"You can put a 'J' in front of it...

[Bolivar]

but it's not an RPG"

This was said about FXIII in particular, but it applies to Final Fantasy in general, and many of the games we play at that.

Basically a Bioware developer questioned FFXIII's status as an RPG since you don't make characters, choices, etc.

My main thought is "Welcome to 198x..." He could've made this statement years ago, but with the console prominence of Western/Computer RPG's, it seems like either the media only recently got interested in this issue, or these guys have let their money get to their heads and now they have a chip on their shoulder.

I think we settled in this subforum a long time ago that what defines an RPG is some form of a numerical stat system with treasure/looting and some form of story-focus.

It makes me think of the Dungeons & Dragons modules based off of books based off of D&D, like Forgotten Realms. Sure you have some form of leeway in decision-making, you could fail I guess, but the characters and stories are pre-made and it would be hard to categorize these mods as anything other than RPG's.

Which is what JRPG's seem like to me.

Has this question not been settled or do we have our own inside-joke in our little community here?

[Madame Adequate]

Yeah, the question has been settled, putting a J in front doesn't make it an RPG, it makes it a JRPG. Which is a legitimate and easily identifiable subgenre regardless of what Westerners may say about it.

[KentaRawr!]

The relevancy of the term 'Role-Playing Game' is dead now. At this point, all RPG means is rocket propelled grenade that whatever game you're playing may involve stat manipulation.

[Rad Bromance]

The relevancy of the term 'Role-Playing Game' is dead now. At this point, all RPG means is rocket propelled grenade that whatever game you're playing may involve stat manipulation.

This. I wouldn't even consider "RPG" a valid genre anymore, because no one can decide what the hell it means and 95% of all video games ever made could probably be considered to be some level of "role playing" anyway. I've come to the conclusion that "RPG" never actually meant anything and just came about for games that developers really couldn't comfortably stick under a different genre.

[Flying Arrow]

Well, you can put a 'G' on the end of it, but FFXIII still isn't a game.

I kid, I kid.

[Rad Bromance]

Well, you can put a 'G' on the end of it, but FFXIII still isn't a game.

I kid, I kid.

"OMG PS3 HAS NO GAEMSSS ENJOR UR RROD EPIC LULZ!!!1111 CF XD!"

[Vyk]

Its a bad term for the genre, but the genre itself still exists, even if it isn't described correctly. Granted a lot of games use "RPG elements" and a lot of games blur the lines. But there's generally some standards. RPGs are pretty much the longest games out there. You can level up in some action games, but you probably won't be playing them for 40 hours. In RPGs the fighting is usually secondary and therefor pretty bare-bones if its an action-RPG, or "too" in-dept if its turn-based or tactical. I guess the genre just needs a different name. They're the novels of the video game world. Ideally they'd have longer stories, more characters, more character development, more locations. JRPGs are just anime styled variations with lots of cliche and a very linear plot

I still see "RPG" as a genre. It just doesn't have the right name, but we all know the genre

[Jiro]

The point that "it [the genre] has the wrong name" would've solved a lot of arguments over the years. I know what to expect from a JRPG, I make the association whether it's the right definition or not. Kind of like how my associations with the word aloof have nothing to do with the definition.

[Bolivar]

Well, you can put a 'G' on the end of it, but FFXIII still isn't a game.

I kid, I kid.

"OMG PS3 HAS NO GAEMSSS ENJOR UR RROD EPIC LULZ!!!1111 CF XD!"

Epic post and reply!

I think the original games were called RPG's because of the mechanics we've discussed (story focus, statistical progression, looting), but also because of the fantasy. Even games like Shadowrun and Mass Effect fall under some sub-genre of fantasy. I guess anything tending to be a game could, but there's a clear literary background for these games as well as pen-and-paper precedents.

What I'm trying to say is I think the term is useful. But I also think it's pretentious for a developer to claim it for his own region when there's plenty of justifications for its application. I think that's like saying "RPG" is a certain type of video game, defined by certain conventions, despite the fact that RPG crosses different mediums.

[Wolf Kanno]

^ I agree the man's comment is a bit arrogant and pretentious. I feel at the heart of most RPGs still lies the remnants of their ancestor the "paper/pen" RPG but it seems obvious that both versions (JRPG and WRPG) have gone in very different directions and both seem have grabbed on to one and two elements that made the original form of RPGs specials and ran with it.

I do feel that JRPG's tend to have a much more loose idea of what constitutes an RPG but to be fair, yet it can also be argued that WRPGs drop some major elements since most of the time combat is basically an Action game (usually FPS style if its the Elder Scroll series) with stats attached to them whereas the turn based combat in JRPG's is much closer to emulating a bunch of guys in battle using speed ratings to determine attack over and reading through their character sheets for their skills and spells to use in combat while calculating the damage through the game's mechanic system and the trusty dice.

The genre has been sleeping around and now the whole industry is filled with its offspring from other genres.

[Vyk]

The genre has been sleeping around and now the whole industry is filled with its offspring from other genres.

That's an awesome analogy xD

[Bolivar]

The genre has been sleeping around and now the whole industry is filled with its offspring from other genres.

That's an awesome analogy xD

I do feel that JRPG's tend to have a much more loose idea of what constitutes an RPG but to be fair, yet it can also be argued that WRPGs drop some major elements since most of the time combat is basically an Action game (usually FPS style if its the Elder Scroll series) with stats attached to them whereas the turn based combat in JRPG's is much closer to emulating a bunch of guys in battle using speed ratings to determine attack over and reading through their character sheets for their skills and spells to use in combat while calculating the damage through the game's mechanic system and the trusty dice.

this is really observant as well and definitely new cannon fodder if we ever have to defend ourselves when we venture out into other parts of the internet

[I Took the Red Pill]

Well, you can put a 'G' on the end of it, but FFXIII still isn't a game.

I kid, I kid.

i lol'd

[Jiro]

(usually FPS style if its the Elder Scroll series)

I move that the style of RPG that the Elder Scrolls series falls under be known as First Person Stabbers (or Slashers if you as so inclined)