EoFF XXVII Game Thread - Day Five - Showdown in the Velvet Room

[[M] D'Anna]

[It's not exactly mislynch or lose, since the doctor can still potentially protect the mafia's next target. Which is why asking people to reveal themselves now is pretty smurfing stupid.]

Again, the Doctor (assuming they survive) still has to gamble in order to save the game. Not only that, but the mafia also has to not target them. I'd say trying to leave the town's fate to pitiful odds is really dumb.

[Voting no-lynch only serves to extend our suffering since by the end of the day, we'll be no closer to reducing the mafia's number, and they'll still end up killing someone the next night. Then the next day, it's truly mislynch or lose, AND lynch or lose. While if we manage to kill a mafia today, our fourth day can be a lot less tense, and we'll have a lot more info to go on since we'll know who one of the mafia was - as long as we get that far.]

This doesn't make any sense. As I've already said multiple times, today is effectively mislynch or lose. If we don't lynch today, one of the Cop or the Tracker are guaranteed to survive. Then town has guaranteed information to bring with them into the next day.

And to counter your point even further, the Doctor could even save the mafia's target tonight and we'll be left with five townies on Day 4.

[Fkr someone who's advocating for no lynch so strongly, you're pretty quick to lynch everyone today instead of voting no lynch. Scared of making the first move? That the fact you were the one to do it could be used against you?]

Yeah, I'm voting for you because you're acting like a slimy bastard. I'm more than happy to vote no lynch though.

Everyone at that point in the game will claim vanilla. It is dangerous not to. Vanilla is the safest claim anyone can make. They had said... I'm the doctor, do you think Mafia wouldn't kill her for sure? It is the claim everyone in their right mind would claim if they thought they were dying in the night.

Except he was under no real pressure to make his claim. Theodore was the one with the most votes, and I was the one with the second most votes. He only felt that he was pressured because he was pretty convinced he was right in his suspicions.

It ultimately doesn't matter if he were any other role, because the fact of the matter is that he was a Vanilla townie and was honest about it.

[Except it's common sense to lie in this instance because revealing yourself as a role puts the whole town at a disadvantage!]

Right, but he didn't lie.

I think I've realized now that both of you are looking pretty guilty from this. The fact that both of you are so adamantly suggesting Minato could have been lying about his claim at the time is the exact same line of thinking the mafia must have had when they killed him.

[[M] Kurt - Cool Dad]

Woof!

[The point remains that there is no reason not to put into question someone's vanilla claim, since it's literally what everyone will claim, role or mafia.]

[[M] Trevor - Gay Dad]

I am not sure if you are a rookie player or not Alihiko but to claim anything but vanilla is a death sentence at night phase. To be honest I thought I was going to be the target last night. Mitsuru is definitely Mafia I know that much. I claimed it loudly too. I also said Theodore is town. I wasn't buying him as mafia. There is a reason the Doctor and the Tracker would claim vanilla in game. It puts a giant night target on their back. Use common sense man.

[[M] Kurt - Cool Dad]

Arf!

[Can you elaborate why exactly you are convinced that Mitsuru is mafia?]

[[M] Trevor - Gay Dad]

I believe I'm dead in night 3 anyhow so I may as well come clean.

I am Town Tracker. I have the evidence that Mitsuru is mafia. However I was roleblocked in the last night phase. Notice yesterday I was steady on two people who were working together, yet people want for Theodore dead over looked what I had wrote.

[[M] D'Anna]

[The point remains that there is no reason not to put into question someone's vanilla claim, since it's literally what everyone will claim, role or mafia.]

Not true in this instance. There wasn't really much reason to question his claim. He wasn't under any pressure at all and had no votes on him, yet he decided to claim he was vanilla anyways. The context of his claim doesn't suggest any suspicion.

I am not sure if you are a rookie player or not Alihiko but to claim anything but vanilla is a death sentence at night phase.

Yes, but why would a Doctor or Tracker or any other power role claim anything when they're under absolutely no pressure to do so? It doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

[[M] D'Anna]

Unless there's a counter-claim, it looks like Mitsuru is 100% mafia.

[[M] Trevor - Gay Dad]

I have noticed she tends to go to Elizabeth in thread. Don't know if it is a signal, or what but that is where I grew suspicious of Elizabeth.
Then when Elizabeth was doing the vote count it was just odd how it was Mitsuru's vote that she messed up on?
Ken I am wondering about too as I have seen her go to Ken in Thread once though Ken has been extremely quite.

[[M] Greg - Hot Dad]

I signed in during work hours guys. This is how serious this is.

