Black Belts suck

[Black Mage FF1]

Yes, a Red Mage can fight, use White Magic, and use Black Magic modestly well. However, his weakness is that he can only do one of those three things in one turn. Furthermore, if you thought a Black Mage was useless after his MP runs dry, try the Red Mage. He'll be your only decent healer, and you'll have to balance using his White and Black magicks. CUR2, FIR2, and LIT2 all share the same level, correct? Your healer won't be as efficient if you had opted for a BM and a WM, and you'll be sucking up Heal Potions (and thus money) faster than a wino with a bottle of cough syrup. Yes, the BM usually doesn't do a whole lot of damage with his magic. However, he can attack multiple targets very easily, and can inflict a decent amount of damage to each; something the BB can never do. A F/?/WM/BM party will have a much easier time fighting 9 Red Sahagins than a F/?/BB/RM party.

Yes a Red Mage can only do one of those in a single turn but that is all he needs. Useally when I use a FT/TH/BB/RM party the only time I ever need to heal is when I am walking through dungeons. I hardly need to heal in battle. But even if he needed to, it doesnt matter. You can use up one turn to heal with Cur2. Then he can go back to attacking. Yes CUR2, FIR2 AND LIT2 are all in the same lvl but out of those 3 spells LIT2 is basically crap. You will hardly need it (unless you lvl up in the ocean, which you shouldnt do). The only time you will need LIT2 is when you enter Krakens area and by that time you will/should have the zeus gauntlet and LIT3. But hell if you are so worried about being able to heal and cast spells at the same time then why not take 2 red mages? 2 Red Mages will do better then a Bm/Wm. Yes a BB cant kill a group of enemies in one turn (unless he useses items that cast spells). But that doesnt really matter because after the FT/TH/BB/Rm are done attacking there arent many enemies left standing. Hell during boss fights is the BM FIR2 gonna help out? Or is the BB attack? And heal potions do not cost that much. 60G isnt a lot of money. You can buy just 5-10 and be fine in just about any dungeon in the begining, and at the end you can buy however many you need since money isnt an issue any more. I will admit though that the Wm is MORE usefull then the Bm. AT least the Wm can attack alittle and cast Life/Life2. To Linus J. I never said to take a BB over a fighter. I am saying that the BB is usefull. What I did say though is to take a Rm instead of a Bm.

[Rase]

Hell during boss fights is the BM FIR2 gonna help out? Or is the BB attack?

Well, it deoends on the boss. But I always use the strongest spells against the bosses. As for you example, FIR2 helps out quite a bit in fighting Lich.

[Dr Unne]

If I want a character who can only punch stuff, I'd unequip a Fighter. At least Fighters get to wear armor. And later get some white magic. And aren't dressed in powder-blue sweat-pants.

[Black Mage FF1]

If I want a character who can only punch stuff, I'd unequip a Fighter. At least Fighters get to wear armor. And later get some white magic. And aren't dressed in powder-blue sweat-pants.

I never said anything about the fighter. My problem is with the Bm and how useless they are.

[Rase]

I never said anything about the fighter. My problem is with the Bm and how useless they are.

I'm still confused at why your name is "Black mage FF1" yet you think the BM in FF1 is the worst character.

[Dr Unne]

What does the BM have to do with the suckiness of the BB? We have another thread for discussing why the BM doesn't suck at all. This thread is about BBs, and why they're oh so very terrible.

[Flying Mullet]

Black Mages are usefull because in regular battles their level 2 and 3 spells can clean out the opponents rather quickly. And in boss battles they are useful because of spells like fast. And I rarely have my black mages die in one hit in any battle, so they are able to cast a couple of spels before I have to worry about their low life or being dead.

[Black Mage FF1]

Black Mages are usefull because in regular battles their level 2 and 3 spells can clean out the opponents rather quickly. And in boss battles they are useful because of spells like fast. And I rarely have my black mages die in one hit in any battle, so they are able to cast a couple of spels before I have to worry about their low life or being dead.

lvl 2 magic does not clean out enemies quickly. ICE1 isnt that good. Besides the Rm can get it too, same goes for FIRE2 and Fast. Bm do die pretty fast. Lets say you run into a giant and his first attack is on a Bm it could be a crit hit. The Bm is dead. If it were a Rm he would most likley live due to his higher hp and defense.

To Dr. Unne. What is wrong with BB? Their attack? Magic defense? High Hp? Or is it because they have low defense? So what? So do the Bm/Wm (not as low but still pretty close). At least the BB has high hp and magic defense to make up for it.

