R=U? What are you people talking about?

[Shockwave Pulsar]

I found some pictures here:
http://www.dman.orcon.net.nz/Site/Te.../rutheory.html

[celtcknight]

Ok OK Ok thats awesome, can't believe someone spent some time superimposing pictures into one another. I can se rinoa looking like ultimecia now!!

I do remember seeing that area where it looks like he wings turn black. I remember constantly playing back that part to see but I was persuaded that it was a shift in the lighting but i could be mistaken.



oh, and then I read part two of the theory at the website and they just shoot everyhting down.

but the criticizers dont exaclty have the best arguments (superimposing faces black wings...etc) I mean an example is that only the eyes and mouth of rinoa and ultimecia look like not the facial structure. However, theres thing called maturing. Im sure ultimecia has a different chest structure also from rinoas by fact that shes older.

anyway still stand behind the idea that it was made to be taken both ways incase square wanted to make a FFVIII-2, they would make rinoa ultimecia, but if they didnt want to, they would just say ultimecia was her own person.

Like FFX and FFX-2, actually i wouldnt think they could or would make a part 2 for X, I thought it was all closed with a different approach to the ending...

(Final Fantasy VIII-2 makes its debut March 3rd, 2006 for the Playstation - Zero)

Edit by Big D: Please don't double-post, use the 'edit/delete' button if you'd like to add more to one of your posts.

[Big D]

Also, the idea of the GF Griever coming from Squall's ring is faintly absurd. Squall's ring isn't some mystical artefact from the distant past, it's a product - a manufactured item bearing an image of the legendary winged lion, Griever. He bought it from a shop, just like his gublade and necklace, which are also adorned with the Griever icon. If I draw a monster on a piece of paper, that doesn't mean there's a magical spirit living in the paper...

The second part of that article seems pretty clear in asserting that Square has rejected the theory, but then it also says that they "have not been able to find the origins of Square's reply. "

[PhoenixAsh]

I'm sure we went through earlier that Griever didn't have to COME from the ring, the theory probably makes more sense if it didn't.

[HanaKirei]

Originally posted by PhoenixAsh
I'm sure we went through earlier that Griever didn't have to COME from the ring, the theory probably makes more sense if it didn't.

Piping in here, I have to say I'd agree with that. The GF itself could've come from anywhere. But throughout the game, you can name GFs whatever you please (heck, I called one of 'em 'Sparky' in my first game since I couldn't figure out how to pronounce its name XD; ). so you can assume that tradition continues on even after the end of the game. So I'd say the fact that its name matches the name of Squall's ring, whatever you call it, is the real significant factor.

'Course, this is all speculation. XD; *hides*

[celtcknight]

Did it say anywhere in the game that Squall bought the ring from a shop? I dont rmember.

and also, you can't compare this world (reality) with FFs by saying just because you draw a lion or whatever on a piece of paper it doesnt mean it has powers...etc. These characters what... draw MAGIC from a RUBY DRAGON.

So why wouldnt a piece of metal, that squall somehow obtained, have or not have the spirit of a GF in FF world, just like solomons ring anyway?

And yes, maybe the GF was named Griever and had no connection with the ring, or squall and party. What a coincidence, across generations and especially in the same game.

The fact that WHATEVER you name that ring it is the same name in the future. So the time and place where squall names the ring is directly proportionate to influencing the name of the GF in the future.

So what s possible? some galbadian seed overheard the ring being named while fighting in battle and eventually the name becomes so popular Ultimecia decides to name her GF the same name. Or maybe it had to do with Rinoa present (r=u theory) Or edea heard it out the window of GG and therefore Ultimecia heard it and decided to pick on a weakspot of squall (HA I will name the GF that will destroy you the same name as your ring, that will make you cry...)

It can be the name of a famous mythological creature that was reproduced on the gunblade and necklace...etc. But it doesnt matter if you decide the change the name, the name is changed in the future.

i say it again, possibly, it was all incase square wanted to make a FFVIII-2, they would have something to work from. And if they confessed anyway to that a sequal was probable and didnt happen, would that ruin their image, or cause some sort of demand for a game it seems not many FF fans enjoyed? Im asking you guys.

