Pokemon Gen 6, X & Y announced; worldwide release in October

[Tigmafuzz]

Mega Alakazam looks hilarious, oh god the beard.

Mega Houndoom is pretty awesome-looking, though.

houndoomed.png

houndoom back.png

EDIT: Mega Manectric looks terrible. It's basically just a bigger version of Manectric with longer spikes. It physically hurts to look at it.

[Madame Adequate]

So you don't get to name your Rivals in this

I approve of Shauna and don't wish to imply this is aimed at her, but all I can say about that is bulltrout. Preorder canceled Gamestop firebombed FBI called computer thrown out window nuclear bunker sealed.

[WildRaubtier]

*snicker*

[Jinx]

So mature.

[Ultima Shadow]

Apparently, Thunderbolt also got nerfed from 95 to 90. I will assume the same goes for all the other 100-95 moves like Ice Beam and Flamethrower.

While it's not a lot, it's still enough to make difference and I actually kinda like this change. The slight nerf of the 95 and 120 moves make them a bit more balanced compared to the other alternatives, meaning a possibility to see more varied fire/ice/thunder moves in competitive pokemon matches.



Also, regarding the smogon tiers: even outside of pokemon showdown, they are good to use as a base when building a team. Even if you can't get the stats as high, the smogon tiers help you figure out what stats to aim for to accomplish certain things. I've actually always prefered to come up with my own builds rather than trying to make smogon copies, but knowing how much HP/Sp Def to give *insert pokemon* in order for it to survive a Draco Meteor from a max Sp Attack *insert pokemon* and stuff like that is always helpful.

And the tier system itself will probably not get screwed over completely either, since even if perfect IV's can't be achieved, the base stats and the most effective roles of pokemons won't actually change. Even if your Gengar has an average IV of 17, it will still be better as a special sweeper than 28 IV Mismagius.



Edit: you can apparently only mega evolve once in a battle. So no mega-only teams. That's good. It does, however, appear like they can transform immediately on the first turn. So Mega Gengar will still be crazy OP. Unless he gets some really solid counters.

Edit 2: Actually... Aegislash with Shadow Sneak might fit that role now that I think about it. It's neutral to Thunderbolt and Shadowball and immune to Focus Blast, could probably survive a hit with its 150 Sp Def AND can probably OHKO with Shadow Sneak.

[Skyblade]

Apparently, Thunderbolt also got nerfed from 95 to 90. I will assume the same goes for all the other 100-95 moves like Ice Beam and Flamethrower.

While it's not a lot, it's still enough to make difference and I actually kinda like this change. The slight nerf of the 95 and 120 moves make them a bit more balanced compared to the other alternatives, meaning a possibility to see more varied fire/ice/thunder moves in competitive pokemon matches.

I don't think it's enough of a nerf to make most of the other alternatives viable, but we'll see.

I'm also worried about how it will change growth and progression in the single player game. Pokémon generally start with weaker moves and learn stronger ones as they level (and Pokémon and TMs acquired later are similarly more powerful). If things get balanced to make everything competitively viable, that entire growth curve, which has served the series very well, goes out the window.

Also, regarding the smogon tiers: even outside of pokemon showdown, they are good to use as a base when building a team. Even if you can't get the stats as high, the smogon tiers help you figure out what stats to aim for to accomplish certain things. I've actually always prefered to come up with my own builds rather than trying to make smogon copies, but knowing how much HP/Sp Def to give *insert pokemon* in order for it to survive a Draco Meteor from a max Sp Attack *insert pokemon* and stuff like that is always helpful.

But I am wondering just how useful that information will be when you're not facing a "max Sp Attack *insert pokemon*". I mean, who is going to get even close to that on the legendaries or event Pokémon? And how many people are going to have the patience to get those on the Pokémon that can be bred, knowing how long it can take?

I think some of the most popular Pokémon transferred are going to be max IV Dittos, just for breeding. Along with possible Synchronize Pokémon for Nature farming.

And the tier system itself will probably not get screwed over completely either, since even if perfect IV's can't be achieved, the base stats and the most effective roles of pokemons won't actually change. Even if your Gengar has an average IV of 17, it will still be better as a special sweeper than 28 IV Mismagius.

