You're Wrong!

[ThroneofDravaris]

Obviously, everyone has a reason why they dislike a certain FF game. Some of these opinions represent valid flaws within the game, others are stupid opinions by equally stupid people who have no clue what they are talking about (you know who you are…). So I thought it would be fun if I made a thread in which people simply post why they think an FF game was crap (or a specific section of a FF game that was poorly done), and everyone else replies with a reason as to why they are wrong. Be as ruthless as you feel is necessary as you tear apart their arguments. There is only one rule: The first time you reply, you must also share your own opinion on a section of an FF game you felt was sub-par. That way, no one will be safe.

*manic laughter*

When posting, state your reply to a person’s opinion first (only if you feel the need, you don’t have to reply to anyone if you feel they are correct/ everything has been said and done on that subject), followed by your own opinion on a crappy aspect of an FF game ( once again, you only need to state an opinion the first time you post). Be sure to start by labeling the FF game, so that people immediately know which game your talking about.

I’ll start by posting my opinion on the shortcomings of FF6.

FF6: Let me start by saying that I enjoyed this game a lot; each of the characters were unique, with there own individual battle commands. Unlike it predecessor, FF5, FF6 had an interesting plot line and an even better villain. However, when people state that FF6 had the best story line in the series, I am let rather puzzled as to how they were able to come up with this opinion. While good for its age, I feel that there were aspects to the plot that came up short, and were vastly improved upon in later FF games. I feel that too much emphasis was put on the humorous side of the story in this game, and mature themes that could have been elaborated on (Celes’ attempted suicide comes to mind) were left undeveloped, partly due to Nintendo’s ruthless censorship. In addition, while not including a clear protagonist was an interesting idea, I feel this caused the game to loose direction towards the end. This became especially evident halfway through the game, when you could continue the story without the PC’s that, up until this point in the game, were the closest thing the game had to ‘main characters’. Rewarding mini-games were almost non-existent in this game, which would later become an important aspect of an FF game. Almost as importantly, the optional ‘Uber’ bosses that appeared in FFV were no where to be found in this game, why they abandoned the idea for FF6 is beyond me.

Well, that’s my opinion; feel free to tear it apart. Let the fun begin!

[Primus Inter Pares]

Hehe, soooooo true!

*Puts on flame retardant suit and rallies behind ToD*

Final Fantasy 10:
Now before we start getting exited, I loved this game it's just that it could have been so much better and it does not rate in my top 5 FF games. The voice acting was terrible and the plot was very lacking, the characters were monotonous and frankly quite boring, with the little development occuring throughout the game. The normal plot line was without any real challenges (that is to say a blind two year old donkey could have completed it). Don't get me started on blitzball, good in theory just didn't work all that successfully in the game. Anything I missed? Of course there is I just don't want to turn this into a "I hate FF X" post so I'll leave it at that.

[Faith]

Final Fantasy 10:
Now before we start getting exited, I loved this game it's just that it could have been so much better and it does not rate in my top 5 FF games. The voice acting was terrible and the plot was very lacking, the characters were monotonous and frankly quite boring, with the little development occuring throughout the game. The normal plot line was without any real challenges (that is to say a blind two year old donkey could have completed it). Don't get me started on blitzball, good in theory just didn't work all that successfully in the game. Anything I missed? Of course there is I just don't want to turn this into a "I hate FF X" post so I'll leave it at that.

Well, I am a 3 year old Donkey so I wouldn't know. I do agree with you on the voice overs, they were VERY bad. Not so much the voice actors, but the way the dialogue was supposed to match the mouth movements. I did like the plot very much though

FF VIII:
Oh dear God. I would have rather sat in a sauna with 10 hairy, fat gay men then to have played this game. The characters seemed to be very emotional ALL of the time, and I had a very hard time keeping a general interest in the game. The plot was all over the place and had one of the worst endings to any game I have ever played. It was almost as bad as a high summoner becoming 'pop diva'.

[ThroneofDravaris]

Final Fantasy 10:
Now before we start getting exited, I loved this game it's just that it could have been so much better and it does not rate in my top 5 FF games. The voice acting was terrible and the plot was very lacking, the characters were monotonous and frankly quite boring, with the little development occuring throughout the game. The normal plot line was without any real challenges (that is to say a blind two year old donkey could have completed it). Don't get me started on blitzball, good in theory just didn't work all that successfully in the game. Anything I missed? Of course there is I just don't want to turn this into a "I hate FF X" post so I'll leave it at that.

