Irish History, lies?!

[Destai]

Theyd "evolve" just as much if they joined the UK but thats certainly not a good idea. Not that Id support that idea or anything. I just dont think embracing heritage or the language has anything to do with making the country prosper. Heritage is nice but its not that big a deal in my opinion.

How do you propose that Irleand evolve if they don't embrace their heritage as a country? How can a country (or someone for that matter) evolve if they don't know, or don't accept their heritage? Makes no sense to me.

Evolve as a perosn? To say straight out what Im thinking what is this crap? Speaking Irish and knowing what Irish people did xxxx years ago doesnt feed people, or help people get a job (in most cases). The main point of heritage is to attract tourism so people can make money of it and then the country can prosper but theres other ways of prospering than that. Its not that important.

[Chris]

But it is, how do you expect Ireland to negotiate with other countries when they don't know who they are? Language doesn't make a person, true, but knowledge surely does.

[Destai]

But it is, how do you expect Ireland to negotiate with other countries when they don't know who they are? Language doesn't make a person, true, but knowledge surely does.

That didnt answer my question. What does "who they are" have to do with negotiating with other countries? Every country should strive for the well far of there people with medicine, food, education etc. What, is all that stuff useless if they dont know who they are inside? Heritage is over rated. Its been done. The past should be remembered and mistakes should be learnt from but the futures much more important.

[Chris]

I assume when people negotiate with other countries is because they are interested in what the other country has to offer. Ireland has already lost a great deal of their history to England and feuds that has been goin' on for so long. My point being, which countries will find Ireland interesting if Ireland themselves seems to have forgotten what they have to offer as a country?

[Destai]

I assume when people negotiate with other countries is because they are interested in what the other country has to offer. Ireland has already lost a great deal of their history to England and feuds that has been goin' on for so long. My point being, which countries will find Ireland interesting if Ireland themselves seems to have forgotten what they have to offer as a country?

Irelands resources and Irelands heritage are two different things.

[Chris]

Irelands resources and Irelands heritage are two different things.

Yes and no. When people negotiate they don't always negotiate for foods, or materials... they often negotiate for cultural and historical importances, but with Ireland being so scattered, they won't know what to negotiate with, when it comes to cultural or historical matters.

[Destai]

Irelands resources and Irelands heritage are two different things.

Yes and no. When people negotiate they don't always negotiate for foods, or materials... they often negotiate for cultural and historical importances, but with Ireland being so scattered, they won't know what to negotiate with, when it comes to cultural or historical matters.

To be more specific, are you talking about toirism? because you know,

The main point of heritage is to attract tourism so people can make money of it and then the country can prosper but theres other ways of prospering than that. Its not that important.

[Chris]

Irelands resources and Irelands heritage are two different things.

Yes and no. When people negotiate they don't always negotiate for foods, or materials... they often negotiate for cultural and historical importances, but with Ireland being so scattered, they won't know what to negotiate with, when it comes to cultural or historical matters.

To be more specific, are you talking about toirism? because you know,

The main point of heritage is to attract tourism so people can make money of it and then the country can prosper but theres other ways of prospering than that. Its not that important.

Tourisme is a good example of what I said.
Why people want to visit Ireland if Ireland itself has nothing to offer as a country? Regarding history, Ireland has had such a turmoil past, but by forgetting or refusing to learn Ireland's youth these things, they're putting themselves (and it's people) in a box that is limiting. Why wouldn't Ireland want to teach it's youth about the past and heritage? I still can't grasp.

[Destai]

Irelands resources and Irelands heritage are two different things.

Yes and no. When people negotiate they don't always negotiate for foods, or materials... they often negotiate for cultural and historical importances, but with Ireland being so scattered, they won't know what to negotiate with, when it comes to cultural or historical matters.

To be more specific, are you talking about toirism? because you know,

The main point of heritage is to attract tourism so people can make money of it and then the country can prosper but theres other ways of prospering than that. Its not that important.

Tourisme is a good example of what I said.
Why people want to visit Ireland if Ireland itself has nothing to offer as a country? Regarding history, Ireland has had such a turmoil past, but by forgetting or refusing to learn Ireland's youth these things, they're putting themselves (and it's people) in a box that is limiting. Why wouldn't Ireland want to teach it's youth about the past and heritage? I still can't grasp.

Now Ive believed since the start of this argument that history should be learned and stuff just for the sake of never forgetting whats come and gone butits this crap about embracing your heritage to evolve as a person that I dont get. It sounds like some new age bull to me.

[Chris]

Now Ive believed since the start of this argument that history should be learned and stuff just for the sake of never forgetting whats come and gone butits this crap about embracing your heritage to evolve as a person that I dont get. It sounds like some new age crap to me.

Hahahahaha, okay. Let's agree to disagree and let other people say what they think. Then we can take it up again, later.

[fire_of_avalon]

I agree with eest. And I'd like to keep the mean things being said to a minimum, please.

Additionally, while I don't feel it's necessary for a country as a whole to rely on an part of it's past to create it's future, I do believe it is important for people to understand why things are they way they are, and how to make them better. And I think understanding one's heritage helps immeasurably in that.

So I agree and disagree with everyone at the same time, basically.

[Cuchulainn]

Irish history is one of the more colourful & dramatic histories of any country. The fact that Ireland & the Irish are known & have influenced many other countries despite it's small size is testament to the Irish people.

There is no danger of Ireland forgetting it's past. Or of Ireland forgetting it's language (while it it is no longer widely spoken it is still known & in various volumes of books).

Ireland, to visit, is something to be remembered. You are walking in a land that has been active for thousands of years. The many many castles, forts, ancient dwellings, dolmens, buriel grounds, henges etc are testament to this. From the Celtic Invasion to the English Invasion & Scottish plantations to the many revolts & civil wars. From the famine to the massacres. From the peace to the division of the country. Ireland's history is simply too evokative to be forgotten so we can stop worrying about that.

As far as commerce & trade goes Ireland has little in the way of natural resources. Farming was the stable trade here & despite the Industrial Revolution in Belfast, no othjer part has been greatly affected by this. Belfast housed the worlds most important shipyard for a time at Harland & Wolf. Belfast had Linen Factories & Paper Mills aboud. Now, the Shipyard is virtually a quarter of it's original & deals mainlyt in repairs & Linen is only produced in small numbers.

It seems Ireland's biggest accievments in history have been what we gave other countries. Whether it be people, poetry or ships. It's time re gave ourselves something.

A United Ireland is something Catholics in the North want more than Catholics in the South. Mainly because in the south they have forgotten just what it was like being that they have been independant for over 70 years. In the South, bar a few Loyalist/British Army colludes Bombings it has remained free of the violence & the struggle. Freedom brings an apathy which caged peoples would die for. As witnessed by reading Destai's posts.

[Destai]

As witnessed by reading Destai's posts.

I know plenty of people on these boards who dont feel culture is important at all. I talked about it with Chris and argued my point of view and didnt feel enlightened. If you're that concerned take me up on the subject and talk to me about it rather than passing comments. Why shouldnt I believe that you've fooled yourself into thinking you've been denied some imaginary priviledge just because someones declared your living on english soil?