IVs are only a portion of it. How many different Pokémon breakdowns suggest "Hidden Power Grass" or something similar, dependent on having a HP70 IV spread? How many require egg moves (or worse, chain breeding) to learn the moves? How many Pokémon setups do they have that you can't even get (like, for example, Blaziken, who was only ever available with Speed Boost in Japan until the XY starter event, yet has that ability in every Smogon breakdown).

And, sure, maybe Smogon does base their systems on an online simulator. But I think a lot of their followers and fans look forward to be able to use the systems and setups in their actual games. And I think losing that ability is going to hurt them somewhat.

Edit: you can apparently only mega evolve once in a battle. So no mega-only teams. Good.

In that case, I think I'm going to have to say I was wrong about losing the Mega Evolution when you switch out. The right counter can pretty much force a switch, and if you lost the Mega form and couldn't get it back in that battle, it would make certain Pokémon worthless. I mean, imagine you setup a Physical, Psychic/Fighting moveset, with proper EVs, for your Mewtwo, anticipating the Mega-Evolution, and then lost it. Mewtwo is then worthless to you, as without the Physical boost (and STAB), those moves are junk with normal Mewtwo's stats.

They might still restrict that, but it would make Mega-Evolution very risky.


EDIT: In other news, I am mildly curious to see how the anime handles Mega-Evolution. How overpowered/overused will it be? Ash probably won't use it much, since there isn't going to be one for Pikachu (and his Pikachu is apparently the strongest Pokémon in the world), but the other trainers probably will, right?

Also, if you think Mega-Alakazam is bad, wait until you see Mega-Heracross. Assuming those pics are accurate. Those are a lot of leaked screenshots of a lot of Mega-Pokémon.

[Ultima Shadow]

I don't think it's enough of a nerf to make most of the other alternatives viable, but we'll see.

I'm also worried about how it will change growth and progression in the single player game. Pokémon generally start with weaker moves and learn stronger ones as they level (and Pokémon and TMs acquired later are similarly more powerful). If things get balanced to make everything competitively viable, that entire growth curve, which has served the series very well, goes out the window.

Yeah, it probably won't. But it's a possibility at least.

And I wouldn't worry about that. It's not like Mud Slap is going to suddenly become as good as Earthquake. I'm thinking more like Heatwave and such moves that you would learn pretty late anyway will be more viable as an alternative to Fire Blast etc.

But I am wondering just how useful that information will be when you're not facing a "max Sp Attack *insert pokemon*". I mean, who is going to get even close to that on the legendaries or event Pokémon? And how many people are going to have the patience to get those on the Pokémon that can be bred, knowing how long it can take?

I think some of the most popular Pokémon transferred are going to be max IV Dittos, just for breeding. Along with possible Synchronize Pokémon for Nature farming.

It's actually not THAT hard to reach 30-31 in just one or even two stats. At least not if you already have some solid breeding pokemon. You're right about the legendaries though. They will have a hard time. But all breedable pokemon can still get there.

And yes, if people can transfer over full 31 dittos, then getting pokemon with at least tripple 31's won't be hard at all. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think either the mom or dad has something like a 50% chance to give its own value in a stat to the child. And this "check" goes through all of the stats. So yeah. "Maxed" pokemon will be less common, but they will probably not be entierly gone either.

IVs are only a portion of it. How many different Pokémon breakdowns suggest "Hidden Power Grass" or something similar, dependent on having a HP70 IV spread? How many require egg moves (or worse, chain breeding) to learn the moves? How many Pokémon setups do they have that you can't even get (like, for example, Blaziken, who was only ever available with Speed Boost in Japan until the XY starter event, yet has that ability in every Smogon breakdown).

And, sure, maybe Smogon does base their systems on an online simulator. But I think a lot of their followers and fans look forward to be able to use the systems and setups in their actual games. And I think losing that ability is going to hurt them somewhat.

Yeah, though since HP gets nerfed quite a bit, it will be a less common move even on Pokemon Showdown anyway. Chain breeding takes time and effort, but is doable and I rememeber doing it back in Emerald. And while it makes it harder to abuse a super-ditto, you can still do it to a degree by first breeding a good pokemon of the kind that you then want to move-breed with etc.