Hmm, not all of the voice acting was bad in this game, I think it was really just Yuna. Auron was great, so was Seymour and Rikku. Some of the dialogue was pretty bad though, I think that you may be confusing the two. FFX was probably the first FF game where ALL of the characters were developed to some extent. Some characters, like Wakka, changed quite dramatically throughout the game. I would consider that the plot line was every bit as complex as previous FF games (the whole “Dream of the Fayth” thing confused the hell out of me the first time, almost as much as “Time Compression”). FFX was the first FF game that you couldn’t win purely with the attack command, due to the introduction of physical resistant fiends. I can also think of a few very challenging battle in this game, including Evrae and Seymour Flux. Overall, I would consider FFX one of the harder of the newer FF games. I agree with you with Blitzball though, one of the most boring mini-games ever!

FF VIII:
Oh dear God. I would have rather sat in a sauna with 10 hairy, fat gay men then to have played this game. The characters seemed to be very emotional ALL of the time, and I had a very hard time keeping a general interest in the game. The plot was all over the place and had one of the worst endings to any game I have ever played. It was almost as bad as a high summoner becoming 'pop diva'.

EDIT: Damn roman numerals! Sorry, I read it as FF7, but readiong it as FF8 just confuses me more. Squall was VERY emotionally inept for the most part of the game, and he doesn’t get much better towards the end. Once again, I would consider most of the characters outspoken rather than emotional, especially Zell and Selphie. As for the plot, while the focus changed constantly, it still continued in a rather linear fashion. I actually liked the added freedom on the world map. I have no idea what you are talking about with the ending. The ending in FF8, while confusing as all hell, is probably one of the most visually astounding endings in the entire series. Everything was resolved properly, what didn’t you like about it?

[thinking of names is hard]

FF VIII:
Oh dear God. I would have rather sat in a sauna with 10 hairy, fat gay men then to have played this game. The characters seemed to be very emotional ALL of the time, and I had a very hard time keeping a general interest in the game. The plot was all over the place and had one of the worst endings to any game I have ever played. It was almost as bad as a high summoner becoming 'pop diva'.

Actually, Cloud started the game about as emotionally inept as Squall. It wasn’t until the death of Aeris that he started to become more emotional. In general, I would say most of the characters were outspoken rather than emotional. There were quite a few plot twists in this game to keep people interested, not sure what you found so boring about it. As for the ending, I liked the way it sort of kept things up in the air. Obviously, due to the existence of Advent Children, we know everyone survived, but still.

I think Faith was referring to 8 and not 7?

As for the big argument that the voice acting was terrible in 10... what can i say... i found it surprising. I thought they were brilliant. Some of the dialogue was a bit crap but i never notived it while playing the game. You probably noticed it more because of the voice overs-and it wasnt just writing strolloing across the screen.
I thought the storyline was good too. If you was playing games in the genre of shooting (time splitters) would you question the storyline of that? Just because it didnt have a good storyline (or none at all) doesnt mean it was a bad game.
I know its final fantasy, and storylines are a big part of it, but i think that there is nothing to complain about.

So anyway... I like all the games but i thought that the characers in ffix was lacking in some parts. I didnt really gat into the game like other final fantasies. Normally, characters have features that i associate with them. But in ffix, i seriously cannot describe any of their characteristics. They seemed bland to me....All i remmember is that Eiko was a brat and Quina liked food...and...erm...thats it.Gameplay was great-storyline was too, but the characters...

Oh dear God. I would have rather sat in a sauna with 10 hairy, fat gay men

Me too....but i loved the game.

[ThroneofDravaris]

I think Faith was referring to 8 and not 7?

Hehe, fixed it.

So anyway... I like all the games but i thought that the characers in ffix was lacking in some parts. I didnt really gat into the game like other final fantasies. Normally, characters have features that i associate with them. But in ffix, i seriously cannot describe any of their characteristics. They seemed bland to me....All i remmember is that Eiko was a brat and Quina liked food...and...erm...thats it.Gameplay was great-storyline was too, but the characters...