LMAO at Dark_Paladin_Cecil's post!

[Dr Unne]

BBs are good for one thing: fighting. However for most of the game, a Fighter has stronger physical attacks than a BB. BB has lower defense than a Fighter. BB never gets magic, and a Fighter does. BB doesn't have significantly more HP than a Fighter. A BB is a weaker, sucky version of a Fighter. If you like BBs, you should like Fighters more, because Fighters are better in every way. If you want to purposefully cripple your party for a challenge, then maybe BBs are OK I guess. If you want to hide the BB in the back row so they don't die every 5 battles, then sure, they can be OK, but only because the big strong Fighters are there to keep them alive.

BB is boring. Finding weapons and armor = fun. Running around punching stuff = not fun. Final Fantasy is a fantasy game, and in fantasy games I enjoy fantasy. A guy who punches stuff is not fantasy. I can punch stuff myself. I can't wield a sword or throw fireballs at things.

And he's ugly. You must admit that he's ugly.

Two good things about the BB: Cheap, and lots of room to carry items. I don't care if they're cheap, because money is never a problem when I play. The ability to carry items turns them into a half-rate red mage at best, and certainly isn't reason enough to justify taking them over a better character, and you only get spell-casting items very late in the game.

[Black Mage FF1]

BBs are good for one thing: fighting. However for most of the game, a Fighter has stronger physical attacks than a BB. BB has lower defense than a Fighter. BB never gets magic, and a Fighter does. BB doesn't have significantly more HP than a Fighter. A BB is a weaker, sucky version of a Fighter. If you like BBs, you should like Fighters more, because Fighters are better in every way. If you want to purposefully cripple your party for a challenge, then maybe BBs are OK I guess. If you want to hide the BB in the back row so they don't die every 5 battles, then sure, they can be OK, but only because the big strong Fighters are there to keep them alive.

Well I never said that a BB is better than a Fighter. I know that the Fighter owns the BB in just about every catagory (just like the Rm owns the Bm). But Still the BB have strong attack power. Throughout most of the game he will be the second strongest fighter. At the end of the game when I beat it at lvl 26-28 he is just as strong as the Knight with the Xcaliber. Yes the Knight does have more Hp than the BB but its not that high in difference (like around 50-100) Compared to everyone else who is like 200 hp below the fighter. A BB is better then the Knight in some areas. Like his magic defense. The BB has higher magic defense. The BB starts out with 10 and gets +4 every lvl, while the Fighter gets 15 + 3 every lvl.

BB is boring. Finding weapons and armor = fun. Running around punching stuff = not fun. Final Fantasy is a fantasy game, and in fantasy games I enjoy fantasy. A guy who punches stuff is not fantasy. I can punch stuff myself. I can't wield a sword or throw fireballs at things.

You can still find stuff for him. He can equip armor and he can use items as magic. Thats always fun.

And he's ugly. You must admit that he's ugly.

Not really. I think he looks pretty cool.

Two good things about the BB: Cheap, and lots of room to carry items. I don't care if they're cheap, because money is never a problem when I play. The ability to carry items turns them into a half-rate red mage at best, and certainly isn't reason enough to justify taking them over a better character, and you only get spell-casting items very late in the game.

Well in the begining of the game (depending on your party) money can be a problem. Unless you over lvl or something and fight for hours at a time. It can be trouble to buy stuff right away. Like lvl 4 magic for example. Or a silver sword, or copper bracelets. Having a BB lets you save money so you can acually go and buy that stuff.

[Flying Mullet]

lvl 2 magic does not clean out enemies quickly. ICE1 isnt that good. Besides the Rm can get it too, same goes for FIRE2 and Fast. Bm do die pretty fast. Lets say you run into a giant and his first attack is on a Bm it could be a crit hit. The Bm is dead. If it were a Rm he would most likley live due to his higher hp and defense.

Sorry, I was referrring to their Ice/Fire/Bolt 2 and 3 spells, not the spells at level 2 and 3 in the black mages inventory.

And yeah, if an enemy gets a critical hit on a black mage, they can be goners, but a red mage won't fare so well either.

[Linus J]

The discussed characters at lvl 14
Fighter
hp 367
str. 33
agl. 18
int. 7
vit. 20
luck 13

damage 39
hit % 64
absorb 48
evade % 25

BB
hp 241
str. 11
agl. 12
int. 12
vit. 33
luck 14

damage 28
hit % 44
absorb 14
evade % 60

Fighter with what I believe to be the best equip I can have for the moment (earth cave) and BB unequiped. Using the same argument as Black Mage FF1, the BB sucks. What does the BB do better? Evade and magic defense. And dont come running around nagging about high lvl, the change isn't that big if you hold a reasonable lvl.

