The FFII appreciation thread

[DJZen]

A lot of people like to gripe about FFII these days. It's funny, back when the translation community first got its hands on the game, people were in love with it. Have times changed tastes? All I know is I'm getting bored of people calling it the worst FF game ever made. Part of me thinks they're just saying that to be cool. The thing that really gets me though is that it seems that people really don't understand just how long and hard the FF fan community fought just to get the game over here. Let's say a few words in the game's defense, shall we?

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

It was the first FF game to feature playable characters with any kind of personality, and even though they weren't nearly as deep as those in later games, they were definitely distinctive. The first main character death in the series is still a prime competitor for the most heart-wrenching. Also, FFIV's system of adding or subtracting characters from the active party as the storyline dictated, instead of sticking you with the same ones throughout the entire game or letting you pick freely among them all, was taken from FFII.

It introduced to the series boss music, taunting subvillains, Dragon Knights, Leviathan, Cid, and for goodness's sake, chocobos. It founded the inspiration for môguri much like how Garland founded the inspiration for the Dark Knight concept. And you can't tell me Lionheart isn't a total proto-Cain.

[Del Murder]

In any set of games one of them has to be the worst. It doesn't mean it was a bad game. FFII had a lot of key elements in it that Kishi has pointed out, it helped set the tone for what would become the greatest game series ever.

As for the game itself, it wasn't great, but it wasn't terrible. I just can't get beyond the brutal level up system, if the game used actual experience then I think it would be a lot better. The storyline was pretty involved, and that was a pleasant surprise.

[desh]

I only played the game for about an hour. I just got Minh, I think. And I wasn't compelled to go on any further. It wasn't because of the story, I felt that the story could be really good; I just didn't like the leveling system at all, and couldn't get into it. I started playing ff3 directly afterwards, and felt that it was sort of the opposite of ff2: it had a good leveling system, but the story was somewhat lacking.

[Flying Mullet]

I agree that it is a good game, it just has so many faults. Just as others have mentioned, the level-up system is terrible. I also don't like how the world map is set up so that I can take five steps out of easy-land and get pummeled to a bloody pulp by monsters way out of my current power/skill level.

I'll give it props though. There are few RPGs like it out there and for that it makes for a fresh gaming experience.

[DJZen]

Hm, I actually like the growth system.........

*looks around suspiciously*

[Moose Knight]

You are a wise person. I too believe that this is a fine video game. THe bosses are really cool, and its difficult as far as FF games go.

This is one of my favorite games. The growth system is very good. It has a lot of bugs though, like the level up quickly trick.

The only thing I really don't like is that the world map is a globe (Good idea) but it took FOREVER to view certain places.

[DJZen]

Oh, I know what you mean. It was really cool that they actually managed to do that on the NES, but it couldn't redraw with any efficiency. However, it's much faster on playstation, and you can opt for a flat map if you like. Also, I think there's a way to get the map to scroll faster on the NES version. I could be wrong though.

[Chimp]

I can't even get the map up in FF2 :{
And what is this level up quickly secret? :o

[Moose Knight]

I can't even get the map up in FF2 :{
And what is this level up quickly secret? :o

The trick is something like selecting an attack on an enemy, hitting confirm, but then hitting cancel. This works in FF2 because your stat raises every X times you make an attack. But it records an attack as being made even if you cancelled it. So you hit 'a' to attack, choose an enemy, hit a, then hit B to get back to the original character, and the attack was recorded as being made.

Another way to level up quickly is to cast change (Or whatever the HP swap spell is called, I forget it) on a weak enemy like a goblin when you have high HP, and your hp will go up at the end of the battle.

Also, I think there's a way to get the map to scroll faster on the NES version.

Heh, I just usually use frameship on the emulator...

[Marak]

And besides, everyone knows that the worst FF is 8, anyway.

But seriously, I just borrowed my dad's copy of FF Origins, and I'm having a total blast powering up my guys to high heaven. It's funny because my wife and friends can't handle my geekness: my characters are currently creeping up on 5000 HP and 250 MP, with 90+ Endurance :P

My biggest pet peeve with FF2 is the outrageous slowness with which Spells (save for Heal) power up. I mean, come on, you have to cast Fire or whatever 33-100 times to make it go up 1 level out of 16, and that's for 1 spell out of how many you can learn. Ridiculous.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

Now that I think about it, Lionheart is a proto-Golbeza as much as he is a proto-Cain. It's just that Golbeza never actually takes off that armor of his and never actually becomes a playable character.

[Ultima Shadow]

I have problem getting trough the game because I'm so bored of it. :rolleyes2 Maybe I change my mind some day.

[aeris2001x2]

now i feel this is a direct or indirect dig at my attempting to start a anti ffII movement. correct me if i,m wrong but i,m going to treat it as such 4 now and explain why i hate ffII. yes i already gave a review elsewhere but i,ll try to answer the themes brought up in this thread.