Hehe, I’m kind of surprised that you can find features of characters in ANY FF game that can be related to oneself. I think in FF9, they tried to make the characters as stereotypical as possible, as to be reminiscent of the classical FF games. Steiner is a dedicated knight, Garnet is a selfless Princess with an high-class education, Quina is…well…Quina. While Zidane proved to be very happy-go-lucky, he seriously begins to question who he is later in the game, which adds a certain degree of depth to the characters. Vivi is probably one of the most complex and tragic characters in the series (well, depending on whether you believe he dies in the end). But most importantly, FF9’s antagonist, Kuja, was one of the best developed characters out there. You both hate him and pity him at the same time. While the game had some 2D characters like Amarant and Quina ( but then, did Quina really need development?), I think these characters are outweighed by the more complex ones.

[Alexander]

Quina do not need development to be the best FF character ever.

And my complains about FFVIII.

The storyline. Full of plotholes, sometimes even seriously lacking (why does Ultimecia want to compress time, after all? x.x), and sometimes forced. Like... the Trabia Garden event. And th whole Squall/Rinoa thing. From nothing Squall loved Rinoa. This is sick.
The battles. Junction was bizzarre. Easy to catch, but bizzarre. No MP or equipment is very strange, as well.

How the hell do you junction magic to your, let's say, vitality? How can a "stock" of Blizzagas make you more resistant to physical attacks?And how do you junction a guardian force to yourself? (Okay, ability system is a little strange as well, but it makes a little sense)

And stocking/drawing. Magic is an essence, an energy. Magic is not a material thing. FFVIII made magic seem material. Like...

Son: Daddy, daddy! Did you see that? Now Bite Bug has Firaga! I want some! Please please please!
Daddy: Okay. *junctioning GF... somehow*
Son: YAY! ^_^

And the junction system, and the GF commands made the use of magic in battle very useless. The only ones I use is Regen and Aura. Not even Meltdown, because you can have Doomtrain.

And about the characters. They focused WAY TOO MUCH in Squall, Rinoa, Edea and Laguna. The others are sitting in the dark, watching. Much like Digimon Frontier, in the end. And Digimon Frontier stinks. So this is not a good analogy. >_<

[DJZen]

No, you're ALL wrong. Top THAT!

P.S.

I would have rather sat in a sauna with 10 hairy, fat gay men

Really? Because that can be arranged.

[Captain Maxx Power]

I like FF2. It's the best FF ever. Am I still in the wrong catagory?

[ThroneofDravaris]

No, you're ALL wrong. Top THAT!

I like FF2. It's the best FF ever. Am I still in the wrong catagory?

You…didn’t read my post…did you?

The storyline. Full of plotholes, sometimes even seriously lacking (why does Ultimecia want to compress time, after all? x.x), and sometimes forced. Like... the Trabia Garden event. And th whole Squall/Rinoa thing. From nothing Squall loved Rinoa. This is sick.

I really didn’t find any more plot holes in FF8’s story than in any other FF game. I think the big thing though is that no one (including myself) really understands Time compression. Ultimecia wanted to achieve it because apparently, she would be the only one that existed after it’s completion. I would say this means that she would become “everything” (and succeeded) , but then that’s just my theory. Squall didn’t love Rinoa for nothing, if it was in fact love that he felt for her. There was no less reason for Squall to love Rinoa than for say, Zidane to love Garnet. It’s just one of those things that can’t really be explained. If your question is ‘why would anyone love someone like Rinoa?”, then I guess that’s just a matter of taste really. I liked her personality, and apparently, so did Squall. If it’s the odd transition between Squall’s indifference and love for Rinoa, then it’s really best explained as one of those “Don’t know what you’ve got till it’s gone” situations.

The battles. Junction was bizzarre. Easy to catch, but bizzarre. No MP or equipment is very strange, as well. How the hell do you junction magic to your, let's say, vitality? How can a "stock" of Blizzagas make you more resistant to physical attacks?And how do you junction a guardian force to yourself? (Okay, ability system is a little strange as well, but it makes a little sense)

FF8 had an entirely different theory on the nature of magic compared to the other FF games. Since magic doesn’t really exist (well, some may think so, but let’s just work on logic for now), it’s really hard to say that it couldn’t be stocked and exhausted in manner it is in FF8. It makes just as much sense as drawing magic from ones own body (ie, MP). The idea behind the Junctioning system makes perfect sense ( one again, I mean it’s just as logical as anything else magical). Basically, Magic is used to enhance either your mental condition (in the case of magic based stats) and physical attributes ( strength, HP, vitality etc.). Not sure what the problem is wioth this theory really…

GF’s function like a symbiotic organism that uses the person that junctions it as a “host”. This theory is used quite a lot in Sci-fi shows/games, and the idea employed in FF8 is based on the Espers in FF6. Once again, I’m not sure what you don’t get about this.

