Pokémon X&Y post-launch discussion thread - AKA Jinx is Upset

[Del Murder]

I do have pupitar!

[Skyblade]

Currently working on breeding my Noibat. Had to transfer stats over via Lucario/Farfetch'd combination, which took a while (I wish I had the Oval Charm!). Hopefully though, I'll have some really high IV spinoffs available soon, if anyone wants one. The little guy is awesome. He's essentially a Crobat which specializes in Special Attacks, hitting hard and fast. One of his best features, though, is the awesome move called Boomblast. Normal Type, 140 Power, 10 PP, and sound based. While Soundproof will block it, not a lot else does. Being sound-based, it automatically bypasses Substitutes and Reflect/Light Screen. He can also learn Flamethrower to deal with Steels and Draco Meteor to wreck anything that resists you (Dragon Pulse isn't really worth it since Boomblast is more powerful and has nearly identical coverage). There's also some free coverage, like Air Slash or Focus Blast. He's intended to hit hard, hit fast, and look awesome doing it.

Again, happy to get any female Y-exclusives caught in a Luxury Ball, and happy to provide the Luxury Balls if needed. Spritzee, Electrike, Heracross, Larvitar, and whichever others I'm forgetting.

EDIT: Other Y exclusives: Skrelp/Dragalgae (you can catch either, and with a Super Rod in the correct place, Dragalgae isn't even that rare, or at least Clawitzer wasn't), Shellder, Purrloin, Throh, Spritzee.

For trade I'll have my Noibats and Riolu, but I also have the X exclusives: Staryu, Pinsir, Swirlix, Sawk, Clauncher/Clawitzer, Houndour, Mightyena, and Lairon (which, along with Pinsir, are the ones I currently already have a couple of). I'll also have some high IV Ralts and Farfetch'd, if anyone wants any.

[drotato]

Oh, yay~! More people who are just as obsessed with Pokemon right now as me. xD

If anyone wants to battle or trade, add my friend code~! (:
4656-7116-1845

[Endless]

Added you, Nikki.

Skyblade, I'll see about catching you a luxury Throh, and I could use a high IV (HP/Sp.A/SPD at least) male ralts if you have that around (nature doesn't matter, got the one I want female and everstone).

Edit: caught one (luxury ball ofc ).

[Skyblade]

Added you, Nikki.

Skyblade, I'll see about catching you a luxury Throh, and I could use a high IV (HP/Sp.A/SPD at least) male ralts if you have that around (nature doesn't matter, got the one I want female and everstone).

Edit: caught one (luxury ball ofc ).

Here you go:

Ralts - #280 (Modest) Male (♂) Trace: 31 / 21 / 0, 2 / 31 / 31 / 31
Hidden Power: Dragon

Defense sucks (either zero or two, which I know because it has HP Dragon, but I don't know which it is), and Attack is only halfway decent, but the rest is perfect. Are there any TMs you want it to learn? Psyshock, Thunderbolt, Psychic, Shadow Ball, Echoed Voice (for Pixilate if you go Mega-Gardevoir), Charge Beam, Thunder Wave, Grass Knot, and Dazzling Gleam are the only worthwhile ones I can think to put on it, but I have every TM you can get before endgame, so just let me know.

Oh, and it's only level 1.


Also, I added Nikki. Don't forget to add us back, or it won't work! My code: 1547-6378-0895

[Endless]

With a little work (destiny knot and enough tries), I ought to be able to get better def from a ditto (I have one with 22-23 def) while keeping the other five stats. TM-wise, I was thinking I'd give it:
Psychic (possibly replaced by Moonblast at 85), Shadow ball, Reflect, Thunderbolt. Echoed voice takes three turns to outclass moonblast in total damage done, so I'm not sure I'd use it. At max friendship, return's probably even better than moonblast. All of these I already have the TMs for except Shadow Ball which I'll either get tonight or this weekend.

Try to catch me on IRC so we can make the trade, in the #pokemon room ; I'll be around for the next 4 hours and most of the weekend.

[Skyblade]

With a little work (destiny knot and enough tries), I ought to be able to get better def from a ditto (I have one with 22-23 def) while keeping the other five stats. TM-wise, I was thinking I'd give it:
Psychic (possibly replaced by Moonblast at 85), Shadow ball, Reflect, Thunderbolt. Echoed voice takes three turns to outclass moonblast in total damage done, so I'm not sure I'd use it. At max friendship, return's probably even better than moonblast. All of these I already have the TMs for except Shadow Ball which I'll either get tonight or this weekend.