I actually hope that you are right, since that would make people use more creative setups of their own instead of "copy-pasted from smogon". But I'm pretty certain that people will find ways to breed pokemon with super high IV stats and smogon recommended movepools with relative ease (at least if maxed dittos are transferable). But once again, we'll just have to see. Perhaps they have adjusted breeding somehow too to prevent that?

In that case, I think I'm going to have to say I was wrong about losing the Mega Evolution when you switch out. The right counter can pretty much force a switch, and if you lost the Mega form and couldn't get it back in that battle, it would make certain Pokémon worthless. I mean, imagine you setup a Physical, Psychic/Fighting moveset, with proper EVs, for your Mewtwo, anticipating the Mega-Evolution, and then lost it. Mewtwo is then worthless to you, as without the Physical boost (and STAB), those moves are junk with normal Mewtwo's stats.

They might still restrict that, but it would make Mega-Evolution very risky.

Yeah, pretty much. On the other hand, sice the mega evolution doesn't even seem to cost a turn, I think I still wouldn't mind if you'd lose it when switching out. It's better to make something very situational than game-breaking after all. And if you lose it when switching, you'd really have to save it for the right moment and use it very wisely instead of just going for it right away.

Edit: mega evolutions do stay after switching out.

[Skyblade]

I don't think it's enough of a nerf to make most of the other alternatives viable, but we'll see.

I'm also worried about how it will change growth and progression in the single player game. Pokémon generally start with weaker moves and learn stronger ones as they level (and Pokémon and TMs acquired later are similarly more powerful). If things get balanced to make everything competitively viable, that entire growth curve, which has served the series very well, goes out the window.

Yeah, it probably won't. But it's a possibility at least.

And I wouldn't worry about that. It's not like Mud Slap is going to suddenly become as good as Earthquake. I'm thinking more like Heatwave and such moves that you would learn pretty late anyway will be more viable as an alternative to Fire Blast etc.

I suppose that's true. And I would like to see more viable options instead of OMG, everyone take Fire Blast. Only take Flamethrower if you want perfect accuracy, and never seeing other moves etcetera.

But honestly, this is one of the portions of the game I think least needs revision. There are tons of Pokémon who need more varied movepools, tons who have fallen by the wayside stat-wise that need revision, and other issues that need rebalancing before the move powers do.

But I am wondering just how useful that information will be when you're not facing a "max Sp Attack *insert pokemon*". I mean, who is going to get even close to that on the legendaries or event Pokémon? And how many people are going to have the patience to get those on the Pokémon that can be bred, knowing how long it can take?

I think some of the most popular Pokémon transferred are going to be max IV Dittos, just for breeding. Along with possible Synchronize Pokémon for Nature farming.

It's actually not THAT hard to reach 30-31 in just one or even two stats. At least not if you already have some solid breeding pokemon. You're right about the legendaries though. They will have a hard time. But all breedable pokemon can still get there.

And yes, if people can transfer over full 31 dittos, then getting pokemon with at least tripple 31's won't be hard at all. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think either the mom or dad has something like a 50% chance to give its own value in a stat to the child. And this "check" goes through all of the stats. So yeah. "Maxed" pokemon will be less common, but they will probably not be entierly gone either.

Last time I looked at breeding, the rules were: The child will inherit three stats from their parents. They can take any three stats, from any parent. Granted, this was back a generation or two (I think the Sinnoh games, because I didn't play Hoenn, but I'm not sure), but I'm guessing it still goes that way. Which does give pretty good odds that you'll get some max stats from such a breeding.

IVs are only a portion of it. How many different Pokémon breakdowns suggest "Hidden Power Grass" or something similar, dependent on having a HP70 IV spread? How many require egg moves (or worse, chain breeding) to learn the moves? How many Pokémon setups do they have that you can't even get (like, for example, Blaziken, who was only ever available with Speed Boost in Japan until the XY starter event, yet has that ability in every Smogon breakdown).

And, sure, maybe Smogon does base their systems on an online simulator. But I think a lot of their followers and fans look forward to be able to use the systems and setups in their actual games. And I think losing that ability is going to hurt them somewhat.

Yeah, though since HP gets nerfed quite a bit, it will be a less common move even on Pokemon Showdown anyway. Chain breeding takes time and effort, but is doable and I rememeber doing it back in Emerald. And while it makes it harder to abuse a super-ditto, you can still do it to a degree by first breeding a good pokemon of the kind that you then want to move-breed with etc.

