Overratedroth.

[Forsaken Lover]

I thought Hojo was the best villain of FFVII.

[Sephiroth]

he uses the masamune to kill the president right?

but it stays there soo...

HOW DOES HE GET IT BACK LATER OMFG ITS INSANSE!!!

Square has solved this problem by giving him the ability to summon Masamune by will power. And actually it is fitting because it doesn't fit for Sephiroth to walk around with Masamune on his back or side.

And Hojo is insane. What an irony Sephiroth hates him that much because he thinks he is no great scientist compared to Doctor Gast. He hates his own father without knowing about the truth and Hojo even wanted him to become stronger at the end of Final Fantasy VII-1 right before he had the plan to become Omega.

And his motivation is not the desire to become stronger. It is his meaning of life. Sephiroth has accepted his legacy of JENOVA because he did understand JENOVA is more powerful than the Ancients plus even though he is emotionless there still are some moments which amuse him - torturing Cloud. Sephiroth is enormously arrogant and being beaten by a weak ShinRa soldier really was a shock for him (but only the first time, he doesn't care because he can come back) - probably even a greater shock than experiencing he is not only a human being. And that's part of his motivation.

Oh, and JENOVA is not brain-dead. Of course "her" body is dead but it still can control it's own will - but we cannot see that much of it because Sephiroth's will dominates it and with it the cells. So the brain itself wouldn't work of course but the soul itself would work and ass long as Sephiroth's and JENOVA's will/soul are controlled by themselves they can regenerate and reactivate their body so they can restore their brain of course as well. The ability of the reunion is a bit more difficult than it is actually used by JENOVA because you don't have to combine the head and the rest of the cells for the reunion. At least Sephiroth has a stronger reunion. He just needs some cells and then he uses his shapeshifting ability to reunite himself, like he did in Final Fantasy VII in the ShinRa Headquarters and in Advent Children. Of course "Reunion" is not the perfet name of it - other than the original process of JENOVA's reunion - but well - in Final Fantasy VII Advent Children this thing is called "Reunion" because a part of Sephiroth's soul merges with JENOVA cells and because it is the desire to reunite himself. A desire Kadaj doesn't understand because he has a new personality. He knows Sephiroth will return. But he doesn't know and understand why.

[Meat Puppet]

i would say that tim roth is neither underrated nor overrated.

[Audioattack]

Now I'm not just saying this because I hear people saying FFVII in general is overrated but I'm pretty sure Sephiroth is an extremely overrated villain.

The worst thing he does in the entire game, if I recall correctly, is burn down Cloud's village which has a total population of about 16 give or take a few NPC's. Whereas in the game previous, Kefka poisons an entire kingdom's water supply in not even the first 30 or so minutes of the game.

He's called a legendery warrior and whatnot and they like to talk about his unimaginable strength but don't just talk about it, show us! In the game he's barely seen and he's quite intimidating but it always just ends up in him making fun of Cloud, leaving, and a Jenova battle...


I. Garland found a crazy loophole in the time-space continuum.

II. Didn't bother to get far in II.

III. Same for III.

IV. Golbez took over the world's strongest kingdom and pretty much had a more-than-global (Overworld and underworld!) rampage.

V. Didn't get far enough in V for Ex-Death. ;_;

VI. Kefka actually destroys the world and becomes the god of magic. (We have our winner, folks.)

VII. Sephiroth is overrated.

VIII. Let's be honest here, Ultimecia has no reason for being evil, guys.

And so on and so forth.

Rant over! Can you agree with me?

Actually:
Cloud kills sephiroth two times , so how much of a badass i he really ?
the villain gets killed by some lame shinra troop who isnt first class but just some random troop :P
So i agree with you , he is overratedroth :P
but in the battles hes an angry motherf***er

[Clo]

Actually, if you think about it, isn't Jenova the real villain? You fight HER more times than you fight Sephiroth, and he's just a product of her anyway. Sephiroth is supposedly just "cooler" than a giant pink fetus with boobs.

[The Crystal]

Actually, if you think about it, isn't Jenova the real villain?

No. Jenova was a puppet, not even in control of her own body.
It was Jenova's body there, but who was interacting with you through it was Sephiroth.
It was allways Sephiroth.

You fight HER more times than you fight Sephiroth,

You fight Golbez more times than you fight Zemus, and you fight Beatrix more times than you fight Kuja. So I guess Golbez and Beatrix are the real villains of their games, right?

and he's just a product of her anyway.

Kuja is just a product of Garland too, but that doesn't make Garland the main villain of FFIX. Nor does the Esper injected inside Kefka(the one responsible for his his magic power) make him not be the main villain.

Sephiroth is supposedly just "cooler" than a giant pink fetus with boobs.

Oversimplification of Jenova's nature to make Sephiroth look bad. Sorry, but that's not gonna work.

[Clo]

Whoa, what a response.

I understand the counterarguments for the latter two sentences of mine, and I said them rather lightly, so your responses are correct.

No. Jenova was a puppet, not even in control of her own body.
It was Jenova's body there, but who was interacting with you through it was Sephiroth.
It was allways Sephiroth.

But I would like a little evidence of this. Either I missed something in the game, or maybe this is elaborated for the canon in spin-offs, but I was always under the impression that Sephiroth was NOT controlling Jenova, and her very cells had some sort of bizarre cognizance, so even divided she's still a functioning and self-controlling alien life form.