Try to catch me on IRC so we can make the trade, in the #pokemon room ; I'll be around for the next 4 hours and most of the weekend.

A couple slight misunderstandings or unclear bits that I'd like to fix up.

First, if you're passing off the 5 high stats on this Ralts, the Defense stat will be randomized on the baby, so you have extremely high odds of picking up a better (even if not great) Defense stat that way.

Second, Return is, unfortunately, still physical, so nowhere near ideal.

Third, Pixelate doesn't just covert a Normal move to Fairy. It coverts it to Fairy and adds an extra 30% damage, on top of STAB (the game never tells you this, but it has been confirmed through calculations and usage). This is true of all the Abilities that convert Normal to a different type, from Pixelate, to Aerilate (Mega-Pinsir's Ability) to Refrigerate (Amaura's Ability). So, essentially, a Pixelated Echoed Voice has a base power of 52, not 40. And it then receives STAB on top of that.

So at its second use, a Pixelated Echoed Voice has a BP of 104 plus STAB, which is more than Moonblast (though without the Special Attack reduction on the target). And if you can get in any additional uses, its power builds up a ton. Not necessarily the most useful, but still quite potent.

It's also worth pointing out that in Black 2 and White 2, Gardevoir could learn Hyper Voice from a move tutor. Which, after the Pixelate boost, is doing 117 Base Power + STAB, which is also pretty awesome. No real move tutors in this generation, unfortunately, but Pokémon Z will have them if the pattern of releasing them in the second games is consistent going forward.

And, finally, you don't need to wait to get Moonblast. As soon as you evolve to Gardevoir, you can pick it up via a Heart Scale.



The damage boost from the type-converting abilities is what really lets Mega-Pinsir shine, as it makes Quick Attack a 52 BP STAB Flying Priority move, and Return becomes a 132 BP STAB Flying move. Coming from Mega-Pinsir's absolutely enormous attack, that is quite deadly.

[Endless]

A couple slight misunderstandings or unclear bits that I'd like to fix up.

First, if you're passing off the 5 high stats on this Ralts, the Defense stat will be randomized on the baby, so you have extremely high odds of picking up a better (even if not great) Defense stat that way.

Even faster then, it'll be your ralts with destiny knot and mine (with everstone unless both parents having the same nature guarantee that nature's passed down) and breeding enough of them to get high def and trace.

Second, Return is, unfortunately, still physical, so nowhere near ideal.

Ah, forgot to check if it was spe or phy.

Third, Pixelate doesn't just covert a Normal move to Fairy. It coverts it to Fairy and adds an extra 30% damage, on top of STAB (the game never tells you this, but it has been confirmed through calculations and usage). This is true of all the Abilities that convert Normal to a different type, from Pixelate, to Aerilate (Mega-Pinsir's Ability) to Refrigerate (Amaura's Ability). So, essentially, a Pixelated Echoed Voice has a base power of 52, not 40. And it then receives STAB on top of that.

So at its second use, a Pixelated Echoed Voice has a BP of 104 plus STAB, which is more than Moonblast (though without the Special Attack reduction on the target). And if you can get in any additional uses, its power builds up a ton. Not necessarily the most useful, but still quite potent.

I know it also boosts it, but in total damage done :
Turn 1: 54 echoed, 95 moonblast
Turn 2: 162 (108+54) echoed, 190 (95+95) moonblast
Turn 3: 324 echoed, 285 moonblast

So it all depends on whether that mega-gardevoir stays or is switched out or risks dying. I could always get two and make one of each xD

It's also worth pointing out that in Black 2 and White 2, Gardevoir could learn Hyper Voice from a move tutor. Which, after the Pixelate boost, is doing 117 Base Power + STAB, which is also pretty awesome. No real move tutors in this generation, unfortunately, but Pokémon Z will have them if the pattern of releasing them in the second games is consistent going forward.



The damage boost from the type-converting abilities is what really lets Mega-Pinsir shine, as it makes Quick Attack a 52 BP STAB Flying Priority move. No Gale Wings Brave Bird, but coming from Mega-Pinsir's absolutely enormous attack, still quite deadly.

[Del Murder]

I wish I had the time to breed an elite pokemon team. Sounds fun. What are the secrets to a great squad?

