>> Should Games go back to cartridges?

[Slothy]

but for all of the GoWs, Uncharteds, Halos and the like, the first parties are gonna wanna keep the price at full premium far longer than what than what might happen on a retail shelf.

I'm not totally convinced on that, but only because Gamestop not only rarely lowers prices (except for on unpopular games, yearly releases like sports titles, or literally a couple of years after release), they continually gank people on used games. As if it isn't bad enough they give someone $20-30 credit for a game tops and charge you $5 under the price of a new copy, they'll keep charging those prices long after it makes any sense. When I went to get a copy of Little Big Planet for my sister for Christmas they had used copies for $65 Canadian and new game of the year copies with all of the DLC for $70.

Even if console makers do gank us on downloadable games we won't be a lot worse off.

[Mirage]

well, a cartridge that could hold 8 GB (about the same size as a double layer DVD) wouldn't have to be much bigger than 1x1x0.2 inches. I'm pretty sure they could fit 16 GB or more into that size too, but it'd start to get a bit expensive. However, the cost of carts of those sizes would probably decrease as that kind of storage space would be necessary for games. It could be needed for games with a lot of high resolution video, such as FF13, but most games don't rely that much on prerendered stuff anymore, I think.

I'm really just bothered by the cost of games in either case, and I don't have a big problem taking care of my games. In fact, by the time my discs are too scratched up, I usually have an emulator for that console, or modded console that can play backup games ;)

Also, I sometimes put more than one disc into a single cover, but I try not to, because it seems they get scratched up more easily that way.

[Jiro]

A lot of my PS1 games are now absolutely useless due to scratching. Not because of irresponsibility, or even accidents, but because of general wear and tear. Repeated use of a game (ie taking it out of the case, putting it into the console and then removing it and putting it back in the case) does sometimes scratch the disks.

And I have always been careful not to scratch disks. Still happens.

[Bolivar]

Blu-Ray discs are supposed to be a lot less durable than your average CD/DVD

Hm???

[Yeargdribble]

Blu-Ray discs are supposed to be a lot less durable than your average CD/DVD

Hm???

This was only true with really old BR discs. This is due to data being much closer to the surface of the disc. However, for quite some time BR have been required to have a hard-coating on them which is highly scratch resistant.

While this is available for DVDs and CDs not all companies opt to use it, but BR discs are required to have said coating in one for or another. So in actuality BR are far more durable than most DVD/CDs.

[NorthernChaosGod]

smurfing outdated news.

[Loony BoB]

It should be noted that there is one problem for scratching of CDs to which age has little effect. The flimsy cases the CDs are placed in. Some of them allow them to slide around inside the box really easily due to a lack of decent gripping mechanism, or alternatively the gripping mechanism shatters into many tiny pieces quite easily (often pre-purchase, I've noted with annoyance) and the discs are damaged by these tiny pieces. Some casing is good, some sucks.

[Jessweeee♪]

That makes me think of this time I bought a brand new CD and broke it in half trying to get it out of the case for the first time ;_;

[Yeargdribble]

It should be noted that there is one problem for scratching of CDs to which age has little effect. The flimsy cases the CDs are placed in. Some of them allow them to slide around inside the box really easily due to a lack of decent gripping mechanism, or alternatively the gripping mechanism shatters into many tiny pieces quite easily (often pre-purchase, I've noted with annoyance) and the discs are damaged by these tiny pieces. Some casing is good, some sucks.

This was (and is) a problem with the old, brittle CD-style jewel cases, but all current gen console games come in DVD style cases where I've scarcely ever seen this happen.

However, you bring up an interesting point about resale. That's where scratching would be more of an issue and I might not give so much grief about you caring for your game. At the same time, if you're doing that then you know the risk you're running.

It also means it's in the publishers' best interests to keep games on a more flimsy medium since they want to cut out second-hand sales as much as possible.

[black orb]

>>> Well is not my job to defend other people arguments especially if they are from a different place, but what the hell..

Man I can't believe this is still going on and people are actually arguing about durability!!!

Going back to cartridges is a fun thought, hell I'd welcome it with open arms, but it's not practical by any means.

I'd gladly pay a little more fore each game if both the durability increased and the console became less likely to need repair. The cost of the console would also go down because it would need less hardware. The BR drive is what made the PS3 so expensive at launch. The 360's disc drive is notorious for scratching games if made before 2007. Why not use a flash card?

