Time travel and the R=U theories (MASSIVE FRICKEN SPOILER WARNING)

[Zifnab]

Originally posted by Aerio
YOu know i always swore that Ultimecia said she called Greiver from Squalls mind but im probably wrong it was long time ago and the first time it turned all blue for i couldn't read text...

Close, you read that if you cast Scan on Griever.

[Rusty]

umm ok...after reading every bit of that...i am slightly confused...so I have a question....please e-mail with the answer.

Ok...at the end of the game...squall and rinoa are still there...like no one vanish's or dies? Hope not!

Ok e-mail me at rusty_angel777@hotmail.com

thanks

*rusty*

[TasteyPies]

Well odine says that she is probably using his invention but as he is just trying to theorize Odine doesnt know if she realy did use his silly machine. Odine just doesnt think E=U

U using his machine is the only reasonable thing he can think of.

[DJZen]

Hmmm.... If R=U, then let's ask ourselves why you don't automatically win if Rinoa is defeated in battle against Ultimecia?

[PhoenixAsh]

Ignoring the paradoxes that would probably solve it anyway, how about the fact that a defeat in battle doesn't equal death?

[TasteyPies]

Ignoring the paradoxes that would probably solve it anyway, how about the fact that a defeat in battle doesn't equal death?

And for that matter why didnt someone at Trabia have a few "life"s to revive everyone?

Maybe THATS why there arent so many graves in ff8! the only way someone can die is if they are mangled into a twisted heap of human flesh!

(Trabia missle crisis, Raines car crash)
Twisted heaps of flesh and bone for ya!

[celtcknight]

You cant kill your own past, it just wont happen. I always like using the back to the future example. You mess with your own creators (parents) you dissapear. You in the future messing with your own past (creator of your future self)...it just cant happen. Its like George McFly can probably kill Marty (the future) but Marty is doing anything he can to not mess up George's relationship with Leraine (past) so he can still exhist or otherwise he will dissapear. So Ulty can't kill Rinoa (if R=U). But Rinoa can kill her future.

Anyone has the power to destroy their future. Just break laws, or kill yourself

I forgot, why did ellone send rinoa back into time after fighting adel? I know it achieved time compression, but how is it achieved specifically?

And about Rinoa and Ultys faces not looking alike. Keyword is maturity. But its almost silly to use that as a reason R= or ≠U, even though I support R=U. Its still computer animation. Squall does have a resemblence of Laguna though, was that done on purpose? (if you dont know what im talking about, in the booklet for the game there is a pic of them both side by side)

[DJZen]

When time becomes a loop... When time becomes a loop... When time becomes a loop...

The spell "life" doesn't bring a character back from the dead, it revives them from KO. If all characters are KO'd, I guess whatever defeated you can pretty much do whatever they want, including killing you. If you lose to Ultimecia, my THEORY is that she would kill all of you, including Rinoa, and defeat herself. Naturally, you wouldn't be able to see, but wouldn't you still technically win?

[celtcknight]

Noooo,
They would be slaves for eternity like she said.

[aeris2001x2]

ok, clearly ultimecia is not rinoa or she would recognise herself and squall and not talk like an idoilt (zeeds curze all zeeds, horrible voice). clearly she is an offspring/great offspring etc of squall and rinoa.

i know it seems possible since she could obviously only kill her younger self and still exist in time if time itself was compressed and screwed and became part of her. but just because rinoa was the last sorceress doesnt mean she cant have kids! what is the big debate about?

of course ff8 would have had a far better story if this was true, but alas, its not

[TasteyPies]

If you have ZERO health points then you have no health, if you have no health your dead correct?

Im sure if Real life was FInal fantasy i would have about 200 life points and my great grandmother has 0

[TheAbominatrix]

If you have ZERO health points then you have no health, if you have no health your dead correct?

Im sure if Real life was FInal fantasy i would have about 200 life points and my great grandmother has 0

No, you're knocked out. If death were like it was in battle, then (SPOILER)Aeris and General Leo and whatnot could be brought back to life. The whole concept of hit points is not relevant to the real world, because if you get stabbed in the gut it doesnt take '50 hp', it freaking kills you. If Phoenix Downs and Life spells actually restored life, no one in FF would ever die, right?

[PhoenixAsh]

aeris2001x2 have you read the theory? Rinoa doesn't recognise herself because she loses her mind, I personally think the magic has this effect after a while, hence Adel and Ultimecia. This is backed up by Edea's talk about knights and so on.

TheAbominatrix it might be worth pointing out thats not an FFVIII spoiler tagged in your post.

[TasteyPies]

No, you're knocked out. If death were like it was in battle, then (SPOILER)Aeris and General Leo and whatnot could be brought back to life. The whole concept of hit points is not relevant to the real world, because if you get stabbed in the gut it doesnt take '50 hp', it freaking kills you. If Phoenix Downs and Life spells actually restored life, no one in FF would ever die, right?

If the life spell doesnt give life then isnt that kind of a stupid name for the spell?

[HanaKirei]

1.) Why is Griever the GF of Squall's ring in the present, yet only usable by Ultemecia years later. (the ring probably would've decomposed by then)

Decomposed? O.o; If it's a good quality ring and it's well-kept, would it really do that? My great-grandma had a metal wedding ring that was at least 70 years old, but it didn't look worn at all.

Now about the actual QUESTION. XD; Well, maybe it's just because Squall's not a sorceress? For all we know, the ring could've had some sort of seal, needed a certain spell, or Griever might not've been in the ring at all. The ring could've just inspired her to name this great powerful GF she stumbled upon Griever, especially since there is a bit of a resemblance there. Who knows? It's all speculation. I'm still thinking it has something to do with Squall not being a sorceress though.

2.) Ultimecia is killed at the end. If R=U, then U=R, then Rinoa would've died simultaneously. I know Squall sees her vanish in the end but they meet once more for the "Squall Smiling' scene.

Wouldn't work that way. Changing the past may effect the future, but what's in the future has already taken place and can't change the past. Killing your future self wouldn't kill you (though you'd probably want to keep an eye out for yourself after that so you don't kill yourself -- brain...melting...). But doing something to the future wouldn't immediately effect the past until that past is the future. I think. Dern time travel.

3.) Rinoa gets Edea's sorceress powers yet never accepts them. Edea says that she accepted her powers from a sorceress when she was young. So, how exactly are powers passed?

Maybe it's because Rinoa didn't accept them and no one else had the potential to accept that that she went into the comatose state for so long? I dunno.

Hmmm.... If R=U, then let's ask ourselves why you don't automatically win if Rinoa is defeated in battle against Ultimecia?

Because she's not killed, she's knocked out. After awhile if you leave a character knocked out they might dissolve, but it says they dissapear into the time compression and then they come back later just fine when Ulty's defeated, right? Or something close to that? X.x;;