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Thread: IGN's Top 100 RPG's of All Time

  1. #91
    Bolivar's Avatar
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    Damn, maybe I should change my position, it sounds like Wolf actually did subconsciously like FFXIII...

  2. #92
    Nerf This~ Laddy's Avatar
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    It's like a Sitcom would with you guys.

  3. #93
    Memento Mori Site Contributor Wolf Kanno's Avatar
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    Next season we'll start dating and then the series will be canceled cause all the sexual tension is gone.

    Also, "like" is a strong term, I would prefer to say I didn't hate it as much until it proved me wrong.

  4. #94
    Slothstronaut Recognized Member Slothy's Avatar
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    • Former Cid's Knight

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolivar View Post
    but if you can't understand how expectations can affect a playing experience, then I don't think we'd have a fruitful discussion anyhow.
    Obviously they can, but that's not really what you argued even if that was what you meant to argue. Going into a game with certain expectations, and approaching a game from the viewpoint of a game designer, a reviewer, a journalist, etc. are not necessarily the same thing. And while I would agree that expectations can colour a game experience, I do not agree that they always do, or that their effect overrides how innately fun or well made a game is most of the time. It all depends on just what sort of expectations are built up and how far it strays from them, and how open the individual is to that. Expectations alone didn't make a lot of fans criticize FFXIII for being a bad game even if the only way they can articulate those feelings is to compare it to older titles most of the time.

    And for the record, I was actually kind of looking forward to FFXIII before it was released. I didn't play it until a few months after it came out, largely ignored the fan reaction until I was in the middle of it, and had had my interest piqued by many of the developer interviews right before release which made it sound interesting, and reviews which said it was pretty good. Up until the point I played it my interest went from next to nothing to me looking forward to it. Then I played it, looked at it objectively, and simply determined that it is a poorly made game on just about every level. It may have been a highly polished turd, but it still stank.

  5. #95
    Bolivar's Avatar
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    That's real interesting. For me it was kinda the opposite, I felt like the news kept getting worse and worse about what the game was going to be like. From hearing that there were no towns because apparently "you can't do that in HD" to the world not opening up until towards the end, it was a huge nightmare for me. My ex at the time was playing it while I was busy with my first year of law school and all the dialogue I heard coming out of the TV screen sounded abysmal. And then I was hearing the reaction, not from this site because I avoided the section until I beat the game, but the review scores and user comments.

    Anyway, when I was talking about viewing the game as a designer or journalist I was being facetious. It was a general commentary on how the average gamer will get really technical about why a game system fails when in reality they're not a game designer.

    An example is my own reaction to FFXIII's battle system. I personally think it's a failure. I thought it poorly emulated the systems in FFX and FFXII without having any of the factors that made them good, but still suffering all the trappings. The active battle combat just wasn't as good as FFXII; you couldn't program your characters at anywhere near a similar level and it led to your AI allies making mistakes in combat. It was enormously frustrating at times. Accordingly, the Crystarium seemed like a poor man's node sphere. The Node sphere was awesome because keys were limited. If you wanted to go off the beaten path, you had to give up one of your few keys. The way you can mix and match character classes depending on where you were was really awesome. The Crystarium falls flat because it's completely linear - you can get to the end of a character's primary vocations just by playing through the main game. And customization is meaningless since you can only really be one thing at a time.

    But that's in an in-depth analysis. That it doesn't reach the strategic heights of FFXII or the deep customization of FFX doesn't change a simple fact: it's actually still a decent system. It's fun and large serves its purpose enough to take you through an RPG. Granted, I like critiquing it on forums. But it was fun for the game.

    That's just my own personal experience with how we as RPG forum posters get too critical at times.