[Nicolas]

Oh, yay~! More people who are just as obsessed with Pokemon right now as me. xD

If anyone wants to battle or trade, add my friend code~! (:
4656-7116-1845

Added you, Nikki. If you want, you can add people from this list here. Most of our Friend Codes are in there. ;o

[drotato]

Oooooh neat~! Thanks, Nicolas. You guys can go ahead and add me to the friend Safari if you want to. xD

[drotato]

I pretty much added everyone, so there you go. xD

EDIT: Also, Proto is really good at battling, and he has a ton of pokemon. :3

[Skyblade]

I wish I had the time to breed an elite pokemon team. Sounds fun. What are the secrets to a great squad?

Sorry for the late reply, but this is a very, very complicated question, and I did not want to rush an answer.

First, it depends on what you want to get out of it. What do you plan to use it for? Are you looking for a tournament competitive team? A team to take on the Battle Maison? A team to slaughter EoFFers in WiFi duels?

Even within one of those, there are a great deal of questions that you have to ask yourself. If you're going for a ranked team, what system will you use? The official Nintendo Tournaments use Double Battles as their basic battle format. But the most commonly accepted community system is, I believe, the Smogon system.


-General Competition Overview-

At its heart, I still believe that what makes a great team is how well you respond to them. A team is centered around its Trainer. Different Pokémon may have different stats and movesets, but the strength of a team is how well assembled it is, and how well the Trainer can use them.

I also personally loathe most of the competitive systems, due to how insanely min/maxed they have become, and how incredibly hyper-offensive and mathematical it can be (on top of my general hatred for PvP activities). While some people may enjoy calculating out exactly how to balance Xerneas's Speed and Defense EVs to ensure that it can outspeed any threats and have just enough bulk to survive Scizor's Bullet Punch (one of the only threats to Xerneas after Geomancy, as it's a Priority Steel type move that gets a Technician boost), but that is taking things too far for me.

In a casual battling circumstance, you don't usually have to get that obsessive or detailed about it. I recommend watching TamashiiHiroka's Competitive Battling For Beginners video (in fact, she has a number of really fun videos about Pokémon in general, if you want some more esoteric information like her studies of the ROM data). It's a pretty good example of what you're looking for on a basic level. But if you don't want to watch, or want a different viewpoint, I'll go over my own thoughts as well.

Building a team is about team synergy and coordination. In the main game, it's perfectly ok to not have a team. Especially if you're playing with the default "Shift" battle system, enabling you to switch out your Pokémon each time your opponent switches in a new one for a fainted Pokémon, teamwork isn't really a feature. You essentially just have a lineup of strong, powerful Pokémon, each operating its own niche and fighting based on its own strengths.

Competitive battling, by any set of rules that I know of, sticks to the "Set" system. If you make an opponent faint, you do not get to switch out the victor. Your opponent gets to throw out whatever Pokémon they think will do best against the one you have out currently, and if you want to change it, you need to take a turn to do so.

It's also important to remember that you'll be battling on an even playing field with your opponent. You won't be a much higher level than they are (there are some in-game competitive systems that automatically level the Pokémon fighting to level 50, just to ensure fairness), and they will probably have just as much EV training as you do.

Thus, the competitive field truly becomes a game of teamwork. No Pokémon is perfect. Each one has its weaknesses, it's checks and counters (though some, especially the "Ubers", have them few and far between). Knowing how to support your team is important.

Pokémon Battle RolesAs in any RPG, there are several different roles each Pokémon can take. Anyone who's played an MMO knows about the terms "tank", "healer", and "DPS", the trinity of play styles that forms the basis of most systems. Pokémon has all of these and more, and I'm going to go over a few for you.


Sweeper: A Sweeper is an offensive Pokémon designed to "sweep" the opposing team, knocking out Pokémon one after the other. Usually designed to operate with stat boosts, so as to maximize KO potential and reduce opponent opportunities to strike back.

Wall/Tank: A Wall is a Pokémon designed to absorb attacks, through stats, typing, and moves. It comes in varieties, physical, special, or mixed, depending on what it is designed to block. A Tank is essentially a Wall that has the offensive stats to still pose a threat (Walls can pose threats on their own, but they tend to do so through means like Poison or Burns rather than outright attacks).

Annoyer (or Prankster, as I call them): An Annoyer is designed to mess with strategies. They tend to carry moves like Taunt, Encore, Thunder Wave, etcetera. Built to be an annoying hassle to deal with, and break up Pokémon trying to set up to sweep, inflict status ailments, and ruin team strategies, rather than be an outright threat.

