Bush up for Nobel Peace Prize

[Peegee]

I support the war, but I know better ways are potentially possible. I don't think the war was fought with a justifiied reason, but since it wasn't do against a country like China or England (or some country which wasn't posing a threat at all), what's so bad about it? I personally would liken it to a bunch of hoodlum standing in a street doing nothing. To arrest them just because the rest of the people felt unsafe is both unconstitutional and unjust. Yet at the same time I wouldn't complain because in that example I would be among the majority who would benefit from our collective similarity of thinking by removing those who acted otherwise. It's just that simple.

[Moose Knight]

Originally posted by War Angel
Anyone in a democratic nation would be offended, if you diss their leaders. A democratic ruler is chosen by the people, for the people. They support him - without such support, he'll go down. Therefore, when you criticise the leader, you criticise the people, questionong their integrity, intelligence and understanding. Wouldn't you be angered at that?

Wow, that makes a lot of sense. Its like saying the people in the U.S. who don't support Bush are traitors.

So you're saying the MOST ESSENTIAL PART OF OUR GOVERNMENT is incorrect, that people shouldn't have the right to free speech critisizing their leader.

Who's more of a traitor, them or you?

[The Man]

Originally posted by Moose Knight
So you're saying the MOST ESSENTIAL PART OF OUR GOVERNMENT is incorrect, that people shouldn't have the right to free speech critisizing their leader.

the sad part is, the Patriot Act runs on similar reasoning.

[DocFrance]

Originally posted by Moose Knight
Wow, that makes a lot of sense. Its like saying the people in the U.S. who don't support Bush are traitors.

So you're saying the MOST ESSENTIAL PART OF OUR GOVERNMENT is incorrect, that people shouldn't have the right to free speech critisizing their leader.

Who's more of a traitor, them or you?

No, what he's saying is when you - "you" being someone from country A - criticize the democratically elected leader of country B, then you are in effect criticizing the people of country B. The President is America's elected representative to the international playing field (no matter how you want to dispute the electoral/popular vote). I think you're twisting War Angel's words around to make him sound bad.

[Big D]

And I think this thread no longer has anything to do with anything like the original topic, so I'll close it soon unless that changes.

Incidentally... Saddam Hussein and Augusto Pinochet both had a lot of support in their countries. Does that mean we're all attacking the Iraqi and Chilean people whenever we criticise those two? Of course not.
Criticising George Bush is criticising George Bush, nothing more. If you don't like Russel Crowe, you're not displayinghatred for Hollywood and its frontrunners who're "elected" by profit margins and management teams. If you think Tony Blair has bad ties, then that doesn't mean you're attacking UK fashion sense. If you take offense because someone dares not to like your leader, then that's up to you; but to most people it'll look like you're just trying to (a) pick a fight or (b) justify forcing one people's views onto another.

If it's "anti-American" to dislike Bush, then that'd mean that the Nobel committee is full of "terrorists" if they don't award him the prize, which of course is a ridiculous accusation.

[eestlinc]

It does speak poorly of the american people that we elected that hideous excuse for a president. I know I am embarrassed that he is my leader.

[Peegee]

Iraq is no longer a place where the citizentry is in a state of suffering. That's peace to me, even if the means to achieve it was not peaceful. BTW didn't Clinton settle (temporarily until Bush came along) the holy land wars by separating it and letting both waring parties have a piece of the land? If meddling with the middle east and resulting in a quasi-peace-like environment gets you the NPP, Clinton should've got one.

[Silent Warrior]

Moo Moo: Well, their suffering can be debated. Keep in mind that the US military apparently considered a water-purification-plant a valid military target. There was something about foodshipments as well, but that's a further stray. Do have a glance at the current situation in Afghanistan when you get the chance.

Statement: If Bush gets the peace-prize, I'm emigrating the first chance I get. I'm serious.

[DocFrance]

I refuse to comment in this thread any more, because it's nothing more than a Bush-bashing thread. I see so many people in the world saying "Oh, Bush sends America to war, so that means that Bush is a greedy war-monger! He can't get the nobel peace prize!" I can guarantee that most of the same people who complain about the war would be complaining about America's inaction against Iraq if we hadn't gone to war.

[Peegee]

I don't know about that -- we would probably be too busy living our lives and being happily ignorant. Silent Warrior, I'm sure the actual state of affairs there isn't the best in the world. As I understand it, it's not very governed (duh), and prostitutes and other such things roam the streets. When I said that things were better, I meant that Saddam wasn't oppressing and torturing his citizens. Maybe I should've said 'more peaceful'.

[Dr Unne]

Incidentally... Saddam Hussein and Augusto Pinochet both had a lot of support in their countries. --Big D

I think Hussein's support was a very small, exclusive group of people, who had the physical power to keep the rest of the country at bay. There were no democratic elections in Iraq. Rather there were, but in the last one, Saddam got 100% of the votes (go figure). Saddam can't be said to represent the will of the Iraqis. He was a dictator.

If it's "anti-American" to dislike Bush, then that'd mean that the Nobel committee is full of "terrorists" if they don't award him the prize, which of course is a ridiculous accusation.

I don't think anyone would ever say that.

So far as criticizing the President, I don't think hating Bush = hating America, entirely. I do think it's true to a very small extent. I have a feeling (I will admit, probably an irrational one) of "I'm allowed to hate Bush because he's mine; you're not allowed because you're not American". Kind of like I can poke fun at my sister all the time, but if some guy on the street did it I'd punch his lights out. It's a defensive reaction. I don't get offended when people say things about America / Bush; but I do get ANNOYED when people say things I believe are unfounded.

Just because I become annoyed or angered at someone's opinion, doesn't mean I think they're a traitor or a terrorist. People are taking things way too far here. I really do have to wonder what's the point in posting in this forum sometimes.

[Nait]

Hate Bush, love America.

[The Man]

Originally posted by DocFrance
I refuse to comment in this thread any more, because it's nothing more than a Bush-bashing thread. I see so many people in the world saying "Oh, Bush sends America to war, so that means that Bush is a greedy war-monger! He can't get the nobel peace prize!" I can guarantee that most of the same people who complain about the war would be complaining about America's inaction against Iraq if we hadn't gone to war.

I don't think it's so much the fact that we went to war against Iraq that pisses people off so much as the reasons Bush gave for going to war against Iraq, and the fact that they're arguably blatant lies. I know that's what discourages me most about the war.

[Skogs]

Bush'll never get it. It would be far too contraversial.

OOC:

And in regards to the right of non-Americans to criticize Bush. It's well within their right. The USA is such a major international force that its decisions and policies DO affect millions of non-Americans - people who got no say on whether he was elected or not. And I'm not just talking about the war in Iraq. I'm talking about things like environmental policies, free-trade agreements and so on.

[edczxcvbnm]

Its so easy to get nominated for a nobel peace prize. If I were to save a cat in a tree I could get nominated. All I would have to do is pretty much prove what I did and have so many people nominate me. Its not even that many people.

Well...I am off to rescue a cat. Here kitty kitty!