Squall or cloud?

[Dking'squeen]

Soldiers like Seeds because they can plant them and make pretty flowers and become little pansies

[Auronhart]

What are you talking about? Cloud got stabbed from Sephiroth's sword in the mako reactor, and in his rage, threw Sephiroth over the edge. WHILE he was still being stabbed through, might I add. Squall's a wimp who got flung back in the beginning of the game when Seifer flung a fireball at him. *snort*

Now that's just getting desperate... Cloud's sword is MUCH bigger than Squall's. A gun is easier to pick up than a sword that big...

Gunblade is not a gun. Whatever the case as I've explained before, the speed issue is not transferrable between the two games, so Cloud's weapon could easily take him longer to swing then Squall's. The other issue is that you don't know whether Squall was strong enough to have used Cloud's blade (which by a Physics perspective is about the stupidest weapon in the world) or whether it would have mattered if he could.

Itdoesn't matter. Who cares if Squall was trained longer than Cloud? He's still an "ordinary" human. Cloud was supposedly weaker than Zack, yet he defeated the great general, Sephiroth. Although it is never explained HOW he did it. Still, that doesn't change the fact that Cloud is STRONG.

First of all, STRONG is not a relative term, so it cannot be used in this comparison. Second of all, Sephiroth lost all my respect for his strength when I killed him with one counter at the end and he was probably injured after fighting against 3 of your party members as well...so Cloud doesn't even have to recieve the title of strong.

What? When was it ever shown in the game that Barret, Cid, Yuffie, Nanaki....ect....Were bullied as children, failed to make it into SOLDIER, deemed as a failed experiment, get mako poisening and survive, and have someone controlling their mind all the time, eh?

Failing to make it into soldier and come out alive is a big deal now is it. None of the emotional things have any significance. (Squall went through some similarily bad experiences) Cloud didn't have the willpower to stop himself from being controlled, that can't be used as a reason for his reaction, it is a weakness.
I was talking about the others who were experimented on and recieved similar treatment. Sephiroth certainly had this exact physical treatment, (including falling into a great deal of mako) so we know at least Sephiroth took the punishment better than Cloud. As for the Jenova cells injections, all members of soldier had those though in smaller doses, Zack and Cloud were in the same experiment so probably had the same amount.

I know what logic is.

Don't use the term in the wrong context next time, then.

[Faris]

Off Of Topic: Will this thread ever die!!!!!!

Back On Topic: Auronhart makes a good point there...

[Naughty Tifa]

Gunblade is not a gun. Whatever the case as I've explained before, the speed issue is not transferrable between the two games, so Cloud's weapon could easily take him longer to swing then Squall's. The other issue is that you don't know whether Squall was strong enough to have used Cloud's blade (which by a Physics perspective is about the stupidest weapon in the world) or whether it would have mattered if he could.

Oh? I thought that you said that since he has part of a gun on his blade, that it's heavier or something? And how is the bustersword the stupidest weapen in the world? This is a fantasy game, otherwise, Squall wouldn't be able to use magic.

First of all, STRONG is not a relative term, so it cannot be used in this comparison.

Uh huh... :rolleyes2

Second of all, Sephiroth lost all my respect for his strength when I killed him with one counter at the end and he was probably injured after fighting against 3 of your party members as well...so Cloud doesn't even have to recieve the title of strong.

You should have payed more attention to my other post then...But if that's how you wanna compare it, then I could easily say that Squall indeed IS a wimp because he needed the help of two other party members to kill Seifer. Including the first time where he got his butt wooped in the beginning. Now how is that strong?

Failing to make it into soldier and come out alive is a big deal now is it. None of the emotional things have any significance. (Squall went through some similarily bad experiences) Cloud didn't have the willpower to stop himself from being controlled, that can't be used as a reason for his reaction, it is a weakness.

Pffft, Squall didn't go through any of those things, he was a whining pussie. Sure, he didn't have any parents, but at least he had Garden, which he could call home. Cloud went through WAY more abuse. If you say he didn't stop himself, ever, then what about the time he was struggling with himself not to stab his friend? (Which would be Aeris) Or the many other times he had er, theose weird attacks? It doesn't really matter which one is weaker emotionally I guess, but don't compare them in terms of that as it is obvious to anyone that has played the two games that Cloud had much more problems.