And stocking/drawing. Magic is an essence, an energy. Magic is not a material thing. FFVIII made magic seem material. Like...

Err… ok. Let’s not try to define something that doesn’t exist in the real world. Magic could just as easily be separated into different types as opposed to being seen as “pure energy that is manipulated by the caster”. You can’t really say one way or another…

And the junction system, and the GF commands made the use of magic in battle very useless. The only ones I use is Regen and Aura. Not even Meltdown, because you can have Doomtrain.

Just because you don’t use it doesn’t mean it’s not useful. The idea was to use magic to enhance your limit break power, not to be used in its pure form. At least magic till plays a part in this game all the way through, unlike games such as FFX, where max strength and auto-abilities made magic truly useless. As you said, you still used a little magic towards the end of the game, this is the same for most FF games; most magic becomes redundant by the introduction of more powerful spells. And it’s a lot easier to simply use a meltdown than it is to summon Doomtrain…

And about the characters. They focused WAY TOO MUCH in Squall, Rinoa, Edea and Laguna. The others are sitting in the dark, watching. Much like Digimon Frontier, in the end. And Digimon Frontier stinks. So this is not a good analogy.

Hmmm, not sure what’s so surprising about this. Pretty much all FF games (save FFX) tend to ditch the development of the supporting characters in favour of the protagonists. Not sure what Edea is doing in that list though, she wasn’t really that important after the second disk…

As far as minor characters go, the characters in FF8 (due to there only being 6 PC’s, one of my only complaints with the game) actually got more screen time on average than other characters in the series. I could give you a whole list of characters no-one knows anything about…

[Alexander]

I really didn’t find any more plot holes in FF8’s story than in any other FF game. I think the big thing though is that no one (including myself) really understands Time compression. Ultimecia wanted to achieve it because apparently, she would be the only one that existed after it’s completion. I would say this means that she would become “everything” (and succeeded) , but then that’s just my theory. Squall didn’t love Rinoa for nothing, if it was in fact love that he felt for her. There was no less reason for Squall to love Rinoa than for say, Zidane to love Garnet. It’s just one of those things that can’t really be explained. If your question is ‘why would anyone love someone like Rinoa?”, then I guess that’s just a matter of taste really. I liked her personality, and apparently, so did Squall. If it’s the odd transition between Squall’s indifference and love for Rinoa, then it’s really best explained as one of those “Don’t know what you’ve got till it’s gone” situations.

Why the hell would she want to compress time? She could destroy herself doing that you know. That's the thing. And Ultimecia has No background. We have theories. ONLY THEORIES. She is one big plothole.
And most FFs don't have so many plotholes like FFVIII.
And Squall starts to love Rinoa with no true reason. And this isn't truly explained in the game. Zidane and Garnet love each other since the beginning, and it is pretty clear to understand. Even if you don't Eiko makes a good explanation of that to Vivi.

FF8 had an entirely different theory on the nature of magic compared to the other FF games. Since magic doesn’t really exist (well, some may think so, but let’s just work on logic for now), it’s really hard to say that it couldn’t be stocked and exhausted in manner it is in FF8. It makes just as much sense as drawing magic from ones own body (ie, MP). The idea behind the Junctioning system makes perfect sense ( one again, I mean it’s just as logical as anything else magical). Basically, Magic is used to enhance either your mental condition (in the case of magic based stats) and physical attributes ( strength, HP, vitality etc.). Not sure what the problem is wioth this theory really…

GF’s function like a symbiotic organism that uses the person that junctions it as a “host”. This theory is used quite a lot in Sci-fi shows/games, and the idea employed in FF8 is based on the Espers in FF6. Once again, I’m not sure what you don’t get about this.