[Big D]

There's definitely a connection between the image on Squall's ring and the GF Griever; however, I'm contending that the connection is pretty simple:
The design on the ring is just a picture of a legendary creature, i.e. Griever. Griever's also on his gunblade, necklace, and who knows where else. A popular icon for engraving or carving, apparently. The image of Griever is a winged, fire-wreathed lion, similar enough to the GF. It's never stated that Squall bought the ring, but then it'd be pretty weird if he found a mystical, magical ring and never bothered to look into its powers, then went ahead and bought a sword and necklace with exactly the same animal drawn on them.

[TheAbominatrix]

Square has said that there are no plans to make a sequel to VIII. They've said it quite a few times, if I remember right.

The Greiver ring belonged to Laguna I believe, and he gave it to Raine. I'm pretty sure that was how it happened.

Big D didnt say that meant that Greiver was completly unconnected. Might wanna read that again.

[celtcknight]

Im sure we dont want to make a big deal or debate on this, I dont.

Square can say they never wanted to make a sequal to FFVIII or anything and say it many times over. But it doesnt mean they telling the truth. I am not saying they arent telling the truth. I am saying incase they wanted too, they preped FFVIII enough to stretch it. And if sales werent up they could can it and that was the end of it. so it was.

Remember we are playing FFX-2 now (some of us) I wouldnt have thought a part two was possible, but hey.

And corporations can lie. Its easier to say No Sequal than going into a detailed conversation with the consumer and talk growth and decay charts.

I overlooked the Laguna giving the ring to Raine, never noticed tll now.

[Big D]

Originally posted by TheAbominatrix
The Greiver ring belonged to Laguna I believe, and he gave it to Raine. I'm pretty sure that was how it happened.

That'd be sweet if it was true, but I'm pretty sure that the ring he gave her was a plain gold or silver band, no design on it.

The fact that WHATEVER you name that ring it is the same name in the future. So the time and place where squall names the ring is directly proportionate to influencing the name of the GF in the future.

Squall doesn't actually name it in that scene; he simply tells the name to Rinoa. The game lets the player decide on what the animal is called, basically. Just like when you name the characters at the start, you're not changing their name, just confirming a detail.

[PhoenixAsh]

The image appears nowhere else in the game, and is never mentioned by anyone but Squall. Rinoa doesn't even recognise it. It would seem odd for it to be a legendry GF, popular enough for a brand of jewellery to be made based on it.

The theory that Rinoa/Ultimecia CREATED the GF seems by far the most sensible and requires the least guesswork IMO.

[Big D]

No-one mentions Odin, or even knows that he's a GF. Yet we know that (in the game) he's a legendary dark swordsman of yore.

My guess was simply that the Revolver Gunblade Co decided to use the Griever image on its weapons and associated products. Squall's not exactly childish about anything except girls, so he wouldn't give a name to an anonymous animal shown on his favourite stuff.

[eninen525]

i mite be the only one who thinks that griever is SQUALL's trademark and that he had it engraved onto his sword, carved out onto his ring, and made into a shape to be worn around his neck by his request to whoever he purchased his gear from. thats wut i always thought, guess i coulda been wrong. odin is never mentioned, neither does he have merchandise. griever is never mentioned, yet he has merchandise anyways ?

edit: also .. i dont believe revolver gunblade co placed griever on all their products either. i dont think its on seifer's gunblade and i doubt its on anyone else's besides squall because he had it engraved through a request

[Big D]

Good point... Griever is like a personal 'totem' for Squall, but if it's totally a product of his imagination, then he's even more unhinged than I thought.

[PhoenixAsh]

Hardly, Squall never had anyone he could rely on to stay by him, or a strong father figure. The idea that he created a mascot that symbolised what he looked up to isn't a particular stretch.
It seems more like Squall to respect what he hopes to see in himself than be some kind of obsessive fan.