I was talking about the others who were experimented on and recieved similar treatment. Sephiroth certainly had this exact physical treatment, (including falling into a great deal of mako) so we know at least Sephiroth took the punishment better than Cloud. As for the Jenova cells injections, all members of soldier had those though in smaller doses, Zack and Cloud were in the same experiment so probably had the same amount.

Once again, how does that counter my argument? Sephiroth wasn't in the party, because he was the villains. Of course villains are strong. And Zack was SUPPOSEDLY stronger than Cloud, but Cloud defeated Sephiroth making this whole thing really confusing. And who cares if you lost respect for Sephiroth, it still does not change the fact that in the game, he was the strongest general ever.

[Shoden]

well Squall isnt a wuss and that fireball was an illegal use of junctioning for training Seifer took squall by suprise therefore he was knocked back and when he got back up seifer alshed him then squall made the finishing move Rough divide on Seifer, well i defeated seifer everytime with only Squall alive. well we were revealed too off most of Cloud'spast but with Squall all we know is birth orphanage then garden but what happened when he was younger? Cloud was technically less human than Squall.




if you put them one on one it wouldnt be easy as Cloud is slightly slower and can only hold a limited amount of spells and has Mp so squall can cast more spells. it would be a long battle though with the victor as No one Squall is faster but he is younger he is suprised easilly while cloud isnt usefull without his weapon though so if cloud made a wrong move squall could use renzokuken then lionheart then cloud uses one omni slash so squall uses renzokuken again so depending on the moves either vcould win therefore cloud and Squall are a good fight to see

[Angelwings]

hmm.. I really don't know. cause their both really good.but I would say Squall.why can't say.

[Dking'squeen]

Seifer using that fire spell in the beginining was just him cheating. It proves that Seifer is a punk whoc couldn't have won without it, and since it caught Squall off guard, it gave Seifer the upper hand in the battle, but Squall quickly retaliated with an attack of his own, so i think that that would prove Squall having more *i little maybe* will power/power/ stamina than Cloud, which means that he could outstand him and beat him

[Shoden]

yeah in ff7, cloud has weak will power proven by sephiroth possessing him. Squall had the spirit of a fighter cloud was just lonely and dark he was disorted from his past which shattered his will power to bits. Squall on the oter hand may get put down he will get back up and retaliate with more atatcks

[kaine the dragoon]

cloud vs squall=draw unless kaine is coming to wipe their butts!!!!!!

[Shoden]

hmmmm ive changed my mind after playing through 7 again i see the truth but Squall would be a good match for cloud though. Ultima weapon + Omni slash would probably kill squall as each blow does a hell load of damage over 9999 while renzokuken only does 5678 in average but the chances of a lionhart are so low plus one renzokuken after squall is hit by omni slash would push Clouds limit back to the max and omni slash again to finish him. or Cloud could summon Knights of round or Bahamut zero even cast mega spells like comet 2 hed even be able to use enemy skills such as shadow flare.

[Cless]

Without going into technical details about why I think he would win. When I imagine the two one on one, my gut tells me Cloud would come out on top. There's just something about Cloud that I can't put my finger on...I just couldn't see Squall defeating him.

[Shoden]

one Cloud has been enfused with Jeniova cells and Mako energy and has a hell of alot more experience fighting

[Destai]

The Jenova cells and Mako didnt make him stronger at all. They had no effect on his fighting.
Clouds definitely slower but packs a heavier blow. You can see it in flics from advent children. When Cloud swings the buster sword it rises slow but falls fast as you'd expect, Loz was easily able to dodge and knock him aside using speed over strength but if Cloud could land a blow it would have a serious effect.

[Shoden]

hmmmm depends on what clouds stats are and level because he can have items equipped that can adjust his speed but if cloud uses Ultima weapon he'll be alot faster as its size is samller and weight is lighter than the buster sword but cloud can use mastered materia on squall that can dish out a hell of alot more damage than usual or he can put himself in the fury status to charge up his limit breaks twice as fast.

what do you mean Zack never reacted to the mako and jenova cells but cloud did so your saying if sephiroth wasnt injected with jenova cells and mako hed still be ultra strong?

[Destai]

Sephirtoh reacted with them alright but Cloud got an average-small ammount that had no physical effect. Sephiroth may not have even gained strength from the mako and J cells. He was Jenovas chosen one but thats just an insignificant theory. Throughout the game Cloud is basically the same as the other party members his level. It wasnt like a lvl1 Cloud was equal to a Lvl 10 Cid or whatever. No difference in fighting.