I actually hope that you are right, since that would make people use more creative setups of their own instead of "copy-pasted from smogon". But I'm pretty certain that people will find ways to breed pokemon with super high IV stats and smogon recommended movepools with relative ease (at least if maxed dittos are transferable). But once again, we'll just have to see. Perhaps they have adjusted breeding somehow too to prevent that?

Honestly, I browsed Smogon (though I preferred Selebii's Pokémon of the Week), but I almost never implemented them. For one thing, it's hard to get a good feel for an entire battle layout/strategy from the breakdowns. But, for another, it's of extremely limited use in standard gameplay. I'd take Flamethrower over Fire Blast any day, not only for the accuracy, but for the PP. So many of those setups wouldn't last you through any of the caves, or are so min/maxed focused that I think they cease to be fun.

I use their advice for overall utility, which Pokémon are good at walling and support, or what the best cross coverage moves are. But otherwise, I tend to focus on creating the best anti-AI team I can. Which, admittedly, isn't that hard, but it's the way I like to play, and it's a lot more fun, especially when you can start free-forming things and creating unique setups.

I love creating my own Pokémon. I was one of the few people to run a full Special Lucario, or use an all-crit Absol. Everyone recommends Sucker Punch, but Night Slash is so much more fun, and Absol gets Psycho Cut and Slash too (sometimes Stone Edge, but I don't like the 80% accuracy), and with a crit-booster held item and either Baton Passing it Focus Energy or using a Dire Hit, that little guy got crits like crazy. I love analyzing all the moves possible for a Pokémon to learn, figuring out which ones I'd use and how to team them up to have a one-Pokémon team wrecker (against the AI, because I only play single player). And the tournament suggestions are rarely usable for that.

In that case, I think I'm going to have to say I was wrong about losing the Mega Evolution when you switch out. The right counter can pretty much force a switch, and if you lost the Mega form and couldn't get it back in that battle, it would make certain Pokémon worthless. I mean, imagine you setup a Physical, Psychic/Fighting moveset, with proper EVs, for your Mewtwo, anticipating the Mega-Evolution, and then lost it. Mewtwo is then worthless to you, as without the Physical boost (and STAB), those moves are junk with normal Mewtwo's stats.

They might still restrict that, but it would make Mega-Evolution very risky.

Yeah, pretty much. On the other hand, sice the mega evolution doesn't even seem to cost a turn, I think I still wouldn't mind if you'd lose it when switching out. It's better to make something very situational than game-breaking after all. And if you lose it when switching, you'd really have to save it for the right moment and use it very wisely instead of just going for it right away.

Yeah, it would make the Mega-Evolution a much more tactical and important decision (which I like).

What I don't like is how the Mega-form seems to keep the movepool and EVs of the base form. And since many of the Mega-forms have different STABs and different stat focuses than the standard forms, a Pokémon customized as a Mega-evolved beast might be nigh-useless without the boost.




As for transferability: Official systems have been trying to ban faked Pokémon since Gen I (when non-event Mews were restricted out of some tournaments). But the systems have been broken every time. There's only so much data in place to track viability. The current GTN can't differentiate hacked Pokémon from standard caught Pokémon as long as they're made right, and I've even seen an all 31-IV Genesect, complete with the event OT and Trainer ID, trade fine that way. Even if they add new restrictions to the new Pokémon games, they don't have a way to retroactively add it to the DS games, and, thus, no way to restrict trade-overs. As long as you don't break the viability rules, like sending over a shiny Reshiram, or a Snivy with Contrary, or a Mewtwo with Quiver Dance, things like that, I don't think there will be any problem sending over hacked Pokémon. I think we'll get them by the truckload.

[Tigmafuzz]

one of my Australian friends who just got the game is streaming it until he passes out. I'm not watching because I want to experience everything myself first, but if anyone's interested: Werster - Twitch

I can barely believe I've been following this off and on along with over 6,000 other people for almost 6 hours.

I really need to get out of the house.

[Ultima Shadow]

But honestly, this is one of the portions of the game I think least needs revision. There are tons of Pokémon who need more varied movepools, tons who have fallen by the wayside stat-wise that need revision, and other issues that need rebalancing before the move powers do.