Cleric (I call them Healers): A Pokémon designed to help heal or restore your own Pokémon. Moves like Wish, Heal Bell, and Aromatherapy are pretty standard on these guys. They're Pokémon you can usually count on to help keep your party in decent condition.

Hazard Setter: Any Pokémon designed to set up entry hazards. These include Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Sticky Web, and Stealth Rock (which I personally think is massively overpowered and too important to the battle system, and needed its power cut in half).

Phazer: A Phazer is a Pokémon designed to remove opponent's positive status buffs by getting the Pokémon off the field. Moves like Dragon Tail, Whirlwind, and Roar do this. Some minor status ailments, like Leech Seed and Perish Song, can be removed by switching out, and can entice opponents to switch, and lose their buffs. This can also be done to compound damage done by entry hazards.

Weather Setter: A Weather Setter is a Pokémon that is used to set up Weather effects. This can be a Pokémon with an Ability like Drought, or a Pokémon which carries the individual moves, like Rain Dance.

Spinner: A Spinner is a Pokémon who can use moves like Rapid Spin or Defog to remove hazards, clearing the way for the rest of your team to switch freely.

Baton Passer: A Pokémon designed to set up buffs and then use Baton Pass to transfer them to another Pokémon. This lets you set up with behind the safety of moves like Substitute or Spore, without sacrificing the movepool of your other Pokémon.

There are probably tons more, but those are some of the highlight roles. Please note, however, that plenty of Pokémon can serve multiple roles. You can easily have an Annoyer that can set up Hazards, or a Wall that can spin or set up Weather. Nor is it necessary to have every role on your team. What you choose to go with will depend on what play style you choose, and what Pokémon you want to take with you.



-The Core of the Team-

Many teams (though definitely not all of them) are built around a "Core". This is usually a Pokémon, but it can also be a move or strategy. Essentially, it's the focus of your team, and how it is built (TamashiiHiroka chose a Drizzle Politoed, a very common choice in Gen V as a Rain Team Core).

If you have a favorite Pokémon, one you really want to battle with or try, then that's a great Core for a team. Take a moment and look at it. Think about its abilities, typing, stat distribution, and available moves. Consider how you want to use this Pokémon, as well as how it tends to do in its role.

Then, work outwards and decide what Pokémon would best supplement your core. If you chose to focus a team around Mega-Charizard Y, adding in a Pokémon with, say, Dry Skin would not be an ideal move, as you would take damage from the Sun that Drought sets up. You'd be better off choosing Pokémon who can use the sun to their own benefit.

You'll also probably want to cover Charizard's weaknesses, such as a Spinner to remove the deadly Stealth Rocks, or a Ground Type to take out Electric and Rock threats (Charizard's Solarbeam would wreck Water threats fairly well on its own).



This is just a basic overview, but it gets you into the idea of how to set up a team. The important thing to remember is that there really is no right answer. Even in the ultimate precision of the truly competitive systems, no team is invulnerable. Choose what you want, think about how it works together, and practice with it.

If you want any more specific advice, then share your plans and thoughts for where you want to go, what sort of competition or events you are interested in, and what Pokémon you enjoy using. And if you want any more specific advice on breeding or setting up an individual Pokémon, just let us know.

[WildRaubtier]

So, I beat the elite 4.

I went to Endless's friend safari to hunt dittos for breeding.

I caught three.

One of them has 4 perfect IVs.

It also has an adamant nature due to synchronise.

Ladies.

[Skyblade]

Getting final preparation for the Elite 4 done.

My Party:

Greninja, Level 100, Splash Plate (thinking about Amulet Coin)
Gardevoir, Level 91, Mind Plate
Lucario, Level 100, Fist Plate (thinking about Lucarionite)
Noivern, Level 88, Silk Scarf (WHY is there no Normal Plate?! I love Plates. )
Gengar, Level 55, Lucky Egg (going to switch to Spooky Plate or Gengarite at Level 100)
Xerneas, Level 100, Pixie Plate

Just have to finalize my outfit for the Hall of Fame save, and think about whether it's worth getting my entire party up to 100, just for the sake of consistency (OCD kicking in again). Putting the Battle Chateau right next to the Day Care is great for leveling up while breeding.



Also, thinking about making a post about breeding in general, and how to best train a good team member, what to look for in EV spreads, and how to handle move sets and Egg Moves. If anyone is interested, it might help guide you to getting the most out of your Pokémon, rather than just copy/pasting from Smogon or Serebii, so if you think it's a good idea, let me know.