Improvements from FFXI?

[Madame Adequate]

I can see where you're coming from and I actually agree in the main. It's one reason I like the fact you can now turn XP gain off in WoW. I can just merrily run Scarlet Monkatorium until I have the Chain of the Scarlet Crusade. Being in a party should also make life easier than soloing, and faster too, but I'm simply arguing - as others seem to be - that soloing should be possible even if it isn't the most efficient.

However, I don't agree that because someone likes to solo, they should play games other than MMO. I can't think of terribly many games I enjoy as much as playing WoW, even alone. I like going out into the wilds and yadda yadda explore, but when I come back into a city I like to see it alive. I like to see people coming and going and etc.

[Yeargdribble]

[QUOTE=I'm my own MILF;2789487] Being in a party should also make life easier than soloing, and faster too, but I'm simply arguing - as others seem to be - that soloing should be possible even if it isn't the most efficient.

Total agreement. This is where FFXI is now, though I think the solo opportunities could still be far more robust. I'm happy as long as it's not the sole option. You could argue that in WoW you have a choice to party, but the mere option of soloing all of your levels makes it the default choice and nearly eradicates party play from the game.

However, I don't agree that because someone likes to solo, they should play games other than MMO. I can't think of terribly many games I enjoy as much as playing WoW, even alone. I like going out into the wilds and yadda yadda explore, but when I come back into a city I like to see it alive. I like to see people coming and going and etc.

I can respect that. I was just saying that you could save yourself some money, but I enjoyed playing WoW solo (or duo with my wife) quite a bit and I like the fact that it's a living breathing world with people coming and going.

I'm not saying stay away from MMOs altogether, but that I hope (selfishly) that FFXIV doesn't cater to your type. There will be other MMOs (almost all of them) that will. I hope that FFXIV maintains some uniqueness while learning from the mistakes of FFXI. What FFXI did right above all was being individual. Virtually every MMO in existence is a WoW clone. Change the formula I say.

When I'd had my fill with FFXI and was disgusted with it, I moved to WoW and loved it. Other than the problems I've already mentioned, community is very different in a game like WoW. In FFXI you might have partied with someone in the Dunes only to see them big and grown up later. You forge longer relationship with the entirety of the community. People all interact in a much bigger way than in WoW and this really gives a different scope.

Through word of mouth you know the top tier crafters. You know the people famous for leading certain linkshells. There is literal awe when certain people walk by... it's not because of their Tier X epics. It's because of their name. Likewise, people become notorious. People know to avoid them. As much as the endgame of FFXI is stupid (camping HNM pops) you get to know all of the top players that way. You're actually there going against them and watching them.

It's really akin to someone on your WoW server getting a Legendary item, but on a much larger scale with many more people. All these years later I can still tell you who are some of the top Goldsmiths, Clothcrafters and Bonecrafters. I can tell you many of the small handful of people who have fully upgraded relics. You can tell me a job class and I can probably tell you details about the top person in that job on the server or many anecdotes about different people of that class as I went.

In WoW, my knowledge was mostly within my guild. We knew of the other guilds. We talked with them, but it was less intimate. The guild was an island in the game and largely self contained. There is something to be said for that, but in the long run it didn't lead to the same types of memories.

[Del Murder]

Off topic to WK: you can sell items to NPC shops in FFXI. You usually get crap gil for them, like 10, but some low level drops can sell for a couple hundred (like land crab meat).

[Miriel]

I loved the social aspect of FFXI, what I didn't love was waiting around for it to happen. I like playing in parties but I don't like waiting hours to form a party. I like doing missions with other people, but didn't like how NOBODY used the mission flag and you either had to shout around town, beg your LS, or post in random FFXI forums trying to scrounge up people to get the mission done.

Once you get to the point where you are in a party and you are doing missions with a group, it's usually a lot of fun. Occasionally you group up with idiots, but at least you can poke fun at the experience. But the waiting and waiting and waiting. Argh. Frustrates me just thinking about it.

I'm not sure what the solution to the problem is. All I know is that I didn't like it.

[Yeargdribble]

I think the reason people didn't use the flags, Miriel, is that even if you were able to join in, you couldn't invite someone if they were a zone away (in a different region). This limitation on invites contributed heavily to the problem.

Using a more robust seeking system like that in WoW and allowing invitation from anywhere in the world would help a lot in that area I would suspect.

Also, simultaneous JP and US release will stop the wannabes from copying every silly thing JP players do just to fit in. The players can create their cultures independently.

[Madame Adequate]

I will just add that my best memory of FFXI was when I managed to get into a party of people who knew what they were doing, who were helpful in explaining things to newbish little me, and whose Japanese bard was both very friendly and very good at telling downtime where to get off. So I completely agree that the social experience can be great, even though I've never really stuck with the game that much.

[Wolf Kanno]

Off topic to WK: you can sell items to NPC shops in FFXI. You usually get crap gil for them, like 10, but some low level drops can sell for a couple hundred (like land crab meat).

I know you can sell to merchants but I want the ability to sell to them while I'm on the field. There are some RPGs that will actually auto-sell stuff if you reach your inventory limit and I don't see why MMO's don't follow this. They let you put stuff in the Bazaar while your on the field, why can't I sell them and get the dirt poor gil instead? Better to get something than having to throw the item away to fit stuff you need or backtracking constantly to find merchants to keep your inventory free, while possibly missing out on more useful items on the way there.

I loved the social aspect of FFXI, what I didn't love was waiting around for it to happen. I like playing in parties but I don't like waiting hours to form a party. I like doing missions with other people, but didn't like how NOBODY used the mission flag and you either had to shout around town, beg your LS, or post in random FFXI forums trying to scrounge up people to get the mission done.

Once you get to the point where you are in a party and you are doing missions with a group, it's usually a lot of fun. Occasionally you group up with idiots, but at least you can poke fun at the experience. But the waiting and waiting and waiting. Argh. Frustrates me just thinking about it.

I'm not sure what the solution to the problem is. All I know is that I didn't like it.

I'm a bit concerned about this as well. I'm apparently on a closed server so I might actually be one of the lowest level characters on there and I'm concerned with the prospect of getting stuck cause all the high level people are too busy to help me do quest that feel more like menial tasks to them (I have a friend on the server but for some reason PlayOnline won't let us chat with each other, so its difficult to get a hold of him). Still, at the same time, I appreciate that XI also does this and I feel Yeargdribble painted a nice picture as to why this is the way to go. Most of my friends are WoW fans but whenever I watch them play I notice they rarely do parties or only do them with people they know from day to day. It just seems like few of them ever talk or even reach out to people they don't know. Though I'm hardly a social person, I appreciate the social structure of XI.

[Del Murder]

Yes it would be nice to have a higher inventory space for drops or provide some way to sell things out in the field.

[Mirage]

Travelling merchants?