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Thread: "Murder by Playstation"

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    Gamecrafter Recognized Member Azure Chrysanthemum's Avatar
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    The following is an understandably biased article that originally appeared in GameInformer.

    On Wednesday, Februrary 25 of this year, police in the UK found the body of 14-year old Stefan Pakeerah dead in a park. Thee subsequent investigation has thrown Rockstar's Manhunt into the spotlight. However, some parties wanting to villainize video games have found that it's not as easy as that. But don't be fooled, there are still dangers for the industry and the games you play yet ahead.
    The Pakeerah murder case took a sensational turn when the parents of the victim blamed Manhunt, calling for a ban of the game. Stefan's father, Patrick Pakeerah, recalled how Stefan and his 17-year-old friend Warren LeBlanc - who pleaded guilty to beating Stefan with a claw hammer and stabbing him with a knife - used to play the game together. Patrick Pakeerah feels the murder mimicked the title. UK tabloid The Daily Mail ran the sensational headline "Murder by PlayStation" and called for a ban on violent video games. Some retailers in the UK even pulled the title from their shelves.
    The ensuing witch-hunt for Manhunt, however, isn't supported by hard facts. The police said that Manhunt is not responsible, and reprimanded papers like The Daily Mail for ignoring this fact. LeBlanc says he only wanted to rob Pakeerah for money to pay back drug debts to another party.
    If you think that an unfortunate incident in the UK cannot have any bearing on American gamers, then think again. At least, that's what Florida lawyer Jack Thompson says. In an interview with Game Informer, Thompson declared that he wants to "destroy" both Rockstar and Sony, and characterizes Doug Lowenstein - the president of the video game industry political advocacy group The Entertainment Software Association (ESA) - as worse than Saddam Hussein. Will Thompson's views shape the future of the video game industry?
    Thompson thrives on controversy. He's shadowed the industry on events such as Columbine and the Beltway Sniper (Lee Malvo used Halo to practice his skills). Now he is assisting Pakeerah's parents, and believes that the ESRB ratings system and retail compliance of it is flawed. In turn he wants to punish the ESA, Rockstar, and Sony for what he perceives as their complicity. Rockstar issued a statement that read: "We would like to extend our sympathies to the Pakeerah family. We reject any suggestion or association between the tragic events and the sale of Manhunt. There is a clear certification structure in place, and Manhunt should not be in the possession of a juvenile."
    Thompson says video game companies are deceitful in how they market titles for adults to children - an issue the Federal Trade Commision has cleared the industry of. "They can lie all they want about who's playing the games and who's buying them. The fact is, a huge amount of money is being made by the industry on mature-rated games that are being sold to and/or played by children, period."
    It's regarding this point where Thompsons told us that ESA president Lowenstein was worse than Saddam Hussein by claiming he allows companies to market inappropriate games towards children. When we asked Thompson if that was going too far, not flinching in the face of hyperbole he said, "No, not far enough, actually. He's better educated than Saddam Hussein, so he knows better."
    Game Informer asked Lowenstein for a response to this outrageous claim, but he simply told us in a statement, "We believe that name-calling is counterproductive."
    Apart from his adacious comparisons of Lowenstein and his promises to go after Rockstar and Sony, Thompson's use of Manhunt is opportunistic scapegoating and skirts the basic question of responsibility. Studies widely vary as to how much parents are involved in the purchase of games by their kids. in the Pakeerah case, it was revealed that a copy of Manhunt was found in the home of the victim, not the perpetrator, which asks: If Pakeerah's mother thinks Rockstar is responsible, is she responsible for allowing her underage son to play the game in her house?
    The role of parents and stores highlights the imbalance in people like Thompson and their actions. He would like to use the courts and the law to enforce the issue, but it's already being addressed on its most important levels - at the stores and in the homes. And although Thompson states that movie theaters do a better job than video game retailers in barring underage kids from restricted material, he ignores the fact that video games already rely on exactly the same methods that movie theaters do.
    For his part, Thompson suggests legal solutions to ensure enforcement. "Maybe there has to be some liability that's spelled out for parents who let their kids play the game after getting it for them." He even believes federal and local governments may have to get involved. State bills restricting the sale of video games to minors have already failed in Washington and California, and the ban of violent video games that Thompson warns are bogey man claims.
    In the meantime, things should stay where they are: concentrating on the retail enforcement of age restrictions and continuing to raise parental awareness. If you disagree with Rockstar, capitalism is the bottom line. Consumers can change what kind of content publishers and developers offer the public better than the courts or government. Betraying the fact that he is out of touch, Thompson eventually exposed his own thoughts on video games. "Any adult who would spend an entire day playing Grand Theft Auto is daft."
    The overall issue, apart from responsibility, is the effect games have on kids. Thompson absurdly claims that the ESA buys off scientists to support its claim that there is no direct link that video games cause violence, citing studies at Harvard and elsewhere. However, we doubt that the US Surgeon General, Washington State Department of Health, and the government of Australia (who back the ESA's noncasual belief) are on the ESA's payroll.
    Many gamers have questioned whether Manhunt should even let players commit such heinous acts. However, it has correctly preached its message to many gamers simply by making them sick to their stomach. The lesson is that violence is not a casual act, but an abnormal one that players will flinch at performing. If gamers liked GTA because of its casual attitude towards violence, then Manhunt was Rockstar's way of turning the tables on the public. Do you have the stomach to strangle a flailing man with a bag over his head? Is that funny? If anything, Rockstar's lesson is just a little too clever and subtle for our society. Of course, Rockstar makes money on both sides of the question
    It's not dangerous to imply that ther's a relationship between video games and behavior. Despite what critics of video games would have you believe, a link between what you play and how you act is not a silver bullet that convincingly confirms that games breed violence. Human beings have higher though processes, and when the vast majority of us understand the difference between right and wrong, it is going to take much more than a game to make us step over such a line into murder.
    Discuss.