  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolivar View Post
    An example is my own reaction to FFXIII's battle system. I personally think it's a failure. I thought it poorly emulated the systems in FFX and FFXII without having any of the factors that made them good, but still suffering all the trappings. The active battle combat just wasn't as good as FFXII; you couldn't program your characters at anywhere near a similar level and it led to your AI allies making mistakes in combat. It was enormously frustrating at times. Accordingly, the Crystarium seemed like a poor man's node sphere. The Node sphere was awesome because keys were limited. If you wanted to go off the beaten path, you had to give up one of your few keys. The way you can mix and match character classes depending on where you were was really awesome. The Crystarium falls flat because it's completely linear - you can get to the end of a character's primary vocations just by playing through the main game. And customization is meaningless since you can only really be one thing at a time.

    What made it even worse was that you didn't really get money after battle...you have to grind specific enemies just to tally up the gil, then they make everything you can buy really expensive.

    Weapon customization was awful too since it took so long to raise the weapons up levels and you knew you'd get something that's most likely better in the future.

    Then, of course, rpgs add in the most annoying achievements (which aren't as important but do add a little more to the game).

  7. #97
    Bolivar's Avatar
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    ^ that's another example, the weapon levelling system. I thought it was pretty arbitrary. But going with my post, it serves adequately enough and it's kinda cool that you need to manage a balance between natural and man-made items to get big level boosts.

    It's another example on how game design offending my sensibilities shouldn't affect my ability to just enjoy a title.

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolivar View Post
    ^ that's another example, the weapon levelling system. I thought it was pretty arbitrary. But going with my post, it serves adequately enough and it's kinda cool that you need to manage a balance between natural and man-made items to get big level boosts.

    It's another example on how game design offending my sensibilities shouldn't affect my ability to just enjoy a title.
    I thought it was completely arbitrary, as well as totally unnecessary. I beat the game, five starred every encounter, including Vicengetorix, excluding the Long GUI (ha, autocorrect), without upgrading a single weapon once. It was stupid, pointless busywork, and it felt like it.

    Nevertheless, I did finish the game, and as such, I find myself viewing this thread with a question in my head: what is with all the FFXII love? That was a game so boring I didn't beat it (got up to about the Suncryst), yet you all seem to hold it in such high regard. What gives?
    My friend Delzethin is currently running a GoFundMe account to pay for some extended medical troubles he's had. He's had chronic issues and lifetime troubles that have really crippled his career opportunities, and he's trying to get enough funding to get back to a stable medical situation. If you like his content, please support his GoFundMe, or even just contribute to his Patreon.

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  9. #99
    Memento Mori Site Contributor Wolf Kanno's Avatar
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    • Former Cid's Knight

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    I feel Bolivar said it best.

    That reminds me, I should finally post my top ten RPGs...

  10. #100
    Bolivar's Avatar
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    Sky, how many times have you played it? I would hate to tell an EoFFer "you need to replay it to get it," but that was the case for me. The story suffers from poor pacing, but if you play a straight playthrough to watch the story unfold, I'd say it's one of the best told and best performed stories in RPGs. Also I enjoyed the feeling of exploration the game allowed, where you can just head out into an area and map it out, going along the sides then plungin in to the middle. The wonderful soundtrack, gorgeous locations, and fun combat system made it all worth it for me. No other FF really has that. And yeah, I think the combat is that good. I didn't truly realize its genius until I realized that a war of attrition optional boss that once took me 45 minutes to complete went down in about 11 minutes, just from the smarter way I set up my gambits on my second playthrough after having a better mastery of the system. That's a horribly written sentence, but I hope it might convey that this was a killer game on all fronts and I think it's a nice twin to Dragon Quest VIII as two games that came late in the PS2's life cycle, late in the glory days of RPGs, before the onset of The Dark Ages.

    Give it another try. It's been so many years with so many mediocre games you might think it's the best you ever played

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno View Post
    I feel Bolivar said it best.

    That reminds me, I should finally post my top ten RPGs...
    Ass

  11. #101

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    In an article someone said Pokemon is an "expertly crafted rpg"........okay.

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