Tunnel

[Serapy]

Bingo! That was a good example of expressing an opinion. I think and you think differently. Sharing this on the board doesn't still void the meaning of expressing an opinion.

I was being facetious.
And if it IS opinion, it is baseless. Opinions are like assholes. Everyone's got them and they're not worth .

You know what's ironic? Lychon uses these a lot, too.

Actually, it's not completely baseless. I copy a thing from the game (which is a fact) and paste into here, and then I express an opinion on that thing. That is not completely baseless. Way to exaggerate!

I have never asserted anything as fact.

That is exactly what you're doing. You are saying there is meaning in symbolism. That these things are present in FF8.

No, I have never once said "This is tehh truthzz", "Yo, it's true. Whatever you're saying is false" or something to that effect.

I express my view, and all of a sudden, you'd assume that I'm trying to assert it as fact. So, that's your fault, not mine!

Which means that it's not important for the West to gather new information from something that don't speak thier languages.

Which means they did not have the capital to risk a release in another language of a book tat they weren't sure would sell. It does not mean 'it's not important' or doesn't count or any of your excuses based on it only being in one language.

Then they are blind, because VII and VIII were sold very well in the West.

It doesn't make the information more or less invalid. There's a reason why Square doesn't release it in various languages.

It doesn't make the information invalid at all. Your crying about it only being in Japanese changes nothing.

It does change something. Look at this thread, it's adding up. That doesn't mean it changes nothing.

Where did I say that it was invalid?

You've been trying to say it's invalid, if not using that exact word- since the subject came up.

No, I didn't.

-Square releases this new information in an external source for the Japanese.
-Non-Japanese players are unaware of this because of two reasons:
--They don't understand Japanese.
--Ultimanias are not that very recognised in the West. This adds 1 to unawareness.

Leading to them not being likely to sell, making Square have less reason to risk them not selling and wasting money.

That's not true. Considering that they are a rich company.

They play VIII and that's it. That was Square's intention. If it wasn't thier intention, they would of have made Ultimania in various languages. OR re-make VIII.

The players are curious as to what's the difference between thier language in VIII and Japanese due to mis-translations. Players know this because they know that the Japanese developers made the game.

Ultimania on the other hand, not so much.

The players aren't curious about Ultimanias? Or Ultimanias aren't made by the developers? Because if the latter, they WERE.

No, they aren't.

You repeating that statement really boils down to conservatism pretty much.

Under what gorram definition of 'conservatism' are you using?

conservatism noun
/kənˈsɜː.və.tɪ.zəm/US pronunciation symbol/-ˈsɝː.və.t ̬ɪ-/ n [U]
the quality of often not liking or trusting change, especially sudden change

Saying that the Ultimania is invalid wasn't the main intention of my argument.

Yes, yes it is. Because YOU want to ignore the information that makes your precious R=U nonsense impossible, saying that it doesn't count because of all these random reasons.

No, it's not. 'Awareness' and 'invalid' has two different meanings.

I'm talking about the plot. Not the translations.

TRANSLATIONS INTRODUCE ERRORS INTO THE PLOT.

Not really. For example, Ultimecia saying 'K', instead of 'C', doesn't affect the plot.

I've already substantiated that the Ultimanias include some mistakes.

No. YOU HAVE NOT.

Yes, I have.

You have asserted that an error made in the english language manual holds more precedence than every Japanese source, ever, so you can pretend it's an error in the Ulti.

AC in Japanese supports this.

You've patently REFUSED to substantiate claims to this regard, even when I outright DEMANDED you do so.
CONCESSION ACCEPTED.

I already have. Talking about VII is irrelevant here, if we want to talk about it, let's move to the VII board and talk from there on.

You cannot deny the fact that Ultimanias include some errors.

They ain't that poor.

'The Spirits Within' nearly bankrupted them.
QED.

That's irrelevant. The Spirits Within =/= Ultimania.

Besides, it's much cheaper to produce a Ultimania than a movie.

Of course it counts for the Japanese.

It counts, PERIOD.

It counts for the Japanese. Square created it for them, not non-japanese.

Hmm... Imagine me being a creator. Imagine me writing this story and releases it now. People hear about it, they love it and express thier views with other fans.
After hearing thier interpretations myself as the creator. God! I hate these interpretations, how sissy! That wasn't what I expected.
How to change that? Easy, I'd go and make a public announcement and say, "He's gay." Problem solved!

What I'm saying is that once when you create something and release it to the public. Assuming that it has no plot errors, leave it at that! Don't ever modify it in the future. Don't ever modify it just 'cos you don't like your fans' interpretations. You write a story for the audience, not for yourself.

Imagine me not caring about your hypothetical, which is about as compelling as a wet tissue.
You write a story, feel free to NEVER EVER RELEASE NEW INFORMATION EVER. Or sequels. Those might also contradict the precious interpretations.

It doesn't matter if my story will contradict my fans' interpretations or not. Let them decide it. This story is created to show them, not for myself. I create it to impress them, not create it to impress myself. It's very plausible that my story will lead to various interpretations, anyway.

Creating sequels or whatever to disprove these interpretations will show how selfish I am.

Sure, you may not care about my story, but I'm sure someone else will.

Me, other writers? We'll risk crushing a few interpretations along the way. It's our prerogative.

That's your opinion.

I've just told you. AC and the Ultimania.

And you have yet to explain WHAT THESE ERRORS ARE.

I already have.

The English language manual was made at the same time as its English-language game.

And it got information from the Japanese version wrong. So I'ma trust the Original Language source.

So, you're admitting that external sources don't count? AC in Japanese shows this. AC is an external source, just like the Ultimania.

So, your defence is that the Ultimanias are perfect?

CONCESSION GODDAMN ACCEPTED.
RED HERRING NOTED.