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    Take me to your boss! Strider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by that article
    Thompson's use of Manhunt is opportunistic scapegoating and skirts the basic question of responsibility.
    That's all you need to derive from this.

    You know what they say about parental involvement concerning issues like smoking and drinking and such? That applies here, too. If you don't want your children exposed to violence like the examples from Manhunt, then step in and say "Hey, I don't think so, kid" and don't let your children play.

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    Not a Banana Mo-Nercy's Avatar
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    Once again. Video gaming has become the portal for scapegoating. Violence is video games is no different from that in the movies or on TV. Now this issue is actually one I feel pretty strongly about. I've read up on a guy who is now facing court charges for yelling out "Don't go in, there's a bomb!" over the phone. Apparently, someone had heard the cry and had reported it. The police discovered later the phone call was about a friend who needed help in GTA3 and the person who cried out was just telling him to stay out of a certain building in the game. Another article I remember reading about is when a lady went onto some late night TV show to discuss the effects of violent games on children and adolescants. I specifically remember her saying that,
    "Games like Counter-Strike encourage the killing of hostages. And being a sniper, killing mercilessly earns you the respect of other players."
    I can think of at least two things wrong with that sentence. She could've at least done her homework before coming onto national television and blathering on, wasting about 5 mins of my life to read the review article. Snipers are assholes. We all know that.

    That same lady went onto to say something about games polluting the innocent minds of children everywhere. Well, surely games can't take all the blame. What about TV, friends, society in general. Anything and everything in the world dictates how someone's mind works. It is the influence of external culture and society that morphes our thoughts. Games are the only thing out there promoting violence.

    It's not just the media that place the blame squarely on games either. It's also parents, nosy parents of your friends, those guys who decide on games censorship etc. Basically, this article BtV has posted is saying (out of what I read before I got too disgusted to go on) "This guy played video games. And now he's dead. Therefore..." I'm glad to see the article balance out at the end and say that it'll take more than a video game (especially one as tame as Manhunt) to possess someone to murder another.

    Censorship is brought up a bit in there too. I really don't have much of a stance on that stuff. I still think that those censorship people just reach into a hat and pull out random numbers to stick in front of the box. FF8 was M15+ in Australia, which I didn't see the logic in especially since FF7 was only G8+. Battle Arena Toshinden 3 was MA18+ when first released and I was 7 when I bought it. I'm 16 now, and strangly enough, I still don't feel the urge to slice someone open with a katana. Weird...[/sarcasm]

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    Polaris's Avatar
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    that guy didn't know how to divide realityu and the world of videogame... he wan't murderer by Playstation he was murderer by his lack of sense of reality!