The problem, again, is the material thing. Magic is an energy. It may not exist in the real world, but in games, it is raw spirit energy. A power that can make miracles. FFVIII ruined that. If it was by scrolls and books, like it was (implicit) in the old-school FFs. They used their power to use the magic contained in those scrolls. But FFVIII doesn't give any deep explanation about magic.

And Espers are explained in FFVI. Magicite, remeber? They learn Magic and summon Espers using Magicite. The power contained in the Magicite. Espers make sense. Since Guardian Forces don't have a good explanation of what they are, they don't make much of a sense.

Err… ok. Let’s not try to define something that doesn’t exist in the real world. Magic could just as easily be separated into different types as opposed to being seen as “pure energy that is manipulated by the caster”. You can’t really say one way or another…

I at least can't see magic by a material thing you can refine from items. That is just idiot and bizzarre. o_o

Just because you don’t use it doesn’t mean it’s not useful. The idea was to use magic to enhance your limit break power, not to be used in its pure form. At least magic till plays a part in this game all the way through, unlike games such as FFX, where max strength and auto-abilities made magic truly useless. As you said, you still used a little magic towards the end of the game, this is the same for most FF games; most magic becomes redundant by the introduction of more powerful spells. And it’s a lot easier to simply use a meltdown than it is to summon Doomtrain…

Magic, used in battle, is useless. I haven't talked ANYTHING about its another usefulnesses. As you said, magic enhance your stats and limit breaks. This ruined FFVIII to me. Limit Breaks are too overpowered, and they don't make sense as well (Hey! I'm almost dead! But because of some idiot reason I can do 9999 damage 16 times against an enemy now! Hoo-ray!).
And in FFVIII, magic is obsolete in battle since the beginning. There's not much of a point on using Fire on an enemy when you could just equip it to your physical attack and atttack with Fire not using a single magic from the stock.
And Meltdown causes some non-elemental damage and Vit 0. Doomtrain causes good Poison Damage, and an load of status ailments. So, it is much better to use Doomtrain. Plus, you don't need to restock Doomtrain after some uses. And using Doomtrain do not affect your stats, if Meltdown is junctioned.

Hmmm, not sure what’s so surprising about this. Pretty much all FF games (save FFX) tend to ditch the development of the supporting characters in favour of the protagonists. Not sure what Edea is doing in that list though, she wasn’t really that important after the second disk…

As far as minor characters go, the characters in FF8 (due to there only being 6 PC’s, one of my only complaints with the game) actually got more screen time on average than other characters in the series. I could give you a whole list of characters no-one knows anything about…

Save FFX? Wtf are you talking about? They sometimes even ditch Tidus, in favor of Yuna!
And Edea was very important in the two first discs. They ditched Seifer (not like someone would miss him *shot*) in favor of her, when he is just as bad good as Edea.

And Quistis, Zell, Irvine and Selphie only had more "screen time" than other characters in other FFs because there are only 6 PCs, as you said. But FFIX has 8 PCs and Eiko, Vivi, Steiner and maybe Quina have much, much more screen time than anyone from FFVIII. And that's because some people say that FFIX is shorter!
And this "whole list" would have too many people from FFVI, if you're talking about PCs.

[Lilian]

I don't really see how the battle system of FF8 makes any more or less sense than that of the other FFs. True, it doesn't make any sense to be near-dead and suddenly able to unleash a super-powerful attack, but it doesn't make any sense to be hit 2347293472983 times by the enemy and suddenly unable to unleash a super-powerful attack, either. And I can understand how the typical MP magic system works--MP is your source of magical energy, or something along those lines, and it drains as you perform more spells--but then how is it that you're totally drained and all you have to do is toss an Ether in the air and you're replenished? Not to mention that in battle, characters get hit a million times and don't fall--and when they do, you can just use a Phoenix Down and revive them. But in the story line, all it takes is one good hit from a sword and they're dead for good. None of the battle systems make any sense, when you think about it.

Anyway...I'm supposed to post about some aspect of FF I think is crappy, aren't I? Okay, let's see...