That statement doesn't prove that the Ultimania is perfect.

Let me be explicit. I DON'T THINK THE ORIGINAL GAME IS PERFECT. Especially not the translation.

The VIII Japanese version is not perfect?

I'm not making any assertion.

You are LYING or IGNORANT. CHOOSE.

You've just assumed that I'm asserting anything as fact, which is not true. Otherwise I'd admit it.

So, you're admitting that you criticising my English was off-topic?

No. I'm saying his English is irrelevant to the reason why I did not respond to him further in that topic.

So, it seems that your temptation is overpowering yourself to keep arguing with me. You knew that this is going no where, and yet you keep doing it. I can say the same thing for myself. Oh, dear. The aliens are probably laughing at this.

Way to exaggerate. Some of them are saying it's nonsence, true, but look at thier guesses.

They're ALL saying it's complete nonsense, except for the one word, which you never spell that way. You're focusing on them saying this one word is sorta close to a real world and ignoring them saying the rest is gibberish.

They have never played VIII and yet they said identical words, how can that not raise some suspicion?

Both are essentially worse, since you can't understand a word or can't understand a sentence.

... 1. "Both are worse" than WHAT?
2. THERE ARE NO WORDS TO UNDERSTAND.

Both are worse than nothingness.

A thing separated from another thing but both share the same thing isn't 100% canon.

I refuse to even try and parse this til your grammar and vocabulary improves. Even I have limits on what I will attempt to comprehend, and you're well in the red zone.

All I can figure out is that you're asserting separation means things less canon, which makes no gorram sense.

VIII and Ultimania both share the same thing, but they are in different format. Therefore, not 100% canon.

Really? Then these companies would be less corrupted than they already are.

A claim you base on?

Money.

Not if you have a great level of motivation.

Motivation means jack with no skills or experience.

If you have got some motivation, you're likely to create skills or some experience.

I'm going to have to assume that you don't understand Japanese, too. So, what are you saying is a perfect example of hypocrisy.

You know what they say about assuming. Only in this case, I DO understand Japanese, so it only makes it out of you. But even if I couldn't, it wouldn't make me a hypocrite at all. It would mean I couldn't get a Job at Enix Japan either.

Then you have no motivation.

Shortcuts can't exist without something, such as any reason or meaning.

Yes, yes they can. 'The newspaper needs text on it' 'slap this on' is about as far as reason or meaning behind dummy text or most other shortcuts gets.

If it was a dummy text, it would be like just what you've said earlier, "fkufku agagag ekekekek wowowowo mamamamm kakakak kekeke woo ppeeeeeezz peko kmai odk sdijfsdfj siodjfosidj I9EW3DFKI KSDF MANj".

Are you implying that Ultimecia pulling Griever out of Squall's head is not connected with himself?

You are equivocating. Griever is not any random lion. He is a specific entity with a stated link to Squall. You're just generalizing this to be every lion ever.

I'm talking about lions in the plot. Of course, lions in the gameplay world (such as on world map) aren't connected.

When Griever came into existence, it's still connected with Squall. It's very possible that the lions on her Castle are connected with Squall. How can the symbolism of bravery and loyalty fit Ultimecia? Unless she's Rinoa, or Ultimecia showing bravery and loyalty in the name of her dead husband.

Or they are a decoration common to castles.

Why can't it be something else, not Lions? So, it must have a meaning.

That's not true.

Yes it is. To assert otherwise is just absurd.

No.

Lion is a symbol of bravery and loyalty. So, saying that not all lions are connected with himself sort of defeats his symbol of a lion in the first place.

No, because it's entirely possible for a Lion to not be symbolically connected with Squall.

It's been proven true that a lion represents bravery and loyalty. Squall himself said this in-game. He doesn't state a specific type of lion... he said it in general.

If everything in VIII was for bein' cool, it will have a lot of plot errors.

You say this based on?

Isn't it obvious?

Everything what I've shown here (e.g. dialogues, events, visual images, etc) are actually relevant to VIII. Therefore, what I did wasn't meaningless. True, I've mentioned some tiny information that doesn't actually exist in VIII; and thus irrelevant. But that doesn't mean meaningless as a whole. Way to exaggerate, brother.

Nope. NOTHING you've asserted here is actually relevant to FF8.You ASSERT it is, but it's not.

You're wrong.
I copy things from the game and paste them into here. How is that not relevant or related?

You, on the other hand, criticising my English was irrelevant and meaningless because it's not about VIII.

But it is relevant to this discussion because you are incoherent rather often in this thread, and it certainly damages your credibility when you cannot understand others or make yourself be understood. It makes your chances of understanding the game all the slimmer.

No, it's still not relevant. Criticising English =/= VIII.

Whenever you feel that something or someone is incorrect, you would usually sense the great temptation to fight against it.

So, you DO agree that you're off topic, then?
Not that I didn't fight against him. I quoted the dictionary at him and he refused to admit it invalidated his argument.

I'm taking about you. Not myself. I copy things from the game, so that's not off-topic.

Not in this forum section.

Perhaps people weren't as open with their thoughts, but I assure you there were trolls and people thought of as trolls.

Not in this forum section.

Our arguments are leading to various things. I don't think that is normal.

1. It is normal.
2. You DON''T remember.
3. You cannot read the thread to even try and see what we were talking about.

No, it's not normal. I create various views and you're arguing as if we are talking about one claim.

Then we're getting no where.

Because you're not taking it anywhere, like you need to.

It's getting no where simply because this is all about "let me look at your flaws" and discuss them. You started it, not me.

I just don't know why pointing at visual images aren't enough to be supported. Funny how dialogues are the easiest thing to be supported.

Because those images don't support what you say they support.

Yet you didn't provide evidence that they are actually meaningless.