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    Unpostmodernizeable Shadow Nexus's Avatar
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    Oh, well, I work for a videogame site, so I get videogames for free for the reviews. I got Manhunt and played all the way through it. Personally, I disagree with the article in the whole subtle message against violence thing, I believe films like The Clockwork Orange do that better. However, Manhunt is somehow satirical in front of the idea of violence to be normal, to a point you are absolutely insensibilized in front of all those murders you commit (In fact, I was insensibilized since hte first kill, it's preety cartoonish). However, yes, it is violence exalted, not as in GTA where you get it as a Tarantino movie, but more as your regular violent R rated movie by Arnold Swazzengger or whatever his name is.

    So yeah, I believe buying a kid that is an act of irresponsability (It's a preety lousy, repetitive game anyway). And yes, I believe children can mimic this videogames while playing, and I feel it is totally natural, when I was a kid I liked to imagine I was a ninja turtle. However, from that to slaying someone there is quite a distance. According to the article posted, that guy killed the other because of some debt involving drugs. Why the hell don't they blame it in drugs? OK, so maybe the killing had relation with the game in the way it was done (Well, or not, people have been killing like this for centuries, but he could have been influenced) but I don't think you can actually blame it on the game. I am not going to deny the fact games can influence in a negative or positive way in how some people act. However, from a negative influence to murder there is a long path.

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    Recognized Member TheAbominatrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divinity
    that guy didn't know how to divide realityu and the world of videogame... he wan't murderer by Playstation he was murderer by his lack of sense of reality!
    As the police said, and as is quoted in that article, the video game had nothing to do with the murder. He wasnt reinacting what he saw in a videogame, he was offing his friend in order to get cash to pay back a drug debt.

    Anyway, as mostly everyone says, this is just an excuse to let the parents of both teens off the hook. Why arent the parents of the murdering kid in trouble for not keeping their kid off drugs (I wouldnt doubt that it's beyond their control, but it's a point).

    All this censorship is just so parents dont have to watch their kids. Even violent video games, tv shows, movies, etc, can be fine as long as parents take the time to explain to their children "This is bad, don't do this" if the kids are allowed to do such things. I grew up watching Apocolypse Now (along with Full Metal Jacket, Platoon, and every other Vietnam movie ever made) and playing games like Doom from a very young age. But my parents were smart enough to say "This is not reality, kid." and monitor what I did as much as they could.

    If games rated Mature and Teen are being sold to young kids, the people at fault are the stores (most stores could give a damn how old you are) and the parents (who are usually the buyers of the games since kids usually dont have income of their own) for buying the things in the first place. If we're gonna outlaw Mature games because parents are irresponsible, then it's time to outlaw porn, guns, rated R movies, history books (so much violence in them!) and anything even remotely sexual or violent. Then the world can watch Barney everyday and we'll finally have peace.

    This was written during 24 hour non-sleep period, excuse the non-sensical-ness.

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    Martyr's Avatar
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    Um...

    I often wonder if my video game habits in my youth have squandered a great deal of my creativity and replaced it a new kind of creativity that is, if not purely violence oriented, very much action oriented.
    I love stories about midieval wars and such. I like incorporating some epic battle into every story (Even I don't always do it) and my interest in books withoutsimilar reference is faded.

    On the other side of the coin, I may just be me.

    In any case, video games do affect the minds of children because they're introduced at early ages. They are an influental part of a child's life if the child plays them like I did (Over 2 hours a day. Believe it. And lot's of kids still do that)
    I was raised on Final Fantasy. I think that the translations should have never been altered because I learned lots of vocabulary words through it that most young children wouldn't know (impertinent, equip, etc.) I wrote fanfiction about it when I was 10, and I wouldn't doubt for an instant that it played a role in what kind of person I am today (I'm a Light Warrior).

    So here's the thing. Video games couldn't have turned me into a killer. When the knight attacks a creep, his sword swings into the wind, some scribbles appear over the creep, and a box of numbers appears to indicate damage done numerically.

    In modern games, people are using guns (Which they use today. Modern video games often leave the fantasy world, so there is often a bit of realism) . In modern games, the character played is not always (Not even often) an epic "Light Warrior" on a quest to save the world. Most FPS games (Which have been wildly popular) are games which hone skill and strategy with a gun. You go around and kill people, and the games are pretty plotless.

    Now, I can only assume that if I was so influenced by a game like Final Fantasy (Zelda, Battle of Olympus...), then kids will be influenced by whatever they play today. It will affect their creativity, it will affect the way they think, and it will affect their view of the world as we know it.
    And so the children will emulate it, just as I emulated video games in the imaginary world in my back yard, and if a child starts emulating the wrong game, then there's a problem.

