View Poll Results: There can be only one!

Voters
19. You may not vote on this poll
  • Terra

    6 31.58%
  • Sabin

    7 36.84%
  • Shadow

    4 21.05%
  • Umaro

    1 5.26%
  • Cyan

    1 5.26%
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Thread: Round 2 - There can be only one

  1. #61
    Gamblet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chionos View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamblet View Post
    This thread stopped making sense on 5-08-2013 at 10:50 am.
    Fixed that for ya.
    Thanks!


  2. #62
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    Glad to see the best candidate won.
    You think a minor thing like the end of the world was gonna do me in?

  3. #63
    That's me! blackmage_nuke's Avatar
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    Since wrestling and cage matches in the real world are staged theoretically they crowd favourite is rigged to win. And therefore by voting Sabin into first place Sabin becomes the one most likely to win the cage match, not vice versa.
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  4. #64
    Newbie Administrator Loony BoB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    A lot of Sabin's Blitz moves aren't based on physical contact either.
    You're really going to try to convince me that Terra is somehow going to be more physically adept than Sabin? xD
    Furthermore, if you're going to throw out magic because "it's too much like guns", then you also need to throw out weapons because those wouldn't be allowed in real-world wrestling matches either
    I don't think you even watch wrestling.
    and Gau and Umaro are arguably stronger with bare hands than Sabin (especially Gau, who could just use Catscratch to eliminate the competition).
    Gau's not there and wrestling skill wins over raw strength (that's why Mark Henry sucked as a wrestler, the big baby).

    Man, I should really get Del Murder into this thread.
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  5. #65
    Feel the Bern Administrator Del Murder's Avatar
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    Typically a cage match is no disqualification, therefore Terra would win by getting into Esper form and tossing a few fireballs around. She could also fly out of the cage for the easy win.

    In a straight wrestling match, Sabin is the clear winner. Umaro may be stronger but he's also slower. Cage matches are all about speed. Plus Sabin suplexed a train. I think he can handle a yeti.

    Shadow has the wild card since he would be accompanied to the ring by Interceptor, but valets can hardly help you in the cage.

    I don't even know why Cyan is on the list.

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  6. #66
    Newbie Administrator Loony BoB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Del Murder View Post
    She could also fly out of the cage for the easy win.
    Oh man, I didn't even consider the idea of a cage match where you win by getting through the roof. Yeah, she'd easily win that with barely any effort.

    I still don't think she has it in her to attack her comrades, magic or not.
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  7. #67
    pirate heartbreaker The Man's Avatar
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    :monster:

    If we're including weapons, then yes, Terra is more physically adept than Sabin. All she has to do is slash with the Ultima Weapon. The others are dead.

    In fact a strong case could be made that the attacks with Offering (or Master's Scroll if that's the translation you're used to), though they're animated as separate slashes for the convenience of the player, occur at the same time. Enemies never counterattack Offering attacks until all of the attacks have been made. This is in direct contrast to other items like Gem Box, where enemies can counterattack individual spells in between the time players cast them. This means that by this logic, if Terra has Offering and Ultima Weapon, she wins immediately.

    Of course, if you Game Genie yourself an Offering before you're supposed to get one, you'll find out that the timer runs down in between each attack, but that's pretty clearly not applicable to canon since the only way you can have an Offering for any of the timed sequences in the game without cheating is to perform things out of order and wait to get Sabin until after fixing Figaro Castle and getting the airship in the World of Ruin.

    And yeah, what Del pointed about her being able to fly. That's a pretty big disadvantage for the others that I didn't even think of.
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  8. #68
    Newbie Administrator Loony BoB's Avatar
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    I'm pretty sure wrestling matches don't include game genies.

    When it's No Disqualification, it means you beat each other up with chairs, tables, ladders, perhaps a sledgehammer (although never in a massive way), bells, barbed wire, baseball bats, cars, bikes, fire extinguishers, stuff you find around the venue.

    I'm pretty sure there aren't swords around these venues.

