Well hey, two free PSP games. I only ever use PSN to buy them in the first place, so whoopee!
Well hey, two free PSP games. I only ever use PSN to buy them in the first place, so whoopee!
This is what I find most amusing. The non-PS3 users seem far more pissed off and piteous than the PS3 users themselves. The lack of PSN hasn't seemed to hit any PS3 users that I know (including myself) very hard at all. Like BoB said, it's bad, but it's far from the end of the world. And free games? Why not!Originally Posted by Iceglow
you are kidding right? I have hate mail about not being able to play COD filling my email twice a day. (I wrote an article about how we should give Sony a chance, and some people took it as if I worked there.. I had to delete the article before more people saw it)This is what I find most amusing. The non-PS3 users seem far more pissed off and piteous than the PS3 users themselves. The lack of PSN hasn't seemed to hit any PS3 users that I know (including myself) very hard at all. Like BoB said, it's bad, but it's far from the end of the world. And free games? Why not!
This post brought to you by the power of boobs. Dear lord them boobs. Amen
Probably because all of my friends have lives and realise that CoD is a terrible game :')
I miss the PSN for my Netlflix account. I don't buy anything from the store, and barely play online (GT5 and Tekken 6). It's annoying, but I'll live.
Free games is nice to know.
The major issue I have with PSN being down is that I've downloaded some PS1 games to put on my PSP but I need to log on PSN to verify my PSP is registered under me, so I can't transfer them. I can still play the games just not on my PSP. Otherwise, Demon's Souls, MvC2 and SFIV are the only games I own that are really affected by online being down.
True beauty exists in things that last only for a moment.
Current Mood: And it's been a long December and there's reason to believe. Maybe this year will be better than the last. I can't remember all the times I tried to tell myself. To hold on to these moments as they pass...
Netflix still works. You just have to attempt to sign in to PSN until it stops bugging you, and for me I think it just asks twice.
I got Portal 2 today and I'm sad I can't tie my Steam account to it.
I don't know how it works transferring from a PS3 to a PSP, but if you transfer between a PC and a PSP you can avoid having to verify it over and over and over by just copying the .rif in the license folder
Netflix glitch apparently stopped working for most users last thursday according to the comments I have seen on the net.Netflix still works. You just have to attempt to sign in to PSN until it stops bugging you, and for me I think it just asks twice.
I got Portal 2 today and I'm sad I can't tie my Steam account to it.
In response to other comments in this thread:
Articles about the Sony fiasco are filled with comments by PS3 owners about howty Sony are at this for the moment and bitching that they can't play online. A cursory glance over my Facebook feed shows the ps3 owners there bitching at it too. A search for PS3 related pages turns up a lot of bitching at Sony pages on Facebook. Generally speaking you know a small number, less than 0.5% of the 77million reported members of PSN. The fact that you might know say 30 - 40 people with ps3 consoles and they all have "lives" as you put it means nothing. whats 30 - 40 out of 77 million? 1% is 770000 members. You're talking bout a drop in the ocean and need to look on the bigger picture.
Another thing is that the Xbox 360 owners are generally laughing this one up at the moment because in the eternal console war that goes on every place gamers talk one consistent "benefit" Sony users throw in the faces of Microsoft users is the free online gaming vs xbox live gold accounts at £39.99 a year. Whilst the standard reply has always been about mentioning that PSN stability is not very good and it will generally crash more often than XBL and you get what you pay for, a better online service with XBL over PSN. PSN users have always just tried to contest it. This fiasco however is pretty much irrefutable that MS have at least done something right and that Sony managed to break the laws of physics (see my earlier post on this) by dropping the ball so hard. It's a case of these smug little PS3 fanboys who constantly go on about it (theres some on here too, they know who they are) actually cannot defend this, this is pretty indefensible. The PSN will be offline for over 1 month. Being offline for over a month in the current top generation gaming market is a big deal. Its been estimated to have cost Sony $1.25 billion. That number alone points out just how much a big deal a stable, secure gaming network is in todays world and of course the value of not pissing off every fringe group out there. MS don't get hacked, not because it isn't worth doing there are millions of users credit card details on it. It isn't hacked because MS haven't tried to stomp around like Godzilla and also because MS invested in the development of their network using money found exclusively through the registration fees for it. Sony was running outdated software, no firewalls...the list of flaws goes on. If Sony had been charging for the PSN from day one as would have been sensible when your £450 console cost over £600 each to make (original UK figures on the ps3) and the newer version of the console costs around £270 to make and sells for £300 thereabouts then Sony 1) wouldn't still be operating at a loss on the PS3. 2) would have had money to invest in to the psn, whats more they would have been expected by their loyal customers to invest more in it, security and stability would have been vastly improved. So the free online gaming is mainly a gimmick rather than a logical business plan.