Unless there's some canon evidence, then this is just your interpretation of Jenova. If there's something in the FFVII I missed, then I fold.

EDIT: Actually, seeing as how I am bored, here is some evidence from the Final Fantasy Wiki that Jenova is a cognizant life form who is in fact controlling Sephiroth:

Four years later, the remains of Jenova housed in Shinra Headquarters morphed into the shape of Sephiroth, and massacred many people in the Shinra building

There, Sephiroth and Jenova joined together their wills, becoming as one

once the cells of Jenova have been separated from the main body, they will try to return back to her. If they are inside a host body, they can influence its mind and body so that it moves to the Reunion

Sephiroth does what he does because of Jenova. Yes, Sephiroth is the main villain blah blah blah because he's the one you fight, but Jenova is in charge the entire time, she's the root of it all, so it all happens because of her. This occurs in a way more indepth than even Garland's role as a puppet master, I believe.

Sephiroth is like a face to Jenova. They're joint in their main-villain-ness.

[Sephiroth]

JENOVA is the source of all evil. It all began with JENOVA once "she" arrived at the planet 2000 years before the story - and even before that it travelled around to absorb planets. But it is not the main villain. And it happens all because of Sephiroth. That is how it is. He became the new JENOVA at the moment his mind got stronger and he wanted to rule all souls.

And Sephiroth controls JENOVA's headless body. Not JENOVA itself does, so he is controlling it. He started its Reunion. Not JENOVA itself. He wanted it to start the reunion and then he has shapestifted its headless body for his own purposes. He is the perfect form of JENOVA because he has "her" abilities and even a greater will than her and JENOVA already was most likely the most powerful being before him.

And using Wikipedia for Final Fantasy in a discussion is the greatest joke ever. Every single idiot can edit Wikipedia, so even if there are 2 guys who write the truth, 8 other guys who don't have an idea will edit it. Square knows it way better than Wikipedia.

[Clo]

Thank you, Sephiroth. Your response was a lot more clear and explanatory. Especially this:

He became the new JENOVA at the moment his mind got stronger and he wanted to rule all souls.

That actually jogs my memory a bit. I think I remember that from the game or one of its spin offs.

But I'm still dubious about Sephiroth "starting" Reunion. Don't the Jenova cells just do this naturally? How is that Sephiroth used Jenova to start this? Wouldn't it be whatever willpower remains in Sephiroth taking advantage of Jenova's very nature for his own goals?

Also, in the end, Jenova accomplishes her goals via Sephiroth.

[Sephiroth]

Actually there is no explanation for it. Sephiroth just wanted to restore JENOVA. And both Sephiroth and JENOVA control reunion by their own will, not the cells itself do it. So they can decide when they want to start the reunion. And it would be idiotic to start the reunion before the story starts because Final Fantasy VII needs a story.

But Hojo wanted JENOVA to show him the reunion as well. That's why he placed the body in the headquarters. He thought the body would be the main part for the reunion - so the remaining cells would go to the place where the body is. But no, the head is the main part. Sephiroth had JENOVA's head and he controlled the cells so he wanted the head to call Cloud and the other clones.

The reunion of Advent Children is another form of the reunion, like I have already mentioned. It is exactly what Sephiroth does when he shapeshifts JENOVA's headless body into one of his own. I don't know why they decided to call it reunion as well (because they haven't explained) - but now it is how it is. Actually this shapeshifting ability is way more powerful than the reunion because Sephiroth can create an exact copy of his own body and so he is reborn with a new body and with his original will which makes him the "old" and original Sephiroth as powerful as ever. He doesn't even need a new complete reunion. However this shapeshifting ability is already explained by Sephiroth, Iphalna and the Ultimania Omega. It's cool Sephiroth can use it with JENOVA cells which aren't even his own. So it is more powerful. Would Sephiroth still be able to control Cloud he could even transform his body into a new Sephiroth body for his own purposes.

However, Sephiroth doesn't have all these power and abilities without reason. He is made to be such a cool and powerful antagonist. So he is definitely not overrated. But what should I say. I hate this ridiculus anti Final Fantasy VII hype, like the anti Final Fantasy VII "hypers" hate FF VII.

[Forsaken Lover]

Jenova is cooler than Sephiroth.

[Sephiroth]

JENOVA is just a giant tick with two tentacles. That's not cool.

EDIT@FL: You really have no idea.

EDIT II: I love it how Crystal posts everything I have already posted and obviously doesn't understand really everything.

[Clo]

I thought Jenova was cooler! Haha. She's an alien lifeform with a bizarre mutated female body that works as a parasite. I love the concept of Jenova.

[Forsaken Lover]

Jenova has apparently succeeded where dear ol' Seph failed ie. she's corrupted entire planets and traveled through space.

Plus when you listen to Ifalna describe how Jenova wiped out the Ancients and the Planet itself made all the WEAPONs just to try and stop her/it, it really impresses upon you how monstrous and powerful Jenova is.

[ReloadPsi]

I liked Sephiroth back when the game's graphics were too crap to tell how ridiculous he looked. It annoys me, though, that Sephiroth himself has so little involvement in the majority of the game's events and that it's mostly just Jenova trying to reunite.

So in short, yes, I agree: Kefka FTW.