Are you sure I have a link with Elizabeth, Junpei? Or did you have me confused with someone else? Again. If you are town, you really need to get your god damned act together. I have referred to her twice in this entire game, not including posts made by your ridiculous prompting of this nature.

Anyway, since with the role claim that Junpei has made I have been thrown directly under the bus, time to make my own.

I am the town cop. So I have a night role. Explains the tracking result. My role came with a disgusting twist though. If I am protected by the doc, it switches my sanity. I investigated Theo N1, came up guilty. So I was confident in my vote on D2. However, it appears that I was protected N1 - it did not occur to me for this to happen, as I would have thought the doc would protect themselves. Whoops.

I investigated Koromaru last night. Came up guilty. Make of that what you will. I am not 100% confident in my results because of the massive failing of N1's result. But it's all I got just now.

I'll be back after work.

[[M] Joe - Army Dad]

You're a cop, who's sanity flips? What? How she that even a role?

[[M] D'Anna]

I misunderstood what you were initially arguing, Junpei. Apologies.

I still stand by the fact that there was no reason to mistrust Minato's claim of being a vanilla townie. However, the circumstances of his claim are pretty interesting.

It may be extremely paranoid to suggest this, but in a scenario where Strega are extremely intelligent and good at predicting human behaviour we cannot discount the possibility that if Shinjiro is Strega that it was a double blind. Though most humans are not prone to thinking more than one or two moves ahead so attempting to peel back layers of intent and obfuscation beyond that are often more self-defeating than productive as extreme doubt is debilitating.

This is a textbook example of planting doubt. Your purpose is to make people feel that Shinjiro is suspicious, but you use vague and ambiguous language to ensure a clean get-out when he comes up Town. This is not the first time you have done this, and it is unsurprising that - for the third time now - you are aligned with Theodore.

Theo is arguably the more obvious Mafia, but you are certainly the most dangerous. I suspect you are the Roleblocker, though that is mere guesswork.

##vote: Aigis

Here's where things get interesting. I'm not sure if Minato was roleblocked or not (I can check his posts to see if he confirms this if necessary), but there are a few things we can theorize from this.

1. Let's assume he was roleblocked. He then guesses Aigis was the one who roleblocked him.

- Aigis was actually the one who roleblocked him and he guessed correctly. Because of this, the mafia suspected he was the Tracker and killed him.

2. Let's assume he was not roleblocked. He guesses Aigis is the Mafia Roleblocker.

- Aigis is actually the roleblocker and he was correct. Because he was right, the Mafia suspected he was the Tracker or Cop and killed him.

So far these are the only two scenarios I can come up with off the top of my head, but both would create motivation for the mafia to kill him.

If I am lynched in the night, know that you will not lose anything of value other than a man on your side.

Here is his claim of being a vanilla townie. I see no pressure on him, he was merely concerned that he was correct and would be lynched because of it.

[[M] D'Anna]

I am the town cop. So I have a night role. Explains the tracking result. My role came with a disgusting twist though. If I am protected by the doc, it switches my sanity. I investigated Theo N1, came up guilty. So I was confident in my vote on D2. However, it appears that I was protected N1 - it did not occur to me for this to happen, as I would have thought the doc would protect themselves. Whoops.

This role or "twist" does not exist in any iteration of any mafia game. There are other Cops in other games -- Sane, Paranoid, etc. -- but none with this stipulation.

Basically, you're lying out your ass.

##Vote: Mitsuru

Also it goes without saying that the real Cop should not respond to this whatsoever.

[[M] Trevor - Gay Dad]

So the issue with your claim as Cop is unless Igor messed up, Theodore was Vanilla and would have came back innocent.

Point two. We have no clue who the doctor is, and you claim they protected you? Don't see how you would have that information on hand so easily.

[[M] Kurt - Cool Dad]

Arf!

[This is funny. I've said myself how we shouldn't reveal roles, but I guess I have no choice.

I'm the doctor. After I protected Mitsuru the first time, I thought the mafia would assume lightning doesn't strike twice and would aim for her again, so I protected her on Night 2 as well.]

[[M] D'Anna]

It should be noted that Mitsuru's claim of "sanity" switching isn't how the mechanics of a Cop actually work.

A Sane Cop gets 100% accurate results. An Insane Cop gets opposite results of what they should be. Paranoid Cops always get non-town investigation results. Naive Cops always get non-mafia investigation results.

In the cases of being an Insane, Paranoid or Naive Cop you are usually not told that you are Insane, Paranoid, or Naive. You are meant to deduce that on your own.

She's likely just trying to bait out the real cop and doctor. No need to give her any more information.