Round 2 - There can be only one

[Loony BoB]

A cage match where some participants are arbitrarily disallowed from using some of their natural strengths is a pretty smurfing stupid cage match. It doesn't accurately reflect the participants' innate abilities if some of those abilities are banned.

A cage match where you win by escaping the cage including someone that can fly is stupid in itself, so don't you go arguing stupidity. A cage match is a wrestling match and a wrestling match involves wrestling, not toasting your opponent in green flames or flying out for a cheap win. Wrestling! Wrestling wrestling wrestling. You know nothing, Aaron Freed.

It would be stupid for Terra to even be in a wrestling match with Sabin, Umaro and Shadow (and Cyan, I guess...) but that's who got voted into this round by the masses. In reality, she'd never have got past Celes. If they can use their innate abilities, Celes can Runic until Terra runs out of gas. If they can't use their innate abilities, Celes would beat Terra in a wrestling match. Them's the breaks! Of course, it's all a moot point because Terra's a pansy and wouldn't want to hurt her friends even in a 'friendly' fight.

But yeah, when you set up a cage match it makes sense that you expect the people to actually wrestle instead of taking cheap shots. Sabin is the better wrestler. You just don't go beyond that. The only people I'd say have a chance of beating Sabin at wrestling would be Gau or Umaro, and it would be a pretty great fight. Shadow after that as he might have some good submission holds in him since he's a ninja and probably can paralyse his opponents with some kinda fancy move or... something. xD

[The Man]

It's stupid that you're insisting this has to be a pure wrestling match when Mulley has repeatedly and explicitly said that the interpretation of what kind of match the characters are fighting is up to the individual voting. Obviously a lot of people did not interpret this as a pure wrestling match and the fact that you are discounting their interpretations purely because of your narrow-minded interpretation of what characters would do if forced to fight one another is absurd. Obviously a lot of people are much more interested in pursuing the question of which character is the strongest overall than which character is the strongest in specific narrow fields of physical combat (and Terra is certainly no slouch in those either since she can equip Offering, Genji Glove, Illumina, and Ultima Weapon and attack her foes physically in her morphed state). Terra won against Celes and Relm because Runic doesn't mean a goddamn thing if Terra attacks her physically, which she is more than capable of doing with some of the most powerful weapons in the game, and she can morph to gain additional power. Celes can't do a thing to block against physical attacks except attempt to heal, and if Terra is coming at her in her morphed state with Ultima Weapon then she won't be conscious to heal herself after Terra has attacked her. And your interpretation of Terra not wanting to hurt her friends is a ridiculous reason to discount her when one considers that, as Wolf Kanno has already pointed out, Cyan and Sabin (and probably the others) would not hurt a woman unless absolutely forced to.

[Loony BoB]

It's stupid that you're insisting this has to be a pure wrestling match when Mulley has repeatedly and explicitly said that the interpretation of what kind of match the characters are fighting is up to the individual voting.

Looks like more individuals agreed with me than with you, so Sabin wins regardless.

Maybe it's stupid that you're interpreting it in a way that isn't a wrestling match when you consider that when you search "cage match" on the internet you're basically given a page of wrestling images. Everyone who pays attention to what a cage match is should know it's a wrestling match of some kind.

If it was a question of "who is the most powerful character" then I'm pretty sure Mulley would have asked who the more powerful character is rather than "who would win in a cage match". Pretty sure Mulley also knows more about FFVI than most here and he voted Sabin, too. I think he only suggested that "it's up to interpretation" because he's too nice a guy to say "You're wrong, you're wrong, you're wroooooooooooong, oh so wrong, it's crazy, you're just so wrong it's wrong."

I have no qualms with saying this to you.

[theundeadhero]

I find it ridiculous to assume a cage doesn't have a top to keep people from flying out of it.

[The Man]

Looks like more individuals agreed with me than with you, so Sabin wins regardless.

Only if you disregard the fact that one of those individuals voted for Sabin purely because he wished to see a tie, not because he actually thought Sabin was more powerful. Also, nice appeal to popularity fallacy. You are confusing popularity with actual strength. As chionos pointed out in the previous thread:

If Bob's right then Bieber and Taylor Swift are two of the greatest musical artists of their generation. Numbers don't lie, right?

Maybe it's stupid that you're interpreting it in a way that isn't a wrestling match when you consider that when you search "cage match" on the internet you're basically given a page of wrestling images. Everyone who pays attention to what a cage match is should know it's a wrestling match of some kind.

Maybe it's stupid that you're disregarding what the starter of this thread stated and assuming that a cage match in the FFVI world would be fought along the same lines as a cage match in the real world.

If it was a question of "who is the most powerful character" then I'm pretty sure Mulley would have asked who the more powerful character is rather than "who would win in a cage match".

If Mulley had wanted to ask "who would win in an Earth-style cage match," then when pressed for details about what the question meant he would not have said that it was up to the player's interpretation.

Pretty sure Mulley also knows more about FFVI than most here and he voted Sabin, too.

Appeal to authority fallacy.

I think he only suggested that "it's up to interpretation" because he's too nice a guy to say "You're wrong, you're wrong, you're wroooooooooooong, oh so wrong, it's crazy, you're just so wrong it's wrong."

I have no qualms with saying this to you. 8-)

And I think you're full of trout, just like you were when you said that soup is a drink. I have no qualms with saying this to you. 8-)

I already explained multiple ways Terra could win a physical wrestling match. You have yet to rebut them. You seem to be underestimating just how important equipment is in this game. An attack from Ultima Weapon is nothing to sneeze at, especially since it ignores defences. You also seem to be underestimating just how powerful Terra is when Morphed. It doubles her attack power and reduces the magic damage she takes in half. This makes defeating Sabin child's play, especially since most of his blitzes are counted as magic damage.

I find it ridiculous to assume a cage doesn't have a top to keep people from flying out of it.

Unless the top is at seven feet high, it doesn't really matter whether there's a top or not; Terra can still float to beyond the characters' ability to reach her. Given that most wrestling matches are fought in venues with reasonably high ceilings to enable large audiences to view them, it is unlikely that the ceiling of the venue would be low enough to make a difference.

[Loony BoB]

You just keep on arguing that a cage match isn't a wrestling match. xD It's kinda funny. I did rebut your comment, but you seem to think swords are commonplace in wrestling matches.

[The Man]

I just keep arguing that this isn't a pure wrestling match because Mulley has now explicitly set out a series of guidelines and background that make it plain that this isn't a pure wrestling match.

[Loony BoB]

He said it was open to interpretation, as you pointed out, and that means it most certainly could have been a pure wrestling match, and it seems most people were thinking along these lines. But you're right, it could have been a non-pure wrestling match. Sort of like if you were to create a thread titled 'Chess Tournament' and ask which FFVI character would win in a chess tournament (but leave what that means to interpretation) you could interpret that the chess tournament would involve killing your opponents with a marble chess board and it's pieces.

Which would be kinda cool.

[Flying Mullet]

Sort of like if you were to create a thread titled 'Chess Tournament' and ask which FFVI character would win in a chess tournament (but leave what that means to interpretation) you could interpret that the chess tournament would involve killing your opponents with a marble chess board and it's pieces.

Which would be kinda cool.

And Sabin would win that too. Sabin - Laugh.gif