How can Kingdom Hearts appeal more to mainstream Disney fans?

[RedPouch]

Music might be the most important component of Disney films, though, and most Disney fans love the songs, I think!

I find that hard to see. I always hated the stupid songs in all of the Disney movies, with the exception of a very special few.

Which Disney movie was that?

Sleeping Beauty. It was my favourite Disney movie growing up as a kid. It did have one song in it that was vocalized by the main characters, but it was done in a much more subtle manner than how most songs are in Disney movies. The rest of the songs in Sleeping Beauty were done by Chorus [? Not sure if that's the proper word to use for it], which never bothered me at all.

Example: YouTube - WaltDisneyCartoons - Songs - Sleeping Beauty (The gifts of beauty and song)

[Depression Moon]

Well, Khalin, they were paying homage to classic Disney songs. Is it not common in Disney movies to sing?

Just because it's common doesn't mean it's good. I could never stand those stupid songs as a kid, and I always ended up hitting either "Mute" or "Fast Forward" whenever that nonsense came up. My mom would always laugh at me when I tried to rush past the songs.

My favourite Disney movie didn't have those kinds of songs.

Which Disney movie was that?

Music might be the most important component of Disney films, though, and most Disney fans love the musicals, I think!

Yes, most definitely, they do, and putting in that Atlantica musical was a homage to that.

That's right I can't get enough of these.

YouTube - The Hunchback of Notre Dame (Hellfire)
YouTube - Lion King - Circle of Life
YouTube - Aladdin & Jasmine - A Whole New World

[Ouch!]

The problem with attempting to appeal to mainstream Disney fans lies in the fact that it's almost impossible to do at this point without blatant rehashing of the movie plots which would likely result in an absolute bastardization of any continuity the games have going for them.

Jiro has it right. Kingdom Hearts has never been directed at the average Disney fan. It's target demographic is largely RPG (specifically Final Fantasy) fans who grew up with Kingdom Hearts. I remember when the first game came out, my 7-year-old neighbor got it and couldn't even make it past Traverse Town.

Any effort to try and placate Disney fans at this point is too little far too late.

[SuperMillionaire]

Well then how do you explain the Atlantica musical in KH2? That was a homage to mainstream Disney movies. And perhaps they can also go to the Disney Channel for extra promotion. And the very first Kingdom Hearts WAS aimed at the average Disney fan.

And for further promotion, put a promotional flyer in every Disney DVD release.

[Ouch!]

Well then how do you explain the Atlantica musical in KH2? That was a homage to mainstream Disney movies.

I call it an awkward rehash of the exact same plot we played through in the original Kingdom Hearts. It succeeded (I use the term loosely) as a mini game but would not function nearly as effectively if it became a staple of the series. An homage is typically just a respectful tip-of-the-hat. Making the whole game revolve around them would destroy any merit Kingdom Hearts might have.

And perhaps they can also go to the Disney Channel for extra promotion.

I never said they couldn't. That's about as far as I'm willing to go with it. At any rate, I do recall around Kingdom Hearts 2's release seeing some ads for the game on a bunch of different channels. Pushing it on the Disney Channel wouldn't hurt at all, but that's more of an advertising move and doesn't have significant bearing on the game's content (read: I don't give a smurf how they advertise the game).

And the very first Kingdom Hearts WAS aimed at the average Disney fan.

If you say so. I'm of the opinion that Squaresoft played a lot more on the inclusion of the Final Fantasy cameos to develop its target audience than it did on the Disney aspects. If the game was really about Disney, we wouldn't have the superficial Final Fantasy characters. Disney fans have always been Kingdom Hearts' secondary demographic.

And for further promotion, put a promotional flyer in every Disney DVD release.

Sure. But that also falls under advertising, and as such I don't really care how they do it.

I feel if you want more Disney involvement and more honest treatment of the Disney stories without warping them to a greater over-arching story's purposes, go pick up a Disney game. The inclusion of both Disney and Final Fantasy in Kingdom Hearts has always seemed like a bit of an afterthought to me since the core of the game's plot is in the original worlds (Destiny Islands, Traverse Town, Hallow Bastion, and
End of the World in KH and Twilight Town, Hallow Bastion, and the World That Never Was in KH2). The Disney and Final Fantasy additions have always seemed lackluster additions which only scratch the surface, and the interesting parts of the games are the original KH worlds and characters.

[Marshall Banana]

I don't think it's necessary to reproduce the plots of Disney films. The first game doesn't, really, save for a few events. I prefer that, too, because the recreations in KHII are bad. Why is Ursula even in the sequel?! Maybe Eric shouldn't be in the sequel either; it's enough for Ariel, Flounder, and Sebastian to just sing cute songs together. I don't appreciate the storytelling aspect of Atlantica (or the other worlds, I guess) at all.

[blackmage_nuke]

I think the way they reproduced the plot of disney films in KH 2 was appauling as you either a) saw the film and all you get is a ridiculus sumary of the movie with henchman replaced with heartless and no awesome music, or b) you didnt see the film and just get massive spoilers.

If they want to apeal to disney fans, rehashing plot isnt the way to do it, generally if youve seen a disney movie youve watched it quite a few times, what they want is something new, disney fans want to see how their favourite characters would deal with new situations and new problems and more of that clever characterisation weve grown to love.

[SuperMillionaire]

Disney fans have always been Kingdom Hearts' secondary demographic.

I thought they were supposed to be equal, since this was a joint project. All-Square and no Disney?

[Ouch!]

Disney fans have always been Kingdom Hearts' secondary demographic.

I thought they were supposed to be equal, since this was a joint project. All-Square and no Disney?

Pretty much. It's been a very imbalanced partnership since the very beginning. Aside from Donald, Goofy, and Mickey, there are no Disney characters with any significant roles, and the three are all very replaceable in the plot (in much the same way that the Final Fantasy characters are replaceable). The only characters in Kingdom Hearts who have any significant bearing on the plot are Sora, Riku, Kairi, Ansem, and the cast of Nobodies.

[SuperMillionaire]

Well then, perhaps Disney can make alternate versions for their main fanbase...?

[Ouch!]

I'd really rather they just make their own games and leave Kingdom Hearts to Square Enix.

[SuperMillionaire]

Then perhaps take out all the Disney characters?

[PuPu]

Then perhaps take out all the Disney characters?

KH - Disney = Final Fantasy

[Ouch!]

I don't mind having the Disney characters in Kingdom Hearts, I just don't think that making each world a very large focus of the game would be beneficial to the series as a whole. I think the best Disney characters in the game (Donald, Goofy, Mickey, Jiminy, Pete and Maleficent) are the ones who aren't bound to Disney canon.

The best way to make Disney characters important to the story is to give them a little more freedom beyond Disney canon. The problem with a large part of the Disney cast is that they're merely shadows of their own characters as a result of confining them to their own world. At least the Final Fantasy characters are given an individual identity (however slight) beyond their Final Fantasy counterparts. Doing the same for more of the Disney characters would be beneficial to the series as a whole.

[SuperMillionaire]

Didn't Disney make a rule with SE that those characters can't leave their own worlds? I would certainly be nice if they could leave their worlds, though.