Comparison between a BM and RM

BM
Magic:
7 lvl1
5 lvl2
4 lvl3
4 lvl4
2 lvl5
hp 181
str. 10
agl. 18
int. 33
vit. 9
luck 18
damage 16
hit % 33
absorb 17
evade % 63

RM
lvl1-3 magic the same amount as BM
3 lvl4 and 0 lvl5
hp 255
str 18
agl. 16
int. 18
vit. 13
luck 13
damage 32
hit % 48
absorb 20 (if changing the equip a bit 17)
evade % 54 (if changing the equip to the same as above 61)

The absorb were almost the same, the difference in hp is only 70, but the BM had a higher evade. The RM is superior in physical attacks, however, the BM gets more mp and higher lvl magic quicker (and get lvl 7-8). White magic is overated (potions works too you know) and the physical damage is already pretty weak.

In my own experience, the BB started of as sucky, same with BM. The RM was a good character, but really secondary to the fighter. At lvl7 the BM started being my second favourite character of the party, after fighter, the BB got past RM at lvl 14. The fact that RM does nothing great, just alot of stuff decent, really wears it down.
But when it comes around, it's different for different people and parties.

Sorry for only comparing low lvls by the way, it's the only save I've got for the moment.

[black orb]

lvl 2 magic? What lvl 2 spell does he have that is usefull? ICE?

>>> My bad, I was thinking about Level 3 magic (fire2 and lit2), well those two magic are more useful than a BB..

[Black Mage FF1]

The discussed characters at lvl 14
Fighter
hp 367
str. 33
agl. 18
int. 7
vit. 20
luck 13

damage 39
hit % 64
absorb 48
evade % 25

BB
hp 241
str. 11
agl. 12
int. 12
vit. 33
luck 14

damage 28
hit % 44
absorb 14
evade % 60

Fighter with what I believe to be the best equip I can have for the moment (earth cave) and BB unequiped. Using the same argument as Black Mage FF1, the BB sucks. What does the BB do better? Evade and magic defense. And dont come running around nagging about high lvl, the change isn't that big if you hold a reasonable lvl.

Comparison between a BM and RM

BM
Magic:
7 lvl1
5 lvl2
4 lvl3
4 lvl4
2 lvl5
hp 181
str. 10
agl. 18
int. 33
vit. 9
luck 18
damage 16
hit % 33
absorb 17
evade % 63

RM
lvl1-3 magic the same amount as BM
3 lvl4 and 0 lvl5
hp 255
str 18
agl. 16
int. 18
vit. 13
luck 13
damage 32
hit % 48
absorb 20 (if changing the equip a bit 17)
evade % 54 (if changing the equip to the same as above 61)

The absorb were almost the same, the difference in hp is only 70, but the BM had a higher evade. The RM is superior in physical attacks, however, the BM gets more mp and higher lvl magic quicker (and get lvl 7-8). White magic is overated (potions works too you know) and the physical damage is already pretty weak.

In my own experience, the BB started of as sucky, same with BM. The RM was a good character, but really secondary to the fighter. At lvl7 the BM started being my second favourite character of the party, after fighter, the BB got past RM at lvl 14. The fact that RM does nothing great, just alot of stuff decent, really wears it down.
But when it comes around, it's different for different people and parties.

Sorry for only comparing low lvls by the way, it's the only save I've got for the moment.

Why are you comparing the BB to the Fighter? Nobody said that the BB is better than the Fighter. I am saying that just because the BB isnt as good as the Fighter DOES NOT mean he sucks. After all the thief is FAR from being as good as a fighter yet people think he is good (I do to BTW). The BB is better than the thief. In hp and power that is. As for the Bm and Rm, 70 hp is a lot, and it doenst matter how much higher the Bm evade is. It wont do anything against crit hits.

To black orb....... What about in boss fights? Like Kary and Tiamat, who both have are strong against all elemental spells. Fire2/3 wont to jack to them. The BB attack will though. Making him a usefull character. I am rushing this post BTW. I will add more later.

[black orb]

To black orb....... What about in boss fights? Like Kary and Tiamat, who both have are strong against all elemental spells. Fire2/3 wont to jack to them. The BB attack will though. Making him a usefull character. I am rushing this post BTW. I will add more later.

>>> Kary`s weakness is Sleep2 and Tiamat weakness is Bane, both black magic.