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Thread: On Freedom of Speech

  1. #181
    Banned Sasquatch's Avatar
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    "The slavery has left us to play catch up and we're just not there"? You've had a hundred and fifty years, and you're not caught up yet? You've had forty years since the Civil Rights movement, and you're still "just not there"?

    You have a negative opinion of America--perhaps not overall, but on this certain subject--because you don't believe black people are given equal opportunities. You believe black people should be given opportunities, even though you fail to realize that this is already happening. And you believe that the opportunities black people (or any other minorities) get through AA come at the expense of white people. Affirmative Action is a program that takes things away from one race of people to give to another race of people, simply because they belong to those races. Now, you're telling me that those aren't racist beliefs?

    "That analogy is BS. And since when has AA been about just handing out jobs to black people. Hell, no one just handed me a job. If thats the case, when am i gonna get handed my job."

    AA has ALWAYS been about just handing jobs to minorities, what don't you understand about that? And if nobody's handed you a job because you're black yet, try finding a company that employs primarily white people and has only a small percentage of minorities, and they'd have to give you a job because they'd be afraid of getting sued if they don't. Because of, obviously, things like Affirmative Action.

    There are all kinds of people who expect things given to them, but you would be hard pressed to find a white person that expects things to be given to him simply because he's white. Not so with black people.

    "I mean, why would millions of black people all across the country exaggerate one point? I dont get it. If racism is not as bad as i say, why do even hard working black people (not the ones you claim want something to be handed to them) even say the racism is still there? Are we all lying?"

    Why? Because they can, and they know people will pay attention. It's been shown time and time again, when somebody cries "racism", the entire country pays attention to them. How do you think Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton made names for themselves? They pale in comparison to Rev. Martin Luther King.

    And how many "hard working black people" say they're still being discriminated against? Look at Bill Cosby. He says the same kinds of things I'm saying, and the last time I saw him, he was black. A lot of black people love him because he tells the truth, and a lot of black people hate him because, well, he tells the truth, and some black people don't want to hear the truth. And he DID have to experience racism, because he's old enough to know what it's like.

    As long as you, and any other black person, keep seperating yourself out from the rest of America, you'll never come to realize what's really going on. If you keep saying, "well I'm black, so I couldn't understand such-and-such, and you're such-and-such, so you'll never understand anything about being black," you will prove yourself correct because you never will understand anything else. As long as black people keep seperating themselves out of the rest of American culture, they have no reason to wonder why they are not a main part of American culture anymore. You're not being alienated, nobody is being racist against black people, black people are alienating the rest of society and pushing themselves further and further from reality.

  2. #182

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasquatch
    "The slavery has left us to play catch up and we're just not there"? You've had a hundred and fifty years, and you're not caught up yet? You've had forty years since the Civil Rights movement, and you're still "just not there"?
    Although, i see you point, and yes, we have made alot of progress, no we are not fully there yet. I never said we arent getting there though.

    [q=Sasquatch]
    You have a negative opinion of America--perhaps not overall, but on this certain subject--because you don't believe black people are given equal opportunities. You believe black people should be given opportunities, even though you fail to realize that this is already happening. And you believe that the opportunities black people (or any other minorities) get through AA come at the expense of white people. Affirmative Action is a program that takes things away from one race of people to give to another race of people, simply because they belong to those races. Now, you're telling me that those aren't racist beliefs?
    [/q]

    Yes, i do have a negative opinion of america on this subject but, i dont believe we should be given anything. Its like, i just want things to be fair, and i think your definition of fair and mine are just different.



    [q=Sasquatch]
    There are all kinds of people who expect things given to them, but you would be hard pressed to find a white person that expects things to be given to him simply because he's white. Not so with black people.
    [/q]

    True enough.

    [q=Sasquatch]
    Why? Because they can, and they know people will pay attention. It's been shown time and time again, when somebody cries "racism", the entire country pays attention to them. How do you think Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton made names for themselves? They pale in comparison to Rev. Martin Luther King.
    [/q]

    Well, I dont think i quite know what to say on this one.


