideals just happen to involve ruining all of his friends' lives while he's at it.

I also find it hard to believe that Ivalice isn't real. It's real enough that you can live and die there. Just because it's artificially made deosn't make it any less real.

[sdm42393]

That world isn't real though. While no one wants to go home, they are simply wanting to live in a fake reality.

Marche is the one who sees this as wrong, and convinces Mewt that they shoudl return to the real world, as this world is nothing but an illusion.

Mrche is hardly the bad guy here.

Couldn't you say that would justify Seymour's intention for being a villain.

[Roto13]

You can't really say Marche is the villain unless you think sucking people into a fake world and keeping them there regardless of what they want is a good thing. (I know most of them wanted to stay, but Marche didn't, and it's not like he had a lot of choice in the matter.) Plus, Mewt didn't exactly treat his people well, with his crazy laws that only exist to torment people.

[sdm42393]

My question is why anybody would still want to be friends with Marche by the end of the game?

[Roto13]

Because he only wanted to go home. He was forced to go there against his will, and if it happened to me I'd probably have done the same thing.

[arcanedude34]

Yea but then he forced everyone else to go home even though they made it abundantly clear that they wanted to stay. What's worse, one's suffering or literally everyone else suffering? I'm just saying that a hero, by definition, works towards the common interests of the people and a villain works towards a self-serving goal, which he often believes to be for the greater good (again, Seymour, Kefka)

Which of the two categories do you think Marche falls under?

[Roto13]

What wasn't self-serving about Mewt's goals? Or Ritz's or Doned's for that matter? They were running from reality. They were there because they were too wussy for reality.

[sdm42393]

Maybe they were all evil. O_O

[Roto13]

I don't think any of the kids were evil, really. :P Just weak.

[ljkkjlcm9]

I consider Marche the hero because the others were running from reality, while he was trying to face it dead on. You can't live in a fantasy forever, and Marche knew that and that they had to get back to the real world. How long can you live a complete lie before it starts getting to you? Try it sometime... it doesn't end up too well...

THE JACKEL

[sdm42393]

I dunno. Living in a Final Fantasy world would be pretty awesome, I could care less what reality I'm leaving.

[Roogle]

Marche as a villain would hold greater weight if the characters and the player knew that Ivalice was a parallel world rather than a fantastic world.

[NeoCracker]

That world isn't real though. While no one wants to go home, they are simply wanting to live in a fake reality.

Marche is the one who sees this as wrong, and convinces Mewt that they shoudl return to the real world, as this world is nothing but an illusion.

Mrche is hardly the bad guy here.

Couldn't you say that would justify Seymour's intention for being a villain.

Um, Seymour was trying to save the world from suffering by killing them all.

He had good intentions, but in the end he was also just running from Reality, because he couldn't face it.

They aren't really all that comparable.