"A lot of people like to gripe about FFII these days. It's funny, back when the translation community first got its hands on the game, people were in love with it. Have times changed tastes? All I know is I'm getting bored of people calling it the worst FF game ever made. Part of me thinks they're just saying that to be cool. The thing that really gets me though is that it seems that people really don't understand just how long and hard the FF fan community fought just to get the game over here. Let's say a few words in the game's defense, shall we?"

no i,m not doing it 2 be cool, i would,nt know cool if it bit me on the face. i,m pety, but not pety enough to hate ffII 2 be cool. its my belief. that reminds me when it was *cool* 2 be anti bush in the uk. i was against bush but for MY own convictions. same parellel here.

may be i didnt realise the struggle the ff fan community had but that only makes me respect them, not the game. do u think anyone would respect star wars ep 1 if i,d campaigned for 50 years to get it released in the uk if it had,nt been?...no i did,nt think so.


"It was the first FF game to feature playable characters with any kind of personality, and even though they weren't nearly as deep as those in later games, they were definitely distinctive. The first main character death in the series is still a prime competitor for the most heart-wrenching. Also, FFIV's system of adding or subtracting characters from the active party as the storyline dictated, instead of sticking you with the same ones throughout the entire game or letting you pick freely among them all, was taken from FFII.

It introduced to the series boss music, taunting subvillains, Dragon Knights, Leviathan, Cid, and for goodness's sake, chocobos. It founded the inspiration for môguri much like how Garland founded the inspiration for the Dark Knight concept. And you can't tell me Lionheart isn't a total proto-Cain"

weren,t nearly as deep as those in later games is an under statement. i still consider ffIV the first ff with personalities because this was pathetic. gus says about 2 lines, both reflecting the automoton he is. maria;s only line of development is when a horny sailor tries his luck. firional says the sorta stuff ffIII light warriors say. Leon,s character makes NO SENSE, why become a (SPOILER)dark knight? why want 2 become (SPOILER)emperor? why (SPOILER)leave at end? its never explained. the best horrid thing is that this game makes out the characters have personalities. ffI and ffIII never pretended such lies. if truth be told this is the MAIN reason i despise the game. i say again, ffVIII is hated by many, but those characters were shakespearian tragic heroes in comparison to ffII main characters.

(SPOILER)josefs death was funny, infact is very sad that ALL the main npcs have BETTER development then the main 4 characters.

yes it was the PROTOTYPE 4 many stuff and introduced many stuff. they had some good stuff in a crap game. later they would leave the crap behind and take the good stuff forward.

"In any set of games one of them has to be the worst. It doesn't mean it was a bad game. FFII had a lot of key elements in it that Kishi has pointed out, it helped set the tone for what would become the greatest game series ever.

As for the game itself, it wasn't great, but it wasn't terrible. I just can't get beyond the brutal level up system, if the game used actual experience then I think it would be a lot better. The storyline was pretty involved, and that was a pleasant surprise."

yes the lv up systerm was AWFUL. i mean the idea was brillant but done so badly. in complete contrast i think ffX-2 battle system as an idea was a horrid battle systerm, but done so well i like it. i dont want 2 play a game that makes me more suicidal then i already am.

i never ever though disputed the story. it was a very good story and its a shame its let down by weak main characters. i would also agree the music is beautiful. gotta be one of the best ff soundtracks ever. and that last dungeon! to be honest i would say the last quarter of the game is good but...

the bottom line is that i did not enjoy this game. i attempted a lv up master replay but quit after 6 hours, it was so painful. i would rather play ffX-2, at least that has enjoyment to be has.

and another gripe i have is other ff's take the heat(ff8,9,10) 4 being the worst. i love them but even if i did not, they would still be light years ahead of ffII...

and no ultima shadow, burn the game, spare yourself the pain...


Edit by Kishi: Mark your spoilers.

[Kawaii Ryûkishi]

i still consider ffIV the first ff with personalities because this was pathetic. gus says about 2 lines, both reflecting the automoton he is. maria;s only line of development is when a horny sailor tries his luck. firional says the sorta stuff ffIII light warriors say. Leon,s character makes NO SENSE, why become a (SPOILER)dark knight? why want 2 become (SPOILER)emperor? why (SPOILER)leave at end? its never explained. the best horrid thing is that this game makes out the characters have personalities. ffI and ffIII never pretended such lies. if truth be told this is the MAIN reason i despise the game. i say again, ffVIII is hated by many, but those characters were shakespearian tragic heroes in comparison to ffII main characters.

Good job. You just ignored Minh, Josef, Gordon, Leila, and Richard--most of the main characters.

(SPOILER)josefs death was funny, infact is very sad that ALL the main npcs have BETTER development then the main 4 characters.

There are nine main characters in this game. According to what you're implying, Tella, Gilbert, Yang, Cid, Porom, Palom, and Fusuya are not main characters in FFIV because they all leave the party permanently at some point. I have no idea why this escapes you.