Also, have you noticed how cheap high-capacity drives are becoming? Yeah, they may retail for 10-20 bucks, but that's not what they cost to produce. The raw materials needed to make a flash card (a small circuit board, memory die, and plastic, copper) cost pennies--definitely under $5 each to produce. I wasn't suggesting we all go spend hundreds of dollars on a flash drive for each game.

That argument's wrong for many reasons. First of all, no one should reasonably expect their console to eat discs. The fact that 360's have done this is completely unexcusable. I never heard of PS2's doing this, but I know they really weren't well put together at first either.

>>> So, is true that the 360's disc drive scratched the games..

Second, I'm glad I got a PS3 with a Blu Ray drive. If you were a conscious shopper, you could easily find a PS3 for a reasonable price even in its first year. I know because I bought my 60GB refurbished for $300, what the console is selling for now without backwards compatibility and linux.

>>> That doesnt change the fact that the BR drive is what made the PS3 expensive at launch and the cost of the console would also go down because it would need less hardware..

.
How much do 50GB flash drives cost, btw?

>>> For the manufacturers, like $5. For a normal person like us, lots more.. But I can see the problem here because game developers and distributors don't make flash drives.. Plus this things get more and more cheaper every day..

Games should be cheaper (at least by now) anyway and I wouldn't want to pay more when my discs going back to the ps1 era still work fine.

>>> I`d rather have cheaper consoles..

I can say truthfully right now I've never had a disc get scratched up since I got my first Playstation.

>>> Good for you, sadly everyone isnt that lucky with their games..

I would never want to go back to the days of blowing in a cartridge.

>>> Flash drives are nothing like the old cartrigdes, so there is no need to go to those old days again..

[NorthernChaosGod]

That makes me think of this time I bought a brand new CD and broke it in half trying to get it out of the case for the first time ;_;

Oh, man! You have no idea how many times I've felt that I was going to snap a disc before getting it out of it's case for the first time. It's smurfing ridiculous.

It should be noted that there is one problem for scratching of CDs to which age has little effect. The flimsy cases the CDs are placed in. Some of them allow them to slide around inside the box really easily due to a lack of decent gripping mechanism, or alternatively the gripping mechanism shatters into many tiny pieces quite easily (often pre-purchase, I've noted with annoyance) and the discs are damaged by these tiny pieces. Some casing is good, some sucks.

Yeah, I hate that . If even one of those little plastics s breaks off the CD doesn't sit tight at all anymore. As Yearg said, the DVD style cases are so much better.

[Depression Moon]

CDs seemed to be the worst case for me. I have four copies of FFIX and each one of those copies has at least one disc that doesn't fully function right. i have two copies of VIII and I never had the chance to replace my copy of Threads of Fate.

Personally scratched games that I owned during the DVD generation is a lot smaller. The only ones I got that I had problems with scratches were ones that I bought second hand. So that's just Tekken 5 and Def Jam FFNY.

Since the awesome Blu-ray generation, none.


To above two or three in one case? Wouldn't that make the extra ones fall out when you open the case?

[ANGRYWOLF]

cost and storage capacity so the answer is no.

[Loony BoB]

It should be noted that flash drives are far more likely to go faulty (or missing) than a blu-ray disc in my experience. It's all down to the manufacturer and user, once again. If one of black orb's siblings were to ever-so-slightly be clumsy when removing or inserting a flash drive to a USB port then it could easily be buggered. It also brings out the potential for users to rather easily accidentally wipe the data. I'm not sure how secure a USB flash drive can be when it comes to disabling the ability to write/erase data from it, but CDs obviously have protection against that sort of thing.

I can see flash drives being used in the future but I don't look forward to it... I'd prefer blu-ray or even pure downloads.

[Yeargdribble]

I can say truthfully right now I've never had a disc get scratched up since I got my first Playstation.

>>> Good for you, sadly everyone isnt that lucky with their games..

Don't chalk it up to luck. Chalk it up to care. You seem set on making the case that disc based media will fracture and scratch just from being looked upon.

It seems that most people don't have a problem with disc media. If they did there would have been a much larger outcry much longer ago. The cases where someone has damaged their disc are generally due to crappy CD jewel cases breaking and not holding the disc tightly. For all intents and purposes, that argument is currently moot because all of the major consoles use DVD style cases which are less prone to this and the cases are easily replaceable in the odd event it does happen.

These discs aren't ages old parchment that crumble in your hands. If they are getting significantly damaged to the point of not functioning then it's more likely error on the part of the owner than on the part of the manufacturers.