So what's the deal?

[Proxy]

There's a debate going on about that in the VII thread. No, Sephiroth wanted to become a God. Not as a means to go to other planets and save. Being a god was the end, not the means. Definitely not for the greater good.

Touche.
But this topic got off track.
Anyway I'm going to rent it next weekend and give it a shot. I'll let you all know how my FFXIII experience goes. I'll post in this thread.

[VeloZer0]

I will take it in, unbiased and playing it as a Final Fantasy game.

I would advise you play it as a JRPG and not a Final Fantasy game. A significant part of my disappointment with the game was because I was measuring it against a very high standard. It's not really fair to the game, but as we all know the world isn't fair.

I don't know about that. I think there are plenty of JRPG's that don't fall within the FF series that are better than most of the games bearing the FF name. Persona 3 (or really just about any Shin Megami Tensei game I've played), Vagrant Story, Valkyria Chronicles, and hell, even Demon's Souls technically counts. I wouldn't put many FF's up there with them, despite many considering FF to be the pinnacle of JRPG gaming.

I meant JRPGs as a whole, there are a whole crap ton of mediocre games out there. I think that most people would consider the average level of quality of the FF series to be higher than that of the average level of JRPGs as a whole. Especially ones that enjoy it enough to sign up for a Final Fantasy forum.

[champagne supernova]

I meant JRPGs as a whole, there are a whole crap ton of mediocre games out there. I think that most people would consider the average level of quality of the FF series to be higher than that of the average level of JRPGs as a whole. Especially ones that enjoy it enough to sign up for a Final Fantasy forum.

I sometimes think that people join up for a Final Fantasy forum to complain about Final Fantasy.

[VeloZer0]

I sometimes think that people join up for a Final Fantasy forum to complain about Final Fantasy.

Well, even if that is the case at least it means they are passionate about the series

[Wolf Kanno]

I would rent it at least. Its got its problems but I feel everyone gets something different out of it so unless you go into the game with a mindset of love/hate you have a good chance of finding something enjoyable.

I personally didn't care for it cause it took away several elements I enjoy in RPGs and I felt it ruined my feelings about the world cause you never get to really know it very well so I often kept wondering why my party was trying to save the world so much. I didn't care for the characterization or the pacing of the story but it did actually lead up to a few noteworthy moments in the story so the cast does eventually get better with the exception of Vanille imho.

I felt the actual plot was pretty weak but only becomes really apparent after the party resolves their personal issues sometime around Chapter 7 and 8 and it suddenly becomes the main focus. Some found it compelling but I sort of felt they copped out and gave us a story that was far too simple.

I did like the combat. It has its own issues but nothing I felt was game breaking or anything. The main problem is that the game sacrifices a lot of the gaming elements in favor of telling a character driven story. So I feel a lot of XIII's appeal mostly comes down to whether you like the plot or not cause that's what's going to allow you to look past the other flaws. If the plot really captivates you then you probably wouldn't be bothered by the game's straight line dungeon design or lack of traditional towns. You would also appreciate the straightforward customization since it would not detract you as much.

Overall, I say give it a try at least. I don't feel negative commentary should ever be the final deciding factor on a game's enjoyment factor, you would be surprised what actually works for a person.

[Mirage]

The 20 first hours of the game are so stressing that I'm glad I'm past them. It's like being in a narrow corridor with a huge steamroller coming from behind and you have to run for 20 hours to get away from it. Sure, lots of stuff happens in that corridor, but there's always that 'roller behind you as you do them.

[Rad Bromance]

Yeah, if you wanted another FFXII style game you're going to be majorly disappointed. If you wanted another FFX you're going to be slightly less disappointed but still pretty disappointed. If you like adventure games with decent storylines, memorable characters and fun battles, you'll be quite happy.

FFXIII is a good game. The problem is, way too many people (ie, all the people who "hate it"), like every other FF title, have to compare and contrast it with the other FF titles and look at it from a "Final Fantasy fan" perspective. If you do this, then yeah, you're probably not going to like it as it doesn't resemble any of the past games much. But if you can look at it as a game in it's own right and not "another FF game", and you like story driven adventure games, you should be more than happy with it. I know I was.

[Shlup]

The main complaint in reviews seems to be that the game it "too linear," but... it's a Final Fantasy, for goodness sake. Yeah, it's super linear. It's an interactive movie, basically, but that's what I expect when I pick up an FF game.

It's pretty, it's fun, I like the characters, the battle system is cool... What the characters are doing or the last couple of chapters makes no sense to me but they look cool doing it so whatever.

[Loony BoB]

By all means rent it. If you don't like the game within the first few hours you aren't going to like it at all

I'd say closer to 10 hours. Basically, you want to get to the point that you unlock the crystarium and figure out how it works, at the very least.