    I'm sure it happens.

    But I just wanted to stick this in there since this is a video game forum and there's not likely going to be many people to stick up for anything in the article here.

    I don't really think that video games are entirely to blame. Like any killer or criminal, those actions are largely the results of bad parental care and, more importantly, simply a weak mind. As somebody has said, a parent really should be able to regulate their child's video game playing. At least to some extent. And the idea that video games are transforming our kids into bloodthirsty monsters or brainwashed minions of Japan is an issue that still has another decade before we'll be desperate to solve it.
    Lack of discipline is an enormous problem in American culture today. That is what we need to worry about, and that is the heading under which the video game influence and tragedies should be.

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    Banned nik0tine's Avatar
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    Thank god for video games! What would those poor people do if they only had THEMSELVES to blame?

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    ...you hot, salty nut! Recognized Member fire_of_avalon's Avatar
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    You know, when my dad was a kid, he had this toy tank that moved around and shot foam things. And he had a toy .38 special that shot real plastic bullets that he used to play cowboys and indians with. The point? Violence is a natural part of children's play, no matter what. However, my daddy knew that if his mama ever found out about him handling a real gun without supervision, he'd have never seen the light of day again.

    Flash forward to me. I watched Ninja Turtles and Power Rangers as a kid, and I didn't kill any of my friends. Why? Cause if I had ninja kicked anybody, I'd have never seen the light of day again. Raise your damn kids or don't have 'em. Stop pointing fingers at the media, afterall you pay them to show you what you wanna see.

    Signature by rubah. I think.

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    I think this game was partially to blame for the murder, I know that sounds silly but it is a violent game and studies show watching violence makes you violent, however, his parents bought him the game, his parents knew what it was about and his parents let him play it. He also took drugs and so on, so was obviously not in the most friendly of crowds (I'm not saying people who take drugs arn't friendly, I'm saying the people who sell them arn't).

    So yes the game is partially to blame for teaching him effective ways of murder but it is also his own fault for being a psychopath and wanting to kill along with his parents fault for letting it happen.
    FOA

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    Recognized Member TheAbominatrix's Avatar
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    I'd like to see these so-called studies, because I've seen many others, including some by Harvard, that say otherwise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheAbominatrix
    I'd like to see these so-called studies, because I've seen many others, including some by Harvard, that say otherwise.
    I would love to find them for you but I don't wanna
    FOA

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    2nd Protector of the Sun War Angel's Avatar
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    I'd like to see these so-called studies, because I've seen many others, including some by Harvard, that say otherwise.
    You don't need any studies - I've seen kids watching violent TV shows, and afterwards they became irritable, violent, tireless, etc. Some even assaulted me for no reason... crazy little toddlers.
    When fighting monsters, be wary not to become one yourself... when gazing into the abyss, bear in mind that the abyss also gazes into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

    The rightful owner of this Ciddie can kiss my arse! :P

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    Recognized Member TheAbominatrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by War Angel
    You don't need any studies - I've seen kids watching violent TV shows, and afterwards they became irritable, violent, tireless, etc. Some even assaulted me for no reason... crazy little toddlers.
    Yeah I dont believe that. Either it didnt happen or the tv wasnt the factor. First of all, numerous studies, done on children and teenagers, prove otherwise. Second, hundreds of life experiences of my own prove otherwise. As long as parents raise their kids correctly, violent media isnt a factor.

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    2nd Protector of the Sun War Angel's Avatar
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    s long as parents raise their kids correctly, violent media isnt a factor.
    It's not about the media, it's about witnessing acts of violence. It irritates you, makes you feel un-eased, angry, etc. Kids and adolescents epsecially express those emotions, and thus, you have the negative effect it has on them.

    And that, without talking about truly innocent 're-ennactment' of things seen on TV, or things your parents do, etc. Doing the 'bed thing' without realising what it is, doing the 'karate thing' without realising the lethal potential it has, etc. All signs of ignorance, that no matter how good of a parent you are, are just bound to happen. I think small children should be shielded from things they have no chance of understanding, and that can scar them emotionally.
    When fighting monsters, be wary not to become one yourself... when gazing into the abyss, bear in mind that the abyss also gazes into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

    The rightful owner of this Ciddie can kiss my arse! :P

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