Long term for Sony, a loss of $1.25bn is a major blow, this is not counting recouped losses from developers like Capcom who estimate the outage has cost them hundreds of thousands if not millions so far and would be seeking some kind of compensation/reimbursement. The console was finally seeing a gain towards breaking even after being sold for a loss for many years. Though admittedly Sony could have kept costs down by keeping hardware the same over the years rather than pay developers and designers to re-do the console in a style which physically looks worse. Not to mention the fact that there has been around 10 different HDD sizes available over the years. If you consider it takes more than just plugging in a different HDD for a games console. It takes the buying, sourcing or producing of the HDD and other components then making the consoles and changing the computer controlled assembly lines programming to cope with changes in components it quickly becomes an expensive endeavour. This recent fiasco is not helping the company with their customers, many of whom frustrated with the lack of information, customer care or ability of the Sony technicians to get the PSN up and running again are turning to "the dark side" and trading in their PS3 consoles and getting cheap blu-ray players for their films and 360's for their gaming (Ironically, this option can work out cheaper with sales and special purchase price points in stores to buying a ps3 to begin with) and joining XBL. Combined the losses made on the ps3 I do not believe will be the death-knell for Sony as a games company like many other bloggers and game journalists are saying. It will however send important messages to Sony and the games industry about how to handle customers, networking and so forth. I would be very surprised if the PSN stayed free, especially once the PS3s successor console comes on to the market and the NGP later this year. Sony has made huge losses and the only real way to recoup these losses is to take away the privilege of free online multi-player gaming. If Sony ignores and absorbs yet more losses from their gaming side then I would be surprised if in years to come we see a Playstation 3 successor because losses like the ones already sustained by Sony on the PS3 is enough to have taken some of their rivals from the time of the PS2 out of the market, yes we're talking Sega and we're talking about the Dreamcast vs the PS1 and PS2. Either way the real losers here are not going to be Sony, it will be the customers of Sony. Customers who will see games developers either force Sony's hand on charging for the access to the PSN to recover losses and to cover the hefty loss of income lawsuits that will follow or an increase in the price of hardware. (or likely as the ps3 is still "overpriced" compared to it's rivals hardware a lack in price drops) That or they will see less PS related exclusives as games developers upset with the lack of compensation for loss of income turn their back on Sony and focus more on Microsoft and Nintendo.
I can guarantee almost that the games Sony offer as compensation in Europe will be Sony in-house titles. I can also almost certainly guarantee that they will be Platinum titles on the PS3 and either Platinum or "best seller" series on the PSP. A choice of 5 (ps3) and 4 (psp) is not exactly a huge choice when it comes to Sony games in that market. LBP will probably be one along with Uncharted/Uncharted 2 but thats me being optimistic about Sony putting good stuff in there. I doubt sincerely that any out of house publisher is going to let Sony give their game away free as compensation for Sony's smurf up when it's costing them money. If Sony therefore offers out of house titles that is further losses to the company (since they will then have to pay the full retail price to the publisher) which it can ill afford at this time.
Further hurting Sony is that retailers are finding it hard to recommend purchasing the PSP Go! system or the PS3 at this time. Online gaming is a must for the PSP Go! and a big part of gaming for the PS3. I work in games retail and every time a customer asks me about the PSP Go! I have to say "So yeah the console costs you this much but it must connect to the PSN. The main issue there with that is that the PSN is down and isn't expected to be back online until around May the 31st. Which means sure, you can buy the console now but you won't be able to do anything at all with it until the 31st at the earliest." At which point customers either give up since there is no point in buying it or customers ask me about the Nintendo 3DS instead. When it comes to the PS3, people come in expecting to buy the console and CoD Black Ops or Crysis 2 and I'm asked about online, I have to tell them the same thing that the console cannot go online until then. Something which could affect the obtaining of Trophies or even the playability of the game (update patches which are especially common on the PS3 right after launch of a title since the games tend to be less finished than their 360 counterparts due to difficulty of coding for the console) So customers end up buying 360s instead since they save almost £100 and can still get Black Ops and Crysis 2 but can play them online straight away provided they buy XBL gold membership out of that near £100 saving or sign up for a new windows live account to get a 1 month free trial of XBL gold.
