A problem with the R=U theory.

[Skyblade]

I was thinking through some of the game's dialogue, when all of a sudden I realized that some of it threw a real wrench in the works of the R=U theory. Specifically, the flashbacks dealing with Laguna and Edea. If you remember, it was stated that Esthar soldiers were looking for a "successor" to Adel. Now, if sorceresses can live indefinitely as long as they don't pass on their powers, which is something that the R=U theory seems to take for granted, why would Adel be looking for a successor? Adel doesn't strike me as the type to just hand her powers over to anyone and die unless she has no other choice. She's not much of a people person, and not much into sharing. If she could live forever, she would. The idea of her looking for a successor means that she is going to die, and she wants some say in what happens to her powers when she does. And if she was looking for a successor, the lifespan of a sorceress can't be too much longer than that of a normal person, since the successor would be dead long before Adel otherwise. Nothing else really makes sense.

[Mo-Nercy]

Adel would only be looking for a successor if she was expecting to die at some point. Obviously sorceresses don't live forever. But the R=U theory accepts the idea that sorceresses age differently than humans but don't necessarily live forever. It clutches at straws a bit because their only evidence is that Edea, Rinoa and Ultimecia look young for their age. Especially if you compare Cid to Edea. Assuming that their supposed to be more or less the same age, Cid does look a lot older.

[Skyblade]

Adel would only be looking for a successor if she was expecting to die at some point. Obviously sorceresses don't live forever. But the R=U theory accepts the idea that sorceresses age differently than humans but don't necessarily live forever. It clutches at straws a bit because their only evidence is that Edea, Rinoa and Ultimecia look young for their age. Especially if you compare Cid to Edea. Assuming that their supposed to be more or less the same age, Cid does look a lot older.

If sorceresses age differently, then, as I said, any successor she picked would be dead before Adel could hand her powers over.

[rubah]

A problemw ith the R=U theory.

It's not true. That's a pretty big problem right there.

[Skyblade]

A problemw ith the R=U theory.

It's not true. That's a pretty big problem right there.

??? What on Earth are you talking about, rubah?! There were no typos in the thread title...

[Levian]

Rubah is just saying that she doesn't believe the whole R=U theory.

[boys from the dwarf]

the R-U theory is unproven and false.SHUT UP DAMMIT ABOUT SMEGGIN R-U THEORY. IT IS UNTRUE.i agree with rubah.

[Sir Bahamut]

Yes, it is a problem, and it isn't the only one either. The bottomline is that it isn't all too likely that sorceresses age slower than normal people, but there's one thing that could contest against this particular argument:

Perhaps Adel was in fact possessed by Ultimecia. After all, it seems like a rather odd coincