Final Fantasy 8 is the best one out of 'em all.

[Wolf Kanno]

Please, Hot n' Cold is far more epic. EPIC!

It is but Triple Triad has held my interest far longer.

And having played through FF VIII, Squall really doesn't seem to slowly come out of his shell. It's a long, drawn out process, that just kind of happens all at once at one point. And, throughout the game, he does what you say, pushes people away and tries to justify it in his head. But that's basically all he does. His entire focus was on that one aspect of his personality, and that's hardly a deep character to me.

I feel its in how you see it. I personally notice his small changes and I feel it is gradual, until he finally "breaks" at the start of Disc 3. Squall created this mental defenses and I don't see him "warming up" as much as being "awkward" and "pushed into an emotional corner" which is much more human to me than someone who starts off as a jerk and just gradually becomes friendly. Neku from TWEWY is also simialr in this regard as he's a total asshole in the first chapter, becomes sympathetic in the 2nd, and finally becomes likable in the 3rd. I feel his actions do become less strong and I see him desperately try to hold onto his old way of thinking. His pushing away becomes less and less natural. To me, I find this to be growth and honestly, I like him being a loner asshole to begin with. I always seemed to agree with him about everything he thought concerning his crazy party and bull that went on in his story.

When an SNES game, within the first portion of the game, can add more to a character then the entirety of FF VIII did for Squall, then they have failed on a massive level. I'd start siting examples, but I have not the time.

Hey, I'm not saying he's Shakespeare or anything but I found it to be rather pleasant. There are better characters developments in gaming but I felt Squall was pretty good.

And on one final note, that damned Draw system is something that I hope, in the remainder of my life, will never be put into another game. It was not 'amusing'. It was mindless busy work.

I actually enjoyed it, the concept seemed a bit radical to me for some reason. Better than "matching game" in X.

The better part of me is saying not to bother, but here goes.

What ambition are you talking about? Could you please give us better examples of what you mean?

Stealing magic is a rare mechanic that is simply apart of VIII's unique FF battle system.

Summons that act like equipment and skills? You mean like Espers in FFVI? They gave abilities and augmented statistics just like in VIII, it was just a longer list in VIII.

The Drawing system hell just not having a traditional MP system seemed rather radical to me. The idea you have to steal your magic and that it wasn't natural for people was just an intriguing concept to me. Once again this may stem from my love of VI where all magic is considered some unnatural and evil force in the world. Its not a concept seen in good traditional "fantasy" stories.

Summons themselves are no longer restricted to MP and now have life of their own. You could have summons killed (theoretically though it rarely happened) so its was interesting cause the game tries to make summons like characters, though it failed in terms of plot.

As for the Junction system being similar to the Esper/Relic system... I think it only seems that way on paper but its completely different in practice. The Espers stat system only affected character on level up and for many people, they may never even notice it through a first or second playthrough. The game does not go to great lengths to make a big deal out of it. Hell, most of the system is kinda optional except if you want to learn magic but you can ignore all of it and the game can fall back on its unique class system to see you through it.

Junction is the Alpha and Omega of VIII. Your normal stats are terrible and Junction is not only your means to access abilities but its your actual stats. Its almost like breaking apart the Job class system and reducing it to the statistical level. Magic itself not only needs to be drawn out from enemies but they can be utlized for different purposes that go beyond their basic function of heal/attack/support. Taking a few cues from the Materia system, magic can be used to imbue your weapons with elemental/status properties as well as for defense.

Magic itself becomes not just another means to heal and attack but can be used to alter your characters statistics. This is a very new concept, there might be a few similar systems but not as direct as VIIIs.

Summons are now regarded as "living companions" that can be killed in battle, magic is now a resource, and junctioning is your only means of not making this game a living nightmare to complete as your party really is "mortal". There not like Cloud with genetic implants and DBZ style wire-fu shenanigans, or like Terra who is half human and half living embodiment of magical energy, or Cecil whose bloodline is responsible for most magical and technological achievements of his world, nor are they blessed with a god-like power of the crystals that somehow seperate them from modern man and places them on the road to save the world. Without the Junctions, they are simply normal.

EDIT: I also like how certain RPG staples were changed, "leveling up" the cornerstone of the JRPG and most RPGs in general is now considered a bad thing. Enemies no longer drop money, instead you get paid a salary. Both of thses were very unheard of concepts in console RPGs at the time if you think about it.

This I feel is what made this game so different from a lot of things that came before it. I think FFII is the only other one like this and since I played VIII before II, it has the bigger influence for me in regards to this train of thought.

FFVIII is not a sci fi story. The story does not deal with issues regarding science. This had already been done in VI and VII with experimenting on humans. Science & Technology play no larger a role in its setting than swords, sorcery, and magical beasts (Guardian Forces) do.

I disagree and I do feel the science element far outweighed the fantasy elements. This is my opinion and you won't be able to change my mind, so don't turn this back into that debate again as it really has nothing to do with whether VIII is a great game or not as I never implied VIII was bad for being sci-fi.

We don't need to derail this thread any further.