I think I've pointed out why 360 owners get to laugh and point out the massive failings of Sony here and also why the only losers really in all of this will be Sony fans.
@Iceglow, obviously you don't have a PS3, and you quite clearly don't like Sony and their consoles so what could anyone in this thread possibly gain from reading that big wall of fanboy text? I mean, aren't their special XBox circle jerk forums for that kind of thing?
I'm as pissed that I can't play some battlefield: BC2 as everybody else, I was moderately worried about the identity theft possibilities even though I only have a debit card tied to my PSN, and I'm pretty meh about the whole PS3 vs XBox thing (my first major console was a ps1, so there's obvious nostalgia I guess, but when I bought a PS3 I figured KH3, Tekken 6 and the new God of War would all be on it, and I'd just grabbed KotOR 1 and 2 for PC so I figured it was the purchase better suited for me), but it really irks me when fanboys use the bad situations of others to jump around in their little jester hats and limited addition XBox/PS3/Wii logo tighty wighties and yell "I told you so". It's especially annoying when there's a full business strategy posted on how you could do things better and why we're all suckers for buying a gaming console. Go play your preferred console, have fun, and stop acting like an uppity fanboy every time something that affects you in no way, shape, or form goes wrong with a company you have no reason to hate.
Iceglow, two words (SPOILER)red ring if you're just going to sit here and use this as a propaganda machine for Microsoft, I'd rather you just refrain from doing so cause this is something with bigger issues attached to it and listening to you tun it into another Microsoft vs Sony fanboy debate is both insensitive and just plain sad. So if you don't have anything nice to say, then I ask you to just remain silent and leave the fanboy remarks for another day.
True beauty exists in things that last only for a moment.
Current Mood: And it's been a long December and there's reason to believe. Maybe this year will be better than the last. I can't remember all the times I tried to tell myself. To hold on to these moments as they pass...
I don't own a ps3 you're right. However I never said I disliked Sony's products (sitting here on a Sony Vaio laptop writing this so lol) or the ps3. I wouldn't consider myself to be a microsoft fanboy, theres plenty MS got wrong about the 360, for a start the HD-DVD format was a complete failure, supporting it in the face of Blu-ray was a costly mistake. The Red Ring of Death, ok so Sony has it's failure in the Yellow Light of Death which is just as potent but MS definitely could have handled the RROD better. In-house development games, MS is particulary bad at getting good ones on to it's console. Halo was exclusive but not MS developed. Same goes for Mass Effect 1.
In short I am a fan of gaming in general. There are a handful of games I cannot get on my 360 out on the PS3 I would consider buying the console for. However I cannot quite justify the cost just yet. I work in gaming retail, I can have a preference but it's easier not to because when I'm at work I can't be biased, I have to sell all formats with equal passion and zest. I haven't considered myself a particularly big fan of Nintendo's hardware or handhelds for the past 2 generations since the demise of the N-64 and the Game Boy Advance. The Cube was simply awful, the Wii a gimmick and Touchscreen controls on the DS rarely work well imho. And yet at work I am expected to understand, know and exhibit a passion for Nintendo products, in fact my "section" of the department is the 3DS format and I make it successful because I'm able to look past the failings of the touchscreen controls and see it as a fun handheld console with a promising future. My above post disassembling the failings of Sony to prevent, contain and control the hack of the PSN and the restoration the PSN to their own deadlines. Pointing out the cost to Sony (estimated) and what damaging lasting effects this could have on Sony is nothing less than that. I'm laughing with the rest of the 360 owners sure, our consoles work fine online. However I am laughing in the sense of pitying PS3 owners. It's a terrible joke really and genuinely I feel sorry for the millions of customers who've never done anything wrong and are now suffering because of this.