FFX: IMO, it just didn't live up to the legacy of the other games at all. There's plenty of reasons it's my least favorite in the series, some of which have already been mentioned (although I don't think the voice acting was all that bad, aside from Tidus and Yuna). The story's not bad; I could have gotten into it, except for my constant desire to strangle the two main characters (Tidus and Yuna). But the thing that really irritates me is the gameplay. Who came UP with these minigames, anyway? Not just blitzball, but dodging lightning strikes, the butterfly game, and the hideously frustrating chocobo racing...and if you want to get the ultimate weapons, you HAVE to play them. I don't care if it'll make Tidus cause more than 9999 damage, it's just not worth it to sit there and play a minigame that makes me want to throw my controller against the wall in frustration.

I could go on, but I'll stop for now. Hopefully all that made sense. I'm sleep deprived. o_o

So, there's my complaint. Have at it, guys.

[ThroneofDravaris]

Why the hell would she want to compress time? She could destroy herself doing that you know. That's the thing. And Ultimecia has No background. We have theories. ONLY THEORIES. She is one big plothole.
And most FFs don't have so many plotholes like FFVIII.
And Squall starts to love Rinoa with no true reason. And this isn't truly explained in the game. Zidane and Garnet love each other since the beginning, and it is pretty clear to understand. Even if you don't Eiko makes a good explanation of that to Vivi.

Hehe, I think we should assume that Ultimecia knew that she wasn’t going to be consumed as well during Time Compression. As I said, my theory is that Time Compression would make Ultimecia everything, everywhere, at every time. Basically, she would have become the Universe…if that makes sense…meh, it makes sense to me (must have made sense to Primus Inter Pares as well, since it’s a derivative of one of his theories…). Ultimecia is not the only FF antagonist we know nothing about. Chaos, Zeomus, X-Death, Necron; nothing much is known about any of these guys. The thing is, all of these games had supplementary antagonists that were developed to a greater extent. For FF8, it was Seifer, more on that later. Really, if you don’t count Time Compression, there aren’t many plot holes in this game, and those that exist are rather easy to fill in (ie, Squall’s father being Laguna). As for love in this game, I think you will have a hard time proving that there was any more reason for Zidane to love garnet than for Squall to love Rinoa. It was hinted at THE ENTIRE way through the game, it was fairly obvious that this was the direction the story was going to take. The only complication was Quistis who loved Squall as well, yet decided tha tit wasn’t truly love later in the game (yes, a bit weak, but what do you want?).

The problem, again, is the material thing. Magic is an energy. It may not exist in the real world, but in games, it is raw spirit energy. A power that can make miracles. FFVIII ruined that. If it was by scrolls and books, like it was (implicit) in the old-school FFs. They used their power to use the magic contained in those scrolls. But FFVIII doesn't give any deep explanation about magic.

Once again, Magic is still an energy in FF8, it’s just been put into different categories. I really don’t see who magic was explained any less clearly in FF8, where in past FF games it was something you could simply BUY FROM SHOPS! And FFIX didn’t exactly have a clear explanation of magic either, it was something you learned from…a stick. Hmmm…So far the best explanation of magic has been in FF6, and that was merely “we get it from magical creatures.”

And Espers are explained in FFVI. Magicite, remeber? They learn Magic and summon Espers using Magicite. The power contained in the Magicite. Espers make sense. Since Guardian Forces don't have a good explanation of what they are, they don't make much of a sense.

In FF6, Espers were magical beings from another dimension. In FF8, GF’s are basically just monsters that can be Junctioned to a human. Unclear? Well yes, but it wouldn’t be the first time that summons weren’t explained (ie all except FF6 and FF10).Really, it’s basically the same deal, it’s just that there is no Magicite that links the human to the summon.

I at least can't see magic by a material thing you can refine from items. That is just idiot and bizzarre. o_o

Err, you mean like Magicite/Materia/Staffs in FFIX? It’s not really a new concept….

Magic, used in battle, is useless. I haven't talked ANYTHING about its another usefulnesses. As you said, magic enhance your stats and limit breaks. This ruined FFVIII to me. Limit Breaks are too overpowered, and they don't make sense as well (Hey! I'm almost dead! But because of some idiot reason I can do 9999 damage 16 times against an enemy now! Hoo-ray!).

The limit break system was based on the same system seen in FF6, ie near death attacks. Really, it’s the same as the system used in FF7 and FFX, you still get the limits from taking damage. The only difference is that you use it straight away, you can’t store it. Meh, sure you could technically pull of a limit break as every attack you every make in this game, but then the bosses were made harder later in the game to compensate ( I’d like to see anyone beat Omega with the attack command!)

