"Epic fail" vs "Epic failure"

[Ayen]

What does IRL stand for?

In real life.

[Bubba]

What does IRL stand for?

Integrating Rural Lobsters

[SuperMillionaire]

I'll accept "in real life."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/09/ma...ge-t.html?_r=0

Anyway, sometimes, I feel as though some are going overboard with it, constantly saying the word "FAIL!" in ALL CAPS as an interjection. Whether something goes wrong or you disapprove of something, people say "FAIL!" a lot. And if it's really bad, they'll say "EPIC FAIL!" Why fail instead of failure? Why ALL CAP-italized FAIL instead of regular lower-cased fail? Also, when something goes right, it's not a "win;" it's a "pass" (a term that comes from academics) or "success," which brings me to my next point: when someone makes a grammatical mistake, sometimes they say "grammar fail!," which is a grammatical failure in itself. Get your grammar right everybody, or you fail basic English grammar forever!

Some people, including myself, have occasionally implemented the term into standard English, often as a pun on the meme, albeit modified in order to be grammatically correct; as a noun, it is "an epic failure," and as a verb, it is "to epically fail." Note that the words "epic failure" and "epically fail" actually predate the FAIL meme.

[Mirage]

Why? Because it is shorter. It's that simple. /thread

[Shauna]

Note that the words "epic failure" and "epically fail" actually predate the FAIL meme.

You're right. The existence of these words do indeed predate an internet meme.

[Mirage]

Know what else predates the internet itself? The words "laugh out loud" and "cats". Crazy, right? Maybe there is some sort of pattern...

[Jiro]

I'm all for the evolution of language. Using "win" implies a certain level of metaphor which I find to be uncharacteristically clever of the internet.

I'm gonna do that asshole thing right now but as a guy who is helping create an online grammar course I think you'll find the prevailing trend is towards a descriptivist approach. Obviously there's resistance against hugely horrific changes in grammar but some things ain't that bad, yo.

[SuperMillionaire]

You don't "win" anything unless it's a game or contest, which is why I would suggest replacing "win" with "pass," a term carried over from academics as the opposite of "fail." And the opposite of "win" is "lose."

[Jiro]

Yes, and life is a game. You just need to know how to play it. Or whatever.

Say these out loud: "Epic Pass" and "Epic Failure". Do they sound as vibrant and emotive? Language is not about simply being right; it's about communication of ideas, and the terms already in use are more than satisfactory. They don't damage language. Anybody who thinks that the internet should speak academia is really barking up the wrong tree.

[SuperMillionaire]

True, but still, I think "win" should only be used when some sort of prize is involved, and the opposite of "win" is "lose." Some people also, although less commonly, use "epic lose" as well.

And here's a video in which the grammatically correct term "EPIC FAILURE!" is used; this video is about failed test scores in school:

EPIC FAILURE! Common Core School Covers-Up Failing Test Scores - YouTube

Let's also remember that as a verb, the correct term would be "to epically fail."

[Loony BoB]

I simply say "Haha, fail." in such instances. I don't need to add any further words.

[Jiro]

I simply say "Haha, fail." in such instances. I don't need to add any further words.

But under the prescriptivist model that SuperMillionaire is advocating, fail acts as a verb and so you would be wishing someone to fail and as such your tense would be incorrect and apparently we are unable to infer your meaning despite it conforming to a fluid and descriptivist understanding of the way the English language works.

I find it hard to get on board with total prescriptivists because the hidden implication in their approach is that Shakespeare was utter trout. If language is not allowed to evolve than what we are prescribing is a falsehood; we ought to ask Chaucer to come back and "fix" English.

Personal preferences are fine; I do not mind a bit of flexibility in the way we use our language. I just find it strange to focus on something like this. Trying to combat viral internet memes is an impossible undertaking.

[SuperMillionaire]

True, fighting an internet meme is impossible, but what about starting a new internet meme? How about PASS?

[Shauna]

Forcing memes is generally a fail.

[Agent Proto]

You can try to "PASS" this new meme yourself, but it's bound to become an "EPIC FAIL"