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Thread: How would you fix FFVI?

  1. #31
    Eggstreme Wheelie Recognized Member Jiro's Avatar
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    Bushido definitely needs a new method of input. Waiting seemed hardly necessary. If I ever needed to have him do a move, it was either Level 1 or I got the rest of my party to go and let him charge while they attacked.

    Will have to give Strago more of a chance. Definitely think physical attacks should be nerfed, greatly. Magic plays such an important role in the game but it's not that powerful, or at least, physical attacks are enough. Give it prominence, make it powerful.

    Celes' abilities lie in her Red Mage like set up. While Terra would eclipse her in magical ability, Celes should also be able to wipe the floor with Terra physically. More health and defence etc would allow Celes to last longer in those tough battles.

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  2. #32

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    The game's not hard when you can level up. You know the game well when you play on a handicap. Luckily these days the developer has all this insight from forums like these to go on.
    http://www.youtube.com/Greatermaxim

    Terra..................Fight
    LV99...................Morph
    HP9999................All Magic
    MP999.................Item

    Vigor 45................R-Hand: Illumina
    Speed 90..............L-Hand: Genji Shield
    Stamina 40...........Helmet: Oath Veil
    Magic Pwr 110......Armor: Minerva
    Bat Pwr 255
    Defense 216.........Relic: Ribbon
    Evade 75
    Magic D 184.........Relic: Economizer
    Magic B 87

  3. #33
    That's me! blackmage_nuke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno View Post
    I am going to break this up into sections to make this easier on... well everybody.

    Characters

    CelesAnother intriguing choice would be for her weapon to be endowed with the properties of the spell she absorbs kind of like the Mystic Knight class in FFV.
    Your other suggestions were great but I love this one in particular.

    Also have allow us to decide how much gil we want to put into Gil Toss or Slots (more money in slots yeilds better icons/slower slots or something)
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboko View Post
    Make the enemies harder. SEND ME A CHALLENGER WORTHY OF MY DEATH SQUAD
    This.

    Magic should not be nerfed. The world of FFVI is one where magic is extremely powerful and supreme. Bosses and enemies should become more lethal instead. However, I think this should be an optional difficulty because not everyone is going to figure out how to take advantage of the broken battle system. My bf for instance had much more trouble in FFVI than in FFVII. He found many parts of the game to be pretty challenging (especially in World of Ruin before you get all badass)... There are a lot of options when it comes to magic, espers, and relics and the badassery wil vary while making it possible to put together a completely broken party.
    Lamia's Tiara- Headgear in FFIX
    Lamia's Flute- Weapon for Eiko in FFIX
    Lamia in FFV- a enemy
    appearance: a lady with long brown hair, wearing a tiara...half woman and half snake.
    Lamia in FF3j- A Harp
    Lamia in FFL2- An enemy
    FF2j Queen Lamia, at one point she even gets Frionel in a bedroom with her and jumps on the bed and says "take me!".. before she turns into her snakey self. She serves as a mini boss in this game (as Queen Lamia).. and after you fight her as a mini boss, regular lamia's become random foes and later on in the game, Queen Lamia's become random foes as well.
    LamiaScl. an item that paralyzes foes.
    According to legend, she was once a Libyan queen (or princess) who fell in love with Zeus. Zeus' jealous wife Hera deformed her into a monster and murdered their offspring. She also made Lamia unable to close her eyes, so that she couldn't find any rest from the obsessing image of her dead children. When Zeus saw what had be done to Lamia, he felt pity for her and gave his former lover a gift: she could remove her eyes, and then put them on again. This way, though sleepless, she could rest from her misfortune. Lamia envied other the other mothers and took her vengeance by stealing their children and devouring them.

  5. #35
    Fortune Teller Recognized Member Roogle's Avatar
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    Magic should be able to hit multiple times. That would make spells like Meteor and Ultima much more powerful than someone using Genji Glove or Offering.

    Espers should be a lot more powerful than they currently are, too. It seems like after a certain point, the spells do more damage than the Espers themselves.
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  6. #36
    Recognized Member VeloZer0's Avatar
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    Multiple hits only become so relevant when you have a damage cap. If you remove the damage cap it would work towards fixing that problem.
    >>Am willing to change opinions based on data<<

  7. #37

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    In Final Fantasy Tactics the enemies level up with you. I'd do that with almost every game that allows you to return to a previous area.

    Actually, we could make the entire game level with the adventurer's. We can give them the option to turn that feature on/off but it's the most reasonable way to make it a challenge imo.

    If you want a challenging opponent play Chess and/or Call of duty against a strong player. Or some other game.