Save FFX? Wtf are you talking about? They sometimes even ditch Tidus, in favor of Yuna!
And Edea was very important in the two first discs. They ditched Seifer (not like someone would miss him *shot*) in favor of her, when he is just as bad good as Edea.

In general, I would say that FFX had the most developed supporting characters, they all had their own, rather complex story (I mean come on, it turns out Auron was DEAD). I wouldn’t say that they ditched Seifer in favour of Edea. He maintained his relevance to the plot right up until the end of disk 3 (which, in all actuality, was just before the final dungeon) Regarding Seifer, his purpose is similar to Kuja in FFIX (God, I’ll get flamed for that one). He basically gives you someone to hate for the most part of the game, while the main antagonist stays in hiding until the final battle.

And Quistis, Zell, Irvine and Selphie only had more "screen time" than other characters in other FFs because there are only 6 PCs, as you said. But FFIX has 8 PCs and Eiko, Vivi, Steiner and maybe Quina have much, much more screen time than anyone from FFVIII. And that's because some people say that FFIX is shorter!
And this "whole list" would have too many people from FFVI, if you're talking about PCs.

I don’t really remember any of the characters in FF9 getting any more development than those in FF8. I think this is probably a question of personal perception. Eiko and Amarant don’t really enter the story until halfway through the second disk (and you don’t need to get Quina until the beginning of the second as well), while you get of the characters in FF8 by about three quarters of the way through the first. Plus, you had a shot at controlling Seifer in the beginning as well. As for the list, I would say most of them come from I-V rather than 6…

Hehe, it’s nice to see that people have actually replied to this thread ( I was a bit worried when it passed the 24 hour mark with only one reply…). It would be nice to see some people bash the earlier FF games though, that’s always fun, and not easy to defend either….

[Alexander]

Hehe, I think we should assume that Ultimecia knew that she wasn’t going to be consumed as well during Time Compression. As I said, my theory is that Time Compression would make Ultimecia everything, everywhere, at every time. Basically, she would have become the Universe…if that makes sense…meh, it makes sense to me (must have made sense to Primus Inter Pares as well, since it’s a derivative of one of his theories…). Ultimecia is not the only FF antagonist we know nothing about. Chaos, Zeomus, X-Death, Necron; nothing much is known about any of these guys. The thing is, all of these games had supplementary antagonists that were developed to a greater extent. For FF8, it was Seifer, more on that later. Really, if you don’t count Time Compression, there aren’t many plot holes in this game, and those that exist are rather easy to fill in (ie, Squall’s father being Laguna). As for love in this game, I think you will have a hard time proving that there was any more reason for Zidane to love garnet than for Squall to love Rinoa. It was hinted at THE ENTIRE way through the game, it was fairly obvious that this was the direction the story was going to take. The only complication was Quistis who loved Squall as well, yet decided tha tit wasn’t truly love later in the game (yes, a bit weak, but what do you want?).

Yeah, this theory makes sense. But as I said, this is a theory. >_<
About the other villains...
Chaos is garland, IIRC.
Zeromus is Zemus, all of that Lunarian thing, KluYa had two sons, he died, one was controlled for Zemus, yadda yadda yadda... o.o' He is one big mystery, but at least he has a somewhat clear mission.
And about Ex-Death and Necron. Yup, I agree with you. I was -oh so disappointed- when Necron appeared. >_< And Ex-Death is... the villain. Simple like that. No true reason to be the villain. XD

Once again, Magic is still an energy in FF8, it’s just been put into different categories. I really don’t see who magic was explained any less clearly in FF8, where in past FF games it was something you could simply BUY FROM SHOPS! And FFIX didn’t exactly have a clear explanation of magic either, it was something you learned from…a stick. Hmmm…So far the best explanation of magic has been in FF6, and that was merely “we get it from magical creatures.”

I said before that FFI/II/III/V, where you buy magic, that was somewhat implicit they buy scrolls/books/WHATEVER from the shops and chant the spell contained in it. Like Fire Emblem. o_o And I said above that ability system don't make much of a sense as well, but Vivi could learn new magics cointaned in staves. It isn't that bad to me. o.o'
And yeah, magic isn't explained in much games... I forgot XD You got a point.

