A proposal for the abortion debate

[YukiKiro]

in today's society i believe you are correct. i believe though that abortion is completely wrong, simply because a woman has control of her life, but she shopuldn't readily have control to take her child's life. we look at mothers out there who kill their children after they've been born, and we look at them and ask 'how can they do that?', abortion is still taking a life in the exact same respect, except its legal and the child hasn't left the womb (partial birth abortion is different, don't get me started on technicalities). but to "control" the situation, as one might put it, making birth control and other methods of keeping women from getting pregnant should be initiated.

[Sphere]

I will add my oppinionated input:

I am pro-abortion in the correct circumstances.

If a teenager was to fall pregnant, they would not be able to understand the responsibilities of parenthood, and they would not know how to react accordingly to certain situations.

Economically, and emotionally, they would not be prepared.
To be able to provide a safe, steady family, one requires a basic level of income, and independence. The child would be brought up poorly, resulting in an unfulfilled lifestyle, leading the child to be permanently disrupted.

There is also the possibility, that the parent would rely on her/his parents for income and shelter, resulting in the parents suffering economically, and having to put aside extra time to be able to raise that child.

Life is cruel, that is definate, and will never change. Humans will never learn, mistakes will be made, and people will suffer.

[lordblazer]

Sexual education in America (most of it, at least)... "Don't have sex". I'm not kidding.

This is no joke... Hell, I didn't even get "sex education" until my sophomore year in highschool, it lasted less than a week, and all they did was tell me not to have sex. Ha... This countries education system is such a joke.

To me it felt like they were almost making us want to have sex more because they're treating it like this obscuere taboo thing that you can't do for some unknown reason...like a taunting almost.

I agree though, if we worked together we could accomplish alot more, but it seems the bulk of America (I dunno about the rest of the world) just wants to stand on one side yelling "PRO-LIFE" or "PRO-CHOICE"....so eh.

In 8th grade in my health class our coach(health teacher & yeah coach of the hockey and baseball team)Tried to scare us into not having sex by naming every single STD that is in existence and what it does and how its treated our found out.lol.Man if i ever have sex I'm putting on three condoms just to be safe.(yeah still a virgin don't plan to do it until i get married).

[Cloud No.9]

do remember to keep a sense of proportion when talking about holland. remember only amsterdam allows prostitution and cannabis. it is not the same for all of holland. people tend to take the view that holland is some liberal haven. people see amsterdam as the whole of holland however there are alot of right wing christains outside amsterdam who totally disagree with the running of amsterdam.

this creates a problem with surverying things like this. as amsterdam could have a really high teen preg rate but this would be hidden by the rest of holland's low preg rate.

[Gibsie]

Except I'm talking about the country's attitude to sex between agreeable partners, not drugs or prostitution.

[Cloud No.9]

sorry i didn't make myself as clear as i possibly should.

holland's liberalism really only exists in the way people think it does within amsterdam.

[Gibsie]

Okay, bit of a side-issue, but fair enough then

[Teek]

Sure, that would work, on one point. Make abortion legal.

In a free society, the Christian, militant right can do what they wish after the baby is born. I find it humorous that the same group who advocates no abortion (under the ridiculous concept that a fetus is the same as a walking adult) also are against sex-ed. Conservatives have a problem with evasion.

Someone advocated personal responsibilty. I agree. Don't let the state make decisions for men (or women, in this case) that the people are capable to make for themselves.

[DarkLadyNyara]

forgive my ignorance but what is norplant?

It's a form of long-term birth control. 6 capsules are inserted in the arm, and can be left in for about 5 years.

and can i just ask what is wrong with school sex ed being "sex is wrong". what else do you want to teach 13 year olds? "sex is cool go out and do it but do it safely" yeah cos that would bring down teenage pregnancy levels awfully quick.........

How about "sex isn't something you should do until you are emotionally ready, and if you do decide to have sex, take care of yourself and use a condom. :rolleyes2 California started teaching about contraceptives, ect. and our teen pregnancy rate is dropping faster than the national one. BTW, I was refering to high school sex ed.

[Cloud No.9]

emotionaly ready? are kids going to ask themselves that? are they not just going to think they are if they do? stop it if they don't?

and why still force something? people here would be shcoked if i was to start advocating the removal of hands from thieves. but to leave someone infertile for 5 years is a good thing?

[Sasquatch]

I see no problem with an abstainence-based sex-ed program. Everything I've been through has told me the only way to keep from pregnancy or STDs is lack or sexual contact--which is obviously true--but that there are other ways to avoid pregnancy, different contraceptives, that are mostly effective. I've yet to be through any class that says "don't have sex" and nothing else.

And there are plenty of places a person can go to get free condoms. Most sex-ed classes I've been through have pointed out these places.

[Gibsie]

No-one is complaining about programs that inform their students yet still point to the obvious benefits of abstinence.

[Sasquatch]

No-one is complaining about programs that inform their students yet still point to the obvious benefits of abstinence.

I realize that, however, I've been through nine different schools in my life, and I have yet to come across a program that teaches abstainence and absolutely nothing else. Every program I've been through has pointed out different programs, organizations, alternatives, and contraceptives.

[DarkLadyNyara]

I realize that, however, I've been through nine different schools in my life, and I have yet to come across a program that teaches abstainence and absolutely nothing else. Every program I've been through has pointed out different programs, organizations, alternatives, and contraceptives.

I have. That's what they gave us in 9th grade.

emotionaly ready? are kids going to ask themselves that? are they not just going to think they are if they do? stop it if they don't?

They're more likely to listen to that than "Just Say No". Nothing is perfect. Deal. (Oh, and by the way, yes, some of us do ask ourselves that.)

[Ravenmorghane]

ok a few pointers here

1. abortions are for the majority carried out before the unborn baby is viable, this means that technically it is not alive and therefore the SURGEON (not doctor) who carries it out is killing nothing. DEAL WITH IT

2. people fall many pregnant for many reasons some of which were out of their control, should they have their freedom ripped from them for something that wasnt their fault in a world where justice is everything?

3. perhaps there should be more emphasis on teaching kids the way to have safe sex instead of poorly educating them and telling them not to do something they are going to do just because you told them not to.

4. regarding 'taking responsibility for your own actions' abortions are hardly pleasant experiences and ARE taking responisibility for your actions, its not as easy as walking into a clinic and having it amputated like a dying limb. It takes weeks of visiting clinics, checkups, scans and councilling and most likely you would have to travel a long way for these things, to major cities.

Abortion is the safest method of dealing with unwanted pregnancy for both mental and physical health of the unfortunate ladies who have dealt with it. Without legal abortions such women would have to refer back to before it was legalised and carry out completely unsafe home-jobs which mostly lead to infections and death.
And no, there should be NO paternal rights, I will be damned before some poor woman has to carry a baby against her will within legal rights.