    Against a cold calculating computer the human does better in the abstract in general. All games are numbers crunching. The FFVI system isn't difficult when you can easily level up.
    http://www.youtube.com/Greatermaxim

    Terra..................Fight
    LV99...................Morph
    HP9999................All Magic
    MP999.................Item

    Vigor 45................R-Hand: Illumina
    Speed 90..............L-Hand: Genji Shield
    Stamina 40...........Helmet: Oath Veil
    Magic Pwr 110......Armor: Minerva
    Bat Pwr 255
    Defense 216.........Relic: Ribbon
    Evade 75
    Magic D 184.........Relic: Economizer
    Magic B 87

  8. #38
    Newbie Administrator Loony BoB's Avatar
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    XIII got it right. The most effective way to make a game like Final Fantasy challenging while at the same time not requiring you to grind to insane lengths is to implement an appropriate level cap and force people into using their brain rather than their character's overpowered statistics.
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  9. #39
    Recognized Member VeloZer0's Avatar
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    Your idea involves placing a known limit on the players power and tuning the enemies in order to create a challenge for the player. FF13 did one of those two things.
    >>Am willing to change opinions based on data<<

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    Memento Mori Site Contributor Wolf Kanno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loony BoB View Post
    XIII got it right. The most effective way to make a game like Final Fantasy challenging while at the same time not requiring you to grind to insane lengths is to implement an appropriate level cap and force people into using their brain rather than their character's overpowered statistics.
    I would argue Suikoden does this better by simply lowering XP gains depending on your party level so that if you power too high (like literally two levels more than you need) then all enemies give you 1 XP until you reach a new area which I feel is abit less intrusive than just telling the player they can't level up their characters until a later chapter.

    I really wouldn't have used XIII as an example as there are too many holes in the argument that it's "challenging".

  11. #41
    Recognized Member ShinGundam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loony BoB View Post
    XIII got it right. The most effective way to make a game like Final Fantasy challenging while at the same time not requiring you to grind to insane lengths is to implement an appropriate level cap and force people into using their brain rather than their character's overpowered statistics.
    I would argue Suikoden does this better by simply lowering XP gains depending on your party level so that if you power too high (like literally two levels more than you need) then all enemies give you 1 XP until you reach a new area which I feel is abit less intrusive than just telling the player they can't level up their characters until a later chapter.
    I hate that system especially with many characters to level them like Suikoden.

  12. #42
    Recognized Member VeloZer0's Avatar
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    Actually the Suikoden system makes it a breeze to level unused characters. Because experience is on an exponential curve if you put an under-leveled character into the party they catch up extremely rapidly, often to the tune of several levels per battle.
    >>Am willing to change opinions based on data<<

  13. #43
    Memento Mori Site Contributor Wolf Kanno's Avatar
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    ^ Or if you learn how to abuse the system, you can get a character to level 99 in a single battle. Though honestly, I like the Suikoden leveling system cause it's a good way to deter players from leveling without actually saying "no" to them. It also helps that the game sticks to the logical level as well since most RPGs don't actually give you much in the way of stat upgrades after Lv. 65 on average. So getting to Lv. 99 is often for the sake of itself rather than having a real tangible advantage.

  14. #44
    Newbie Administrator Loony BoB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Loony BoB View Post
    XIII got it right. The most effective way to make a game like Final Fantasy challenging while at the same time not requiring you to grind to insane lengths is to implement an appropriate level cap and force people into using their brain rather than their character's overpowered statistics.
    I would argue Suikoden does this better by simply lowering XP gains depending on your party level so that if you power too high (like literally two levels more than you need) then all enemies give you 1 XP until you reach a new area which I feel is abit less intrusive than just telling the player they can't level up their characters until a later chapter.

    I really wouldn't have used XIII as an example as there are too many holes in the argument that it's "challenging".
    This requires restricting which areas you have access to, something I feel VI would not be incredibly effective with. Now, I know XIII also had this restriction to obvoius lengths, but the system can be used without such area restrictions. Also, I can use XIII as an example because it's the only system in the entire FF series which is in any way remotely challenging. Every other system just has a "level a few more times and you'll be fine" system.
    Bow before the mighty Javoo!

  15. #45
    Memento Mori Site Contributor Wolf Kanno's Avatar
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    Except you can level your gear and that will fix the level cap issue, since your gear directly affects your three stats and only affect the battle score system, it's easy to grind a few levels for weapons and accessories and just plow through the games enemies if you are having issues.

    Seriously BoB, you don't think I know how to see an exploitation in an RPG battle system? There are very very few systems that can't be made broken or not have ways to get past restrictions. There are always ways to get around things and FF is usually one of the easiest to bypass. If you want a difficult FF, play the NES version of FFI or FFIII, or do a challenge.

    The leveling system from Suikoden is not one I would suggest for VI because manipulating stats by leveling is a core customization system and considering a characters level is actually the most important element of the battle system (most of the damage algorithm, including just the basic Fight command, use your level as part of the damage formula) so such a system would bork the game. I also feel the level cap from XIII would not work in the Ruined World segment since all the areas have enemies of similar difficulty to offset the players freedom of choosing where to go. I only mentioned I felt it was a better system than XIII's level caps as it's more user friendly.

    Honestly, VIII's leveling system is probably the best idea, it just needs to be bigger and greatly retooled cause the issue with VIII's system is that the only thing that changed as enemies leveled were their stats and their magic. Since borking your own stats is pretty easy, the only stat that would bother a player is their Hp as it suddenly took forever to kill one of the dragon enemies cause they almost had a million Hp. Instead, the levels should also affect their attack scripts. Another idea to make enemies meaner is from FFIV, where enemies had counters for specifics commands. VI has these to a degree but it's pretty much de-fanged since IV's version of it. A combo of these two would make you think twice about leveling to succeed and it would change the enemies so strategy would become more important as the enemy would change as you got further into the game. Such a system would make the Ruined World very interesting as you try to revisit areas only to find the enemies have become stronger since you first wandered through.

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