The figures and "business plan" as you put it in my above post are not mine, they are the summations of many different articles combined and cruel, cold, hard logic. It is irrefutable that the hack is costing Sony in the ball park of $1.25bn, it is irrefutable that the PS3 has been sold at a loss for many, many years, it is irrefutable that the changing of the hardware in a console of any manufacture costs money and that Sony has done this far more often than any other console manufacturer. It is irrefutable that the losses Sony has made and the failings of Sony to update and protect it's customer data and PSN servers could have been avoided or at least offset in some way by the charging of membership for the access of the PSN to play games online. Playing games online is a privilege not a right, bout time gamers realized that. It is irrefutable that Capcom at the very least has already dropped hints that it is considering the suing of Sony for hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars for lost revenue. If the lawsuit is not settled or if Sony wins it is logical that development companies might focus more on other formats which have not through incompetence left them out of pocket on large sums of money which was budgeted for and can affect the development of new titles, if a developer is not developing games then they are out of work and that means job losses as well as fewer if any games ever from that studio again. It is logical if Sony is to continue as a games console manufacturer that eventually they will (or should) remove the privilege of free online gaming in favour of charging for it, something Microsoft has proven works. This would allow Sony to recover some of it's massive losses on this matter and from the perspective of the consumer would be better since as you are paying for a service you expect and demand a far better service than you accept when it is free, again this is not me saying how I could do this better, it is me logically extrapolating and analyzing the figures.
As to which console is better and fanboyism? Well straight up here's the one question which makes everyone shut the smurf up when it's asked. What console do your friends have? If you answered that with the Xbox 360 then go buy a 360, regardless of which one has better graphics or hardware. If you answered PS3 go buy a PS3 because it doesn't matter who has the better online network. If you answered Wii, think about what games you would rather play, what kind of gamer you are and what features you'd like from a console because there is little sense in buying a Wii if you are a "hardcore" (god I hate that term) gamer. I own a 360 because my closest friends own 360s there was little to decide there. Todays gaming world is as much about socializing as it is gaming. The main reason for buying any console is always to enjoy playing games with friends, therefore regardless of features or hardware if your friends all have 360 consoles there is little to no point in buying a PS3 because then when they're laughing bout the ridiculous game they had last night online you won't be able to join in with them because even if you were playing the same game last night, you weren't there. Same goes if your friends all have PS3s. I do not consider myself a fanboy of any particular gaming format. Everyone has the right to choose what console they buy but the core reason should be the one which provides the most fun. As I said Gaming is as much about the social aspect of online gaming these days as it is the actual gaming. So 360 owners won't get to play Killzone and PS3 owners don't get to play Halo what can you do eh? Nothing really thats not to say that PS3 owners won't have fun because Halo Reach was better than Killzone 3 and it's not to say that 360 owners won't have fun because they don't have a game like Heavy Rain either. In the best possible situation, people would own both consoles but doing so is expensive and even those of us who work with games all day, every day can understand that you can't always get both more than most because if anything we are the ones who are most likely to want both. Therefore we all decide. I decided based on cold hard logic of what I want from gaming, that doesn't mean I hate the PS3, it doesn't mean I hate PS3 owners either or that I'm jealous of PS3 owners, if I wanted I could buy a second hand 60GB model or a 40GB model for under £100 today. Fact is I won't because at this time the 10 or so games what I want on the PS3 what are not on the 360 already don't quite justify the purchase of a new console, it'd also make me spend more money on gaming that frankly I cannot afford to spend if I intend to pay my bills, live independently of my family and put some aside for holidays etc.
The fanboy argument is hilariously funny in my eyes. I tend to join in the fanboy arguments for the laughs in it and because I own a 360 the PS3 fanboys decide that I fall on the 360 side of the line not I. However if actually asked my opinion on gaming away from the "fanboy wars" you'd get a very similar response to the above paragraph. I don't own a jester hat, though that sounds like a cool idea there, thanks! I happen to own a handful of gaming related T-shirts (no underwear though, if you see some around, feel free to mail me a size medium in them) they are more for individual titles however though the only ones for the 360 are my Gears of War one and my Halo ODST one. I own a Black Ops one which has the Xbox 360 logo but thats because MS paid for them to be made for promotional purposes at my work on launch day of Black Ops. The rest of my gaming shirts are an ancient PS2 launch TS and Nintendo 3DS ones I got from work (I also have a 3DS white coat from the launch event) I don't make a habit of buying gaming related clothing often, mostly I get them as promotional stuff from work where I'm expected to wear them for a couple of days/weeks and then get to keep them.
