Nobuo Uematsu VS Yasunori Mitsuda

[Vice Nebulosa]

Well, to be honest, Nobuo has critical acclaim and its the basis I would use to determine the quality of said tracks.

Not going to fly for me, mate. A collection of subjective opinions, no matter how large or brimming with experience and education, says nothing about whether your subjective opinion will come to the same conclusion. Critics are about the least objective source of information imaginable; they make their living articulating their opinions, but their words are no more than that, and even a thousand critics may be "wrong" in your view, if you should happen to disagree with them. I grant you, if an artist is critically acclaimed by the most reputable, intelligent sources, your chances of coming across said artist's work and enjoying it are improved, but it is no guarantee. Credit is seldom placed precisely where it is due, after all; genius may be universally panned by critics out of sheer controversy, and mediocrity may be praised simply because it comes from a particular artist. It is not a perfect system, and though critics have much more objective knowledge of music theory than your average fan, the essence your argument eventually boils down to is: "other people like it, so it is good", and that is a principle with which I will disagree with a flagrancy you have never witnessed.

You go into any thread ans ask which OST he did was the best and I'm pretty damn sure you would get a bloody "war of words" going on as I highly doubt FF fans and critics could determine the best OST and actually agree on it. Yet I would say this inability to determine is a testament to his skill. I feel its a valid reason to say his music overall is "good" without basing it solely on subjective reasoning.

If you already happen to agree with that sentiment, then sure. If the critics flock to something you truly loathe, their acclaim should not even make you flinch before you announce that you believe the music is awful.

I do believe that most of the truly exceptional composers of our species eventually receive the recognition they deserve, but it is oftentimes hard-won, and slow in manifesting. In the meantime, the initial critics are pretty much obligated to call "genius" and "drudgery" on anything the least bit controversial in a dizzying, discordant flurry until the mainstream audience acquires the music and settles the matter somewhat with their sales and downloads. It seems likely (I don't know for certain) that Uematsu has quite a solid critical reception. Objectively, a critic could remark that a particular piece of his music is "intricate". The moment he says it is "beautiful", however, we enter subjective territory, and critics must necessarily describe the personal feelings evoked by an album, so that the audience has some idea of whether they are interested in the genre -- *breathes deeply* -- making critical acclaim valuable, but ultimately as open to interpretation as the music itself. One must hear the music and make up one's own mind, and whatever is determined thereby is the best measure of quality possible. Subjective? Of course. If music were not so, then Beethoven's "Moonlight Sonata" would be no more potent than a symphony of car horns on an urban street.

Its for this reason that I feel the "Spears" issue doesn't contradict this. Yes she's had more work done than Mitsuda (though looking at his list of contributions I actually feel he's done more than her)

I knew that either you or our resident White Wizard would do the research and say something like this. I simply summoned the name of the most popular, godawful artist I could think of at the time who seemed likely to have released more music than Mitsuda, but admittedly I was uncertain whether it was actually the case . . .

but how many are critically acclaimed and truly debated?

By who? Her fans and mainstream critics undoubtedly discuss her work to no end, simply because the tart is good business. I hope you do not mean to suggest that the perceived caliber of the critic has some bearing on the music, though?

Her very origins and position in music will probably never allow her to be fully recognized during the prime of her career. She has numbers but I don't think people would seriously debate pitting her against her own peers or greats of the past. I feel Mitsuda vs. Uematsu is far more close than Britney Spears vs. The Beatles. She lacks credibility in the minds of critics whereas Yasunori and Nobuo do not.

Which is all fine and reasonable, but quite far removed from our biggest initial question of "who writes the best music". I have no doubt whatsoever that the opinions of some critics can be altered with currency (the music industry being the viciously polluted thing that it is), and anything passed down in wisdom from such potentially fickle hands must be taken with salt. It may be a contributor, but never a deciding factor.

I have no real issue for your reasoning. We love things subjectively but I interpreted your discussion with The White Wizard of Finn as you trying to use subjective reasoning to determine the resolution of what I perceived as an objective question. That was my bad though.

Not really, to my thinking. We are simply working with different variations of an exceedingly open-ended question. And to claim that only one possible interpretation of a question like this exists would be as ridiculous as . . .

. . . as claiming that Uematsu is Mitsuda's equal.

So yeah; if you wish to consider it "your bad", please do so, but there is no harm done, and I certainly cannot say that you are "absolutely wrong".

I have no intention of really persuading you differently, I only wish for you to understand where I was coming from when I stated my choice which you yourself perceived as flawed reasoning.

Took me a while, but I do believe I comprehend the gist of your thinking now, Wolf.

I understand but this brings me back to my real choice. Which is that I cannot determine a clear victor for myself cause I feel the best of each composer in my mind is on equal ground for me.

Must be quite a restless position. When two gods take up arms and unleash melodic wrath on one another, there is bound to be some splash-back on the spectators. *_*

...or objective points, the discussion can go either way as long as we stick to one train of thought.

I have yet to be convinced that objective points alone are capable of settling this issue to any kind of satisfactory degree. Seems like we have reached an impasse of stubbornness.

Go for it, you can really hear it in some of his marching music like comparing Leftovers of the Dream of the Strong from Gears to Guardia Castle from Trigger. They are different but you can tell he approached both in a simialr fashion.

And . . . there are also some significant precursors to Xenosaga I in the Xenogears OST, notably "Gathering Stars in the Night Sky", compared to the opening of "Warmth". Both terribly affectionate pieces; I like it.

I only wish to say that my point here is not to discredit your opinion or your personal taste.

Never got that impression; no worries.

Glad to hear, I hope you might be able to appreciate his works as I do. Not that I feel it will change your mind. I can tell Mitsuda's impact on you and that's something that is very difficult to stand up to.

To say the least of it. ^_^ I am assuming Mitsuda addiction is not out of the question, and if so, I am most likely afflicted. Cannot smoke this substance, though; this stuff must be injected directly into the cerebrum.

I only hope you may be able to understand how some of us may have a much more difficult time discenering who we enjoy more.

*Nod* I hear you. Did you ever end up casting a vote, by the way?

As The White Wizard of Finn has pointed out, there are the Piano Collections and the "Arranged Collection (which basically means its the music redone with real instruments or an orchestra). I believe Mitsuda has made a few simialr albums with CT and Gears OST. OCRemix also hase some pretty good stuff as well. Monotone-Infinisty has also done some excellent remixes of the FF tracks (and a few Seiken Denetsu and SaGa games).

Here's a few of my fave examples of remixes:

Very cool. ^_^ I will make a point of listening to your suggested tracks in the near future. Operating on a dial-up connection here, and I do not quite have the needed time to load them all up (taking my elder brother out for a meal in honor of his second completed decade of existence, if the details are of merit). Soon, though, no doubt.

I'd say the equivalent of the X soundtrack in general

You did not just debase "Auron's Theme", "Fight With Seymour", and "Servants of the Mountain".

Oh, come on now. Composing something comparable to the genius of The Decisive Battle would be a dream come true!

. . . You know what, see you both in Tartarus.