My advice would be to play it as if it wasn't a Final Fantasy game but was just some RPG you heard about. You'll probably appreciate it more if you're not constantly comparing it to other FF games, which I don't know why anyone does anyway because FF games have been pretty radically different over the years.

[Slothy]

By all means rent it. If you don't like the game within the first few hours you aren't going to like it at all

I'd say closer to 10 hours. Basically, you want to get to the point that you unlock the crystarium and figure out how it works, at the very least.

You get the Crystarium five hours in and it honestly doesn't get much more complicated even 20 hours after that. Regardless, the sticking point if he runs into one will likely be the AI controlled characters and auto-battle, and it won't take 10 hours to decide if he likes or doesn't like them. I also hated the general lack of strategy with the whole Paradigm system on top of that, but I might have been able to deal with it if the battles were more involving.

I'd honestly say he'll know whether he likes or hates it in a little over five hours, because none of the early problems I had with the battle system ever got any better.

[Loony BoB]

*shrugs* I'm guessing you're someone who didn't like it from the start and I'm one of those that did. I imagine there are some people who fit inbetween out there, hence giving the game a little more time than one of either of ourselves being fair enough as far as I'm concerned. I found the more I got into the story behind certain characters, the more I enjoyed it, personally. You don't really know anything about some of the characters after five hours. Maybe you're looking at it purely from a gameplay point of view, in which case, yes, shortly after you get out of the stupid garbage dump chapter then I would say that you should have a better idea of whether you like the system or not. But for the characters, it's not until at least the following chapter is over (or preferrably the next chapter after that?) that you really get to feel that you know the characters. Maybe that's just me, though.

EDIT: And I found there was far, far, far, far more strategy involved with the battle system than there has ever been in a Final Fantasy game. I'm not sure what you were after, to be honest, but outside of the strict "black mage is only ever black mage, fighter can't use magic, etc." games, FF has never really had much strategy in the vast majority of battles.

[Rozaheku]

EDIT: And I found there was far, far, far, far more strategy involved with the battle system than there has ever been in a Final Fantasy game. I'm not sure what you were after, to be honest, but outside of the strict "black mage is only ever black mage, fighter can't use magic, etc." games, FF has never really had much strategy in the vast majority of battles.

Amen.

Anyway, the game isn't the best of the series but it certainly isn't the piece of garbage that people make it out to be either. The battle sytem is one of the best things about the game, and I think it's a lot more fun then in other FF games, I never got bored of it at least. It's a game that takes time (that's a nice way to put it), both the story and gameplay take a while to reach their full potential but when it does it really shines.

[Slothy]

EDIT: And I found there was far, far, far, far more strategy involved with the battle system than there has ever been in a Final Fantasy game. I'm not sure what you were after, to be honest, but outside of the strict "black mage is only ever black mage, fighter can't use magic, etc." games, FF has never really had much strategy in the vast majority of battles.

I agree to an extent about previous FF games, but regardless, I still found myself making more than three decisions in those games that would affect the outcome of the battle, and generally had to put more thought into character building in the ones that allowed for it, which resulted in more strategy before the battle even started.

I flew through FFXIII all the way to Chapter 11 using a grand total of three Paradigms and mashing auto-battle. That's far from what I would call having any strategic depth. And that's really the problem I have with the battle system; because there's no micromanagement, all you do is decide to attack, heal, or buff/debuff and let the computer do the rest. That's three choices that you'll be making for the entire game. And since most battles don't require any buffs or debuffs, you'll whittle that down to making two choices in most battles.

[Mirage]

The main complaint in reviews seems to be that the game it "too linear," but... it's a Final Fantasy, for goodness sake. Yeah, it's super linear. It's an interactive movie, basically, but that's what I expect when I pick up an FF game.

It's pretty, it's fun, I like the characters, the battle system is cool... What the characters are doing or the last couple of chapters makes no sense to me but they look cool doing it so whatever.

Its linearity isn't a problem to me. I mean, I liked FF10 and that's pretty damned linear for at least just as long as FF13.

But it doesn't have that steamroller behind you all the time. Maybe it's the pacing I don't like. There were almost no breathers, it was just STORYSTORYOMGFLASHYTHINGSHAPPENINGSTORYSTORYSTORYHUUUUUUGEMONSTERSTORYSTORYSTORY with almost no time to relax and find out anything else about the world. Almost every non-main-story information about the world you were in were fed to you by a stupid data log, rather than being things you found out about through talking to people, optional cut scenes.

[Loony BoB]

You know, I'm starting to think we should close this thread and just link to the last few that we said all of this stuff in beforehand. xD It would probably save ourselves a bit of time. Someone remind me to do this next time we have one of these threads.