    I imagine the host of any cage match featuring a flying person would put a lid on the cage, but if they are too stupid to then the fight will be over before it's even a fight, yeah.
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  9. #69
    pirate heartbreaker The Man's Avatar
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    :monster:

    A cage match where some participants are arbitrarily disallowed from using some of their natural strengths is a pretty smurfing stupid cage match. It doesn't accurately reflect the participants' innate abilities if some of those abilities are banned.
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  10. #70
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    We're gonna act like Terra wasn't getting whooped by Vargas in a brawl when she had the help of Locke AND Edgar? We all know who had to come through and stop him.
    You think a minor thing like the end of the world was gonna do me in?

  11. #71
    pirate heartbreaker The Man's Avatar
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    :monster:

    Because Terra's power at the start of the game when she didn't even know she was half-Esper is completely comparable to her power after she comes to terms with her identity.

    Oh wait.

    That's not even a particularly representative battle because it's programmed to end as soon as Sabin hits Vargas with a blitz, no matter how much damage it does. (Actually, in theory a powered-up party could defeat Vargas before Sabin shows up, but I'm pretty sure it's also programmed to throw them off the screen after they do a preset amount of damage to him - which, let's note, isn't him killing them, or even damaging them; it's just him removing them from the battle). None of this speaks particularly well to either Sabin's ability to damage people who are not Vargas or Vargas' ability to damage the party. All it speaks to is Vargas' ability to push opponents out of the field of combat, which wouldn't contribute anything to a cage match even if he were a participant.

    And let's be honest. Sabin isn't the one who fried fifty of the Empire's best soldiers in five minutes.
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  12. #72
    Old school, like an old fool. Flying Mullet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    And let's be honest. Sabin isn't the one who fried fifty of the Empire's best soldiers in five minutes.
    He did it in two minutes.
    Figaro Castle

  13. #73
    pirate heartbreaker The Man's Avatar
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    :monster:

    It's highly unlikely that he could do it more quickly than Terra; he has troutty magic power compared to Terra's and the Blitzes that target multiple targets aren't as powerful as the ones that hit single targets. Terra could just Ultima each of them in succession and use Osmose if she ever runs out of magic (and that's assuming she doesn't just have Economizer equipped).
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  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man View Post
    It's highly unlikely that he could do it more quickly than Terra; he has troutty magic power compared to Terra's and the Blitzes that target multiple targets aren't as powerful as the ones that hit single targets. Terra could just Ultima each of them in succession and use Osmose if she ever runs out of magic (and that's assuming she doesn't just have Economizer equipped).
    You're right. Sabin can't learn Ultima. He also can't equip Economizer.

    And since you seem to keep bringing up game mechanics, Sabin has a higher base speed than Terra. What's Terra doing when Sabin lets off that ultima quick ultima ultima ultima ultima if he has gem box and economizer equipped?

    Oh.
    You think a minor thing like the end of the world was gonna do me in?

  15. #75
    pirate heartbreaker The Man's Avatar
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    :monster:

    He can learn Ultima, but his magic power sucks compared to Terra's. His Ultima is unlikely to wipe out the other characters. Terra's will.

    Furthermore, I thought it was pretty much established that this wasn't going to be a turn-based battle. But if we're going to obey the rules of turn-based combat slavishly, Sabin's Blitzes can either: target multiple people, in which case they're unlikely to wipe out all of his opponents, because their magic defence is going to be too high; or target one person, in which case it is chosen randomly. If Sabin takes out Terra, he has a realistic shot of winning the match, but that is only a one-in-four chance.

    But none of this changes the fact that if we're actually regarding this in terms of the game's actual storytelling, Terra can just morph into an esper, fly out of range of the other characters, and rain down destruction from above. None of the other party members has a defence against that.

    By the way: Sabin's speed is a meagre four points higher than Terra's, which, even if we're going to accept that speed status makes a difference in a cage match, isn't going to enable him to pull off an attack he can complete before Terra can cast Ultima or swing the Ultima Weapon. Meanwhile, Terra's magic power is eleven more than Sabin's. That's a much more substantial difference. The only character with a higher innate magic power in FFVI is Relm, but even then, the player will likely have raised Terra's magic power to beyond that with Esper stat bonuses by the time Relm can be recruited.
    Last edited by The Man; 05-17-2013 at 03:31 AM.
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