True. And they seem to be doing a good job at that for Mawile, which is something I really appreciate. In Mega form, Huge Power makes up for any lack of attack it had before, and it has been said that its defenses will get a dramatic increase too. Plus, the addition of Fairy type helps it a lot too.


[quote]But I am wondering just how useful that information will be when you're not facing a "max Sp Attack *insert pokemon*". I mean, who is going to get even close to that on the legendaries or event Pokémon? And how many people are going to have the patience to get those on the Pokémon that can be bred, knowing how long it can take?

Last time I looked at breeding, the rules were: The child will inherit three stats from their parents. They can take any three stats, from any parent. Granted, this was back a generation or two (I think the Sinnoh games, because I didn't play Hoenn, but I'm not sure), but I'm guessing it still goes that way. Which does give pretty good odds that you'll get some max stats from such a breeding.

Ah, yes! That's how it worked, yeah. I think there was some 50% chance involved in some even older generation, but I might just be mixing things up. But yeah, in any case getting 31's won't be too hard with super-dittos.

Honestly, I browsed Smogon (though I preferred Selebii's Pokémon of the Week), but I almost never implemented them. For one thing, it's hard to get a good feel for an entire battle layout/strategy from the breakdowns. But, for another, it's of extremely limited use in standard gameplay. I'd take Flamethrower over Fire Blast any day, not only for the accuracy, but for the PP. So many of those setups wouldn't last you through any of the caves, or are so min/maxed focused that I think they cease to be fun.

I use their advice for overall utility, which Pokémon are good at walling and support, or what the best cross coverage moves are. But otherwise, I tend to focus on creating the best anti-AI team I can. Which, admittedly, isn't that hard, but it's the way I like to play, and it's a lot more fun, especially when you can start free-forming things and creating unique setups.

I love creating my own Pokémon. I was one of the few people to run a full Special Lucario, or use an all-crit Absol. Everyone recommends Sucker Punch, but Night Slash is so much more fun, and Absol gets Psycho Cut and Slash too (sometimes Stone Edge, but I don't like the 80% accuracy), and with a crit-booster held item and either Baton Passing it Focus Energy or using a Dire Hit, that little guy got crits like crazy. I love analyzing all the moves possible for a Pokémon to learn, figuring out which ones I'd use and how to team them up to have a one-Pokémon team wrecker (against the AI, because I only play single player). And the tournament suggestions are rarely usable for that.

Selebii's Pokémon of the Week is much more fun to read.

And yes, it's more fun to develop your own setups. Though I usually swap to competitive team building after I finish the game and beat all the in-game AIs for the first time. Especially since the random online match thing was introduced. And when playing those, knowing the smogon setups often became pretty relevant. But yeah, against the AI and online play/competitive play is completely different.

Yeah, it would make the Mega-Evolution a much more tactical and important decision (which I like).

What I don't like is how the Mega-form seems to keep the movepool and EVs of the base form. And since many of the Mega-forms have different STABs and different stat focuses than the standard forms, a Pokémon customized as a Mega-evolved beast might be nigh-useless without the boost.

Well, I did find out that megas keep their mega forms after switching. So you can build a pokemon around the mega form only and not have to worry about it losing it and becoming useless.

Speaking of mega, you can find a lot of megas at Serebii now. And mega scizor look awesome and keeps Technican! Oh gawd! <3

I also have to admit that, while I still think that Gardevoir's mega form could have looked a lot better, it's not quite as bad as I had first thought after seeing it in animation. Same actually goes for Mega Gyara, to a certain degree. I still prefer their normal looks, but their megas don't look quite as terrible as I thought from the first screenshots.

Also: Mega Banette! Yes!

one of my Australian friends who just got the game is streaming it until he passes out. I'm not watching because I want to experience everything myself first, but if anyone's interested: Werster - Twitch

I can barely believe I've been following this off and on along with over 6,000 other people for almost 6 hours.

Same.

And I saw an AI Gyara with pretty much one of the most effective offensive movesets! I find that kinda awesome.

[Khaotic]

Just got the new 3DS XL Limited blue pokemon X/y - I'm ready for tomorrow!