In FF6, Espers were magical beings from another dimension. In FF8, GF’s are basically just monsters that can be Junctioned to a human. Unclear? Well yes, but it wouldn’t be the first time that summons weren’t explained (ie all except FF6 and FF10).Really, it’s basically the same deal, it’s just that there is no Magicite that links the human to the summon.

Okay, wait.
FFIII don't have ANY explanation about Summons. Oh hell you can buy them! >_< As for FFV.
FFIV, with the Land of Summoned Monsters, does a very very very bried explanation about them. o.o
FFVII doesn't have explanations to them either, they were Materia as anything else... XP
And FFIX? Did you forget FFIX? FFIX has a lot of its history based on the Eidolons! Eidolon Wall in Disc 4 explain A LOT about them! It is SO UNFAIR to exclude them! T_T
And... o_O I can't understand what GFs are. If they are scientifically made, creatures from the past, etc. It is too unclear... They tried to explain (by saying they erase your memories -___-) and they complicated it all. Well, it's just me, I think;

Err, you mean like Magicite/Materia/Staffs in FFIX? It’s not really a new concept….

No, no. I mean...
Magicite is material. Magic itself is not.
Materia is material (duh!). Magic itself is not.
Staves are material, as well (duh). Magic itself is not.
Magic itself IS material in FF8 (or it seems to be). @_@

The limit break system was based on the same system seen in FF6, ie near death attacks. Really, it’s the same as the system used in FF7 and FFX, you still get the limits from taking damage. The only difference is that you use it straight away, you can’t store it. Meh, sure you could technically pull of a limit break as every attack you every make in this game, but then the bosses were made harder later in the game to compensate ( I’d like to see anyone beat Omega with the attack command!)

I know. But you couldn't truly abuse Limit Breaks, Overdrive, etc.
You cant abuse FFVI's Desperation Attacks, either. They randomly happen when you have 1/32 of your HP or less. I can't abuse it. o_O
With Aura and such, you can abuse Limit Breaks in FFVIII. I don't like it thatmuch, since the only Limit Breaks that you can abuse without being ovrpowered are Quistis' (Blue Magic) and Irvine (sure, Pulse Ammo, but it is SLOOOOW and rare).
And no boss is THAT harder to make you use offensive Magic/ offensive GFs/etc. Later in the game you can beat pretty much anything, with the right Junctions and Aura... o.o

In general, I would say that FFX had the most developed supporting characters, they all had their own, rather complex story (I mean come on, it turns out Auron was DEAD). I wouldn’t say that they ditched Seifer in favour of Edea. He maintained his relevance to the plot right up until the end of disk 3 (which, in all actuality, was just before the final dungeon) Regarding Seifer, his purpose is similar to Kuja in FFIX (God, I’ll get flamed for that one). He basically gives you someone to hate for the most part of the game, while the main antagonist stays in hiding until the final battle.

I won't flame you, but his purpose is NOT NEARLY THE SAME as Kuja... xD And he only got a good importance in Disc 3... ><

I don’t really remember any of the characters in FF9 getting any more development than those in FF8. I think this is probably a question of personal perception. Eiko and Amarant don’t really enter the story until halfway through the second disk (and you don’t need to get Quina until the beginning of the second as well), while you get of the characters in FF8 by about three quarters of the way through the first. Plus, you had a shot at controlling Seifer in the beginning as well. As for the list, I would say most of them come from I-V rather than 6…

Um... ehr... Vivi. o.o You control Beatrix, as well... o.o and Steiner changes a lot throughtout the game. In FFVIII, they are the same thing, since the beginning until the very end.
And, hey! It isn't fair to put PCs from FFI in that list! I mean, they don't even talk! XD

Hehe, it’s nice to see that people have actually replied to this thread ( I was a bit worried when it passed the 24 hour mark with only one reply…). It would be nice to see some people bash the earlier FF games though, that’s always fun, and not easy to defend either….

Yeah, I liked this too... someone defending the game without fanboyism \o/ And someone criticizing the game without "senseless bashing" \o\ I hope that other people do this, as well o.o
And... I want to watch this too XD FFVII fanboys saying "zOMG FFI SUX IT DUZN'T HAVE OMNISLASH" XDDDDD

[DJZen]

You're STILL all wrong.