And the proof of that is...?
And the proof of that is...?
The dozens of plot holes throughout the game that directly contradict OTHER plotholes? I promise you, this game has "just didn't care" plastered all over itOriginally Posted by Elpizo
EDIT: Before we start a big argument, let me just say that nobody is going to convince me that the plot of this game was thought through at all. Even if Square makes a XIII-2 (God I hope not) to retcon all this. It's just poorly written.
I'll leave my personal opinion of Harry Potter out of thisIf we go by this, the entire Harry Potter series sucks.
Though I haven't red them, I have seen snipets of the movies and it seems to me like it is done in reasonable fasion. The story acknowledges that there are questions that haven't been answered, and they will have to be answered in the sequel.
In FFXIII there is no such acknowledgement. The game essentially wraps itself up in a neat little package for a chliche happily ever after ending. Had it even been brought up in game it would have been an element that we have to wait to find out about. As it is it looks an awfully lot like they just didn't take the care to fully think about their plot.
That is where this is coming from. I spent the whole game going through hopping that the plot that made no sense would be wrapped up somehow in the end. This didn't happen. To me it looks like the writing team was so caught up in their character interactions that they whole plot was conceived just to get the characters into situations to exchange the dialog they wanted them to say. If they want to focus on characters and have a simple plot they should by all means go for it. Not my cup of tea, but I can deal. Just keep the plot simple and making sense.I promise you, this game has "just didn't care" plastered all over it
EDIT To Arcane's edit: I started this thread hoping someone could explain something I missed so I could actually accept this games plot. I would much rather like a game than dislike it. Doesn't look like that is going to happen
Exactly.If we go by this, the entire Harry Potter series sucks.
I want to point out that I genuinely did like this game. The plot made little sense for the second half, but the characters more than made up for it for me. I'm not saying the game is BAD for the plotholes, I'm just saying they obviously didn't put in as much time to work on the plot as they should have.EDIT To Arcane's edit: I started this thread hoping someone could explain something I missed so I could actually accept this games plot. I would much rather like a game than dislike it. Doesn't look like that is going to happen
As for the topic of the thread, I guess you could say that the fal'Cie were all made by the Maker with the general goal of "make the world better for humans." Each one chose a role that fit them once Cocoon was set up, rather than specifically being made with a set goal, like "You're the sun, you make food, etc." Thus, fal'Cie can't make new fal'Cie. Perhaps they filled the same role on Pulse before Cocoon was even made.
I mean it's not hinted at anywhere in the game that this is the case, but if it helps you buy the plot, there you go.
Does it say anywhere that the fal'Cie themselves made Cocoon? I mean, if I made a wooden box out of planks with a hammer and nails, can you say the hammer and nails made the box, or that I did it? Likewise, maybe the fal'Cie used l'Cie to do the making itself for them, while they simply thought of the blueprints. That way, it isn't really a plothole, as the game clearly states fal'Cie uses l'Cie to do what the fal'Cie themselves can't directly do because it's against their nature. And then the fal'Cie still technically made Cocoon.
Then again, what about specific fal'Cie like Eden who serves as Cocoon's sun, or the fal'Cie who makes the food... Aargh, you're right, it doesn't make sense.
Yes!
It was said that the Vile peaks are left over junk that the Fal'Cie brought up to fix Coccon after Fang trashed half of it last time. We can logically infer that they built, or at least had the ability to build Coccon in the same fashion.
If I disliked everything about the game I wouldn't be posting here, I would just ignore it and pretend it didn't happen like I do for XII. I'm just going off about the plot here.I want to point out that I genuinely did like this game. The plot made little sense for the second half, but the characters more than made up for it for me. I'm not saying the game is BAD for the plotholes, I'm just saying they obviously didn't put in as much time to work on the plot as they should have.
Maybe it's a glitch in the fal'Cie's AI. They always appear as machines in their battle forms, after all. XD
In the same way walking into a street lamp is a glitch in my AI
It would have been nice if they had elaborated a lot more about the Fal'Cie in game. Stuff like watching Prof. Gast's recordings in Icicle Inn was one of the best parts about the series.
Speaking of machines, in the ending when Orphan was going off and laughing like a cartoon super villian did he remind anyone of Megatron?
I was too busy calling him nasty words for being such a sadistic bastard (killing Fang over and over again, wow, I'm surprised SE did that).
The characters comment was in response to someone elses post, not the thread topic.This isn't about the characters it is about the Fal'Cie not making senseAnd in response to their actions not making sense?
Yes, but we can still do it. Even assuming that a Fal'Cie couldn't kill itself there is nothing saying a Fal'Cie couldn't kill another. If they put that one line of dialog in it would have made the story actually make a little bit of sense. Or how about selecting humans that actually want to destroy Coccon?The human mind has a reflex against stabbing itself.
The Fal'Cie had hundreds of years to think up a way to kill themselves, and the best they can come up with is to give a bunch of humans special powers and hope they do it? Seriously?
Yeah, the Fal'ciel can kill others, just not other Fal'Cie. I think thats actually so blatently obvious there isn't a need to state it. Otherwise they would have just flat out killed Orphan. Not every detail needs explained if it's glaringly obvious.
So yeah, they gave humans the power to do it. How else would they? Give the power to rabid squirels? Outside of Fal'ciel, there is really only Humans. And given Barthandulus's speech at the end, it's revealed Humans have a very high potential for power, enough to even defeat the Fal'cie.
Don't get me wrong, the main plot has some serious issues, but not making sense is not one of them. Made just fine sense without even reading the Datalog.
It doesn't seem obvious that Fal'Cie can't kill other Fal'Cie at all. They just can't go against their own function (which included their continued function). If they made a Fal'Cie that had the function of killing Orphan, well...
Also, why wouldn't you take humans that actually had a desire or predisposition to destroy Coccon in the first place? I could understand if they were in a rush, but they had literally hundreds of years to plan this out. Why would they act if they weren't in a rush?
The plan with the cavalry sounds like a half baked way to get them back to Coccon, indicative that their plan was completely falling apart. Of course anyone should have realized that it was completely obvious that is what would happen if you took a bunch of random people and told them to destroy the world.
Well, the fal'Cie main flaw was that they saw humans as tools only, and thus failed to see the power of one's own will and dreams.
They kind of contradict themselves there. They say they see people as only tools, but they also say they admire people's abilities to make their own choices. Just one more reason I can't bring myself to buy the Fal'Cie.Well, the fal'Cie main flaw was that they saw humans as tools only, and thus failed to see the power of one's own will and dreams.
Just saying, I think this makes more sense than fal'Cie being able to create other fal'Cie.
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