    [q=Sasquatch]
    And how many "hard working black people" say they're still being discriminated against? Look at Bill Cosby. He says the same kinds of things I'm saying, and the last time I saw him, he was black. A lot of black people love him because he tells the truth, and a lot of black people hate him because, well, he tells the truth, and some black people don't want to hear the truth. And he DID have to experience racism, because he's old enough to know what it's like.
    [/q]

    Yeah, But Bill Cosby would never say that Racism isnt still here. As for some blacks hating him, some blacks loving him, well thats just how it is sometimes. Believe it or not, not everyone believed in what MLK Jr. was saying when he was still alive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasquatch
    As long as you, and any other black person, keep seperating yourself out from the rest of America, you'll never come to realize what's really going on. If you keep saying, "well I'm black, so I couldn't understand such-and-such, and you're such-and-such, so you'll never understand anything about being black," you will prove yourself correct because you never will understand anything else. As long as black people keep seperating themselves out of the rest of American culture, they have no reason to wonder why they are not a main part of American culture anymore. You're not being alienated, nobody is being racist against black people, black people are alienating the rest of society and pushing themselves further and further from reality.
    You had me with you on this one, up until the the last sentence. There are still people who are racist towars black people, Just not everybody(which is what i always said). But, i do agree on the alienating part. Its like, before i started working at Amtrak, i never was really exposed to living/schooling/working with anyone but other black people. And when i did see white people( which was almost never), i guess there was a kind of fear/anxiety. Its like, your thinking that someone else is thinking something about you even though they are probably not giving a damn about you. Problem with living in all black communities is that you dont get a chance to be around anyone other than the people who look just like you. And i think thats a big problem for black people. Specially when we gotta come out and learn to work in a society dominated by white people.

  3. #183
    Banned Sasquatch's Avatar
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    "Its like, i just want things to be fair, and i think your definition of fair and mine are just different."

    I want things to be fair too, most of America does, but my definition of "fair" is that everybody gets the same opportunities. The problem I have with programs like Affirmative Action is that they're not providing opportunities for anybody, they're forcing organizations and society to give things to people of certain races solely because they're of that certain race. I would have absolutely no problem with--in fact, I would welcome--an organization that double-checked applications, and made sure that the best qualified person got the job, scholarship, etc. no matter what color they were, and if they found that a person didn't get whatever it was that they were trying to get, and they were the best qualified candidate, dealt with it appropriately. But I maintain that quotas are not only not the solution, but part of the problem, and a step backwards. Quotas and "bonus points" only build resentment from white people, because it ends up where people wonder "was he really the best person to get that, or did he only get it because he was black"? And the legitimacy of qualified black people will have been tarnished by those unqualified black people that demand to be given things because they're black.

    "Yeah, But Bill Cosby would never say that Racism isnt still here. As for some blacks hating him, some blacks loving him, well thats just how it is sometimes. Believe it or not, not everyone believed in what MLK Jr. was saying when he was still alive."

    I haven't heard Bill Cosby claim that America is still racist, but I have heard him say that black people are only keeping themselves down. And most black people did believe in what Martin Luther King, Jr. was saying, and most of the black people that didn't agree with him didn't support equality, they supported an overthrow--for example, people like the Black Panthers, who believed that equality wasn't enough, and America had to redeem itself for its past transgressions against black people.

    "You had me with you on this one, up until the the last sentence. There are still people who are racist towars black people, Just not everybody(which is what i always said). But, i do agree on the alienating part."

    Forgive me, I misspoke when I said "nobody is racist against black people". We've both agreed that there are still racist white people, and I would expect that there always will be. But you understood the point I was trying to get across. Another example...In Atlanta, some black people were offended that a lot of the inner-city schools are almost all black, whereas a lot of the suburban schools are mostly white. Until it was looked into, and they found out that many black people switch schools so that they could be in that school with mostly black peers. It wasn't that the state government was setting school districts up so that blacks would all be in one school and whites in another, the districts were established and people moved into and out of each district. (By the way, educational funds are provided by the government based upon the numbers of students, not the location of the school or racial percentages.)

    (EDIT: Wow, I think we actually agreed on quite a bit, there. )

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