So to you Eternal Essence, get off your fanboy high horse there, chill out some. My previous post you commented on was not intended to get you all riled up but to point out that Sony has dropped a major ball here and that there are a lot of issues from this some of which affect not just Sony or Sony customers but the entire gaming market to a degree.
It's not the end of the world that the PSN is down but it is a major issue for Sony and the worst punchline in the world is that Sony are not going to be the ones to suffer for all of this, it's the people already suffering because of the lack of service, poor communication releases from Sony and general lack of competence being displayed by a company who infamously decided that they wanted gamers to feel like they had "worked for their console" when deciding it's launch price and said so publicly. If they want you to feel like you've worked for your console then the least you as a PS3 owner could expect or demand in return is the manufacturers to show a degree of competence when dealing with issues like this. As for if Sony brought the recent troubles with the PSN on itself? Yes, yes it did. Through many things, 1) trying to stomp around like Godzilla to protect it's hardware, there were many subtle things they could have done to protect the PS3 rather than the massive mess of a legal battle they have made. 2) through not updating it's webserver programs or utilizing basic network security such as firewalls. 3) and probably the biggest mistake of it all, assuming that no one would dare to hack the PSN to such a scale. Thats not the Sony consumers fault none of it is, it was all down to Sony. Have Sony consumers got the right to be mad at Sony for this? To stop using Sony products? To switch to their main rivals MS for their gaming needs? Definitely yes to all of those, especially since regardless of the package they offer, no compensation is ever going to be truly enough to repair the damage for something which should have been either impossible or never should have happened in the first place. Especially considering it was possible so easily through incompetence. Should heads at Sony's highest level of Playstation head office? I don't personally think they should, they probably will but I'm more of a fan of the idea that people will see situations like this and learn from their mistakes and rectify that regardless of what that takes so it doesn't happen again. However big corporations never work that way and once this is all over I would be unsurprised to hear that several people get moved around or dismissed/resign from the company.
Edit: WK read this post carefully for it seems you've fallen in to a trap here and well, you might learn something bout me from this post.
That you don't listen when someone asks you politely not to rub salt in people wounds cause you feel you made a better arbitrary choice on what mechanical device you decided to choose to waste time on that could be better served actually doing something relevant for the human race (and don't think the irony of me making this statement has escaped me).
But seriously, you need to stop being insensitive about people possibly now having to worry about credit and identity theft. This whole "Sony sucks, fanboys are stupid for for not blowing this out of proportion and demanding Sony be dismantled and the liquidation of the company be used as compensation, and me and the other 360 owner are just laughing" doesn't really strike me as being fair and non-bias at this point. Attacking other members with your long gibberish posts for not agreeing with you is not exactly making me cozy up to your position on this matter as well. So once again, I will simply ask you to please stop posting in this thread if its just going to be more "360 owners are laughing at how pathetic this all is" or "who wishes they were paying for protected online service now?". So please just stop talking.
True beauty exists in things that last only for a moment.
Current Mood: And it's been a long December and there's reason to believe. Maybe this year will be better than the last. I can't remember all the times I tried to tell myself. To hold on to these moments as they pass...
I think a fat wall of text from Iceglow is exactly what this thread needs personally. Polite discussion on video game related stuff gets boring after a while.
As for the discussion itself, well I have nothing to contribute as I haven't realy cared about this hack for a while now. Although I thought it was quite funny watching Kaz Hirai and other Sony execs bowing for forgiveness at their conference.. As if anybody is really that mad at them. Honestly they are the victims in all this and I don't think they need to hand out free stuff. Just work on getting the PSN back up and finding the hackers. Thats good enough for me.
Wait, what? That's weird, I thought the users with their information stolen were the victims. Yes, they were the victims of the crime, but that was down to their own poor security as much as it was down to the hackers. I do agree that the hackers are the criminals, but c'mon... if you had a million dollars in cash, would you leave it on the floor of your house and forget to lock the door? That's kind of what they did. Poor security was a fault of theirs, and they did need to apologise (be it a bow, free games or whatever) because they did make a mistake by not putting up a strong security system, and we are the victims for their mistake.
Bow before the mighty Javoo!
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