Anyone see that they recently moved the doomsday clock back a few minutes. We are saved!
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I'll just live my life the best way that i can Of course I ponder the end of the world and all that but I don't let it bother me because even if the world were to end, what could I personally do to stop it? Probably nothing. Death is inevitable for me, so I'm going to live like i'm going to die someday
So you're saying it's impossible for a genetic abnormality to result in, say, a different density or color of fur? Because those can be very beneficial depending on the environment. There is no such thing as "beneficial" in a vacuum; actual scientists understand the term to be beneficial in a given environment with specific environmental pressures. And yes, they do happen. A lot.Originally Posted by Mercen-X
Uh... what?And by textbook, I suppose you refer to those "scientific" texts which have been forged filled with altered pictures by scientifically defamed authors who have long since been heavily criticized for their criminal behavior by their peers. Don't ask me why these pictures are still used in textbooks, I guess they just wanted to give you something to look at.
By scientific texts I mean ones that are based on evidence and research, not the wishes of a specific religion. There are scientists who actually research genetics and ecology and fossils. Then there are those who feel threatened by a worldview that doesn't mesh well with predetermined religious beliefs that are held without question. Guess which ones accept the fact of evolution?
If evolution was as far off base as the creationists claim, then our entire understanding of human and earth science would be destroyed. Modern medicine (antibiotics) is based on genetic mutations and adaptability, as is the reason bacteria are becoming more and more resistant to them. Everything we know about human anatomy confirms evolution happened: how else do you explain our jaw that is too small for our mouths (often requiring wisdom teeth removal); our eyes which are made backwards resulting in a blind spot; our back which is made for a four-legged animal; the male vas deferens (tube that leads from the testicles to the penis) which loops up and around the urethra instead of going in a straight line (caused by testicles anciently being internal and then dropping); the vestigal appendix (analogous to a herbivore's caecum used to digest cellulose); why mitochondria has its own DNA (as I mentioned earlier)?
How about the fact that humans have 46 chromosomes and all other primates have 48? Now, according to evolutionary theory, this can have one and only one explanation: a fusion of primate chromosomes from a common ancestor. And guess what, our chromosome 2 looks just like other primates' chromosomes 12 and 13, with the same genetic material and everything.
Actual science involves looking at the available evidence and explaining why it is so consistent with all other evidence. That's what scientists who study different facets of biology have done to explain the above, instead of just ignoring any and all evidence for fear of it contradicting a predetermined conclusion. There's so much information out there, if only people bothered to look.
Last edited by Raistlin; 01-25-2010 at 01:07 AM.
After taking an entire anthropology class devoted to the evidence of human evolution from a common ape ancestor, run by a proud Christian man, which took so many facets of evidence into account (though we mostly looked at the physical evidence of change - things such as the pelvis expanding and shortening, the shift of the vertebral foramen to the center of the skull to allow bipedalism) and showed step by step, each being who gradually became more and more like the modern human, from Australopithecus afarensis, one of the earliest examples of bipedal hominins, heavily ape but recognizable as a common ancestor, to homo erectus to homo heidelberganensis (one of the first hominins to show a real propensity for stone tool use and crafting), to the neandertals (contrary to popular belief, they aren't our direct ancestors, but were a separate branch from the modern human that died off when our ancestors either killed them directly or indirectly through competition) and then to what we are to and so on and so forth... the idea of evidence being faked or wrong is just a foreign concept to me. It's been proven and then some.
Considering modern definition of the term has absolutely no reference towards size, I'm going to blame you for being woefully ignorant.
Lol, name one specific case that would actually throw the teachings into question.
Ignorant Bible Fanatic is ignorant.
"Scientific" proof of God's existence does not exist. No evidence presented thus far of God's existence has or ever will be accepted by the "scientific" community. My request for proof of a beneficial mutation should not be considered unreasonable. Evolutionists claim their beliefs are stemmed from scientific research. Thus finding an example of a beneficial mutation, if, in fact, it does exist, should be easy.
However, I am not obligated to prove God's existence for my own belief because I acknowledge my belief as being "faith-based". If you want to argue we evolved from bacteria without offering uncompromised proof, then you are arguing on faith thus making Evolutionism a religion.
I am perfectly capable of accepting your beliefs as long as you acknowledge it as such. I will not try to dissuade you from believing as you do. But do not try to convince me that science has proven evolution. No evidence garnered through science has ever proven evolution.
At least when I argue for the sake of God, I am trying to benefit you, hoping you will see the light and your immortal soul be saved. When you try to convince me we evolved from germs, you're not benefitting me in the least. Look at the human race today. Children are getting dumber. Blame it on ADD, ADHD, mental retardation, whatever you want, but it doesn't change the fact that your evolution has not been of benefit.
Don't get me wrong, however, I do believe in evolution. The mind evolves by each generation that exists to teach the next. So what are we teaching our children? Are we teaching them the domino effect that has followed behind the "Big Bang?"
But the "Big Bang" did not cause itself, because a "Big Bang" cannot form from nothing. Either the universe always was (which is impossible because everything needs a beginning otherwise Evolutionists' argument that God needs a beginning wouldn't work) or the Big Bang was caused by sentience. That sentience naturally being God.
We did not evolve and God did not use evolution to create us. If God used evolution to make us, it makes him either retarded or sadistic, that we would have to survive generation after generation on luck until our bodies became perfect. God got it right the first time.
Those who believe we evolved from less and will evolve into something greater (at least your belief makes sense), no. We are as we've always been.
Those who believe we evolved from less and have reached perfection already, that's just a sad argument. If evolution has led to where we are now and this is perfection, evolution sucks.
"When you eliminate the impossible, what remains, however improbable must be the truth." --- Spock... God loves a Vulcan man.
People who require sight to see can be deceived as has been proven throughout the millennia.
Did You Know..?
Did you know it is human instinct to kill and fornicate for the purpose of animalistic domination? Just as it is with any other animal. Our supposed evolution has not altered this at all. So what then leads many of us today to believe that murder and adultery are wrong or should be illegal? Whether you choose to acknowledge it or admit to it, these truths are the word of God. If not for an eternal consequence there would be no reason to avoid killing each other and living life in one worldwide abysmal blood-orgy.
It is easy: pretty much everything that makes us up. Here is a list of more recent examples observed.Originally Posted by Mercen-X
Your refusal to learn about and understand all of the evidence does not negate the existence of such evidence. The framework of evolutionary theory is universally accepted among the academic community. The only hold-outs are groups of extremist and/or ignorant religious people with an agenda.If you want to argue we evolved from bacteria without offering uncompromised proof, then you are arguing on faith thus making Evolutionism a religion.
... huh? Are you saying that teaching evolution caused those things or that evolution shouldn't be taught because it's not a happy message? Either one is an absurd notion. Truth is not based on wishes or whims, or on how the public knowledge of that truth affects people. Truth simply is. Reality exists independent of whatever you want it to be.At least when I argue for the sake of God, I am trying to benefit you, hoping you will see the light and your immortal soul be saved. When you try to convince me we evolved from germs, you're not benefitting me in the least. Look at the human race today. Children are getting dumber. Blame it on ADD, ADHD, mental retardation, whatever you want, but it doesn't change the fact that your evolution has not been of benefit.
1. Evolutionary theory is not creation origin concepts.But the "Big Bang" did not cause itself, because a "Big Bang" cannot form from nothing. Either the universe always was (which is impossible because everything needs a beginning otherwise Evolutionists' argument that God needs a beginning wouldn't work) or the Big Bang was caused by sentience. That sentience naturally being God.
2. Your logic is simply begging the question. You have an unfounded assumption in 1) a sentient creator, and 2) that creator is your "God." And first off, the "god needs a beginning" argument is intended to show the argument from ignorance fallacy creationists employ to say "well the universe must have had a beginning because I can't comprehend otherwise!" If "everything must have a beginning" (another unfounded assumption), then any sentient creator must have a beginning. But the premise is unfounded to begin with.
You also did not respond to any of the examples I gave in my previous post about how human anatomy, physiology, and genetics all fit into an evolutionary framework that is not explained by creationism.
I'll give you a beneficial mutation example. Your thumbs.
A flower that's yellow and stands out more than other white flowers is another one.
Let's not call other members ignorant, NorthernChaosGod. Everyone has the right to their opinion without being insulted over it.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm fairly certain that doing the equivalent of a child sticking their fingers in theirs ears and yelling in the face of science makes you ignorant on the subject. I didn't call him stupid. Is it an insult if it's true?
Seriously, cut it out. If you don't like what he is saying, then put him on your ignore list or sort it out outside of the forum. This insulting in this thread is going to end now, either way - this forum is supposed to be for friendly discussion. Don't make me tell you this again.
This thread has been too far derailed; I'm closing it.
If anyone still wants to discuss evolution (in a mature manner), I suggest making a new thread in EoEo about it. ~ Rye
Last edited by Rye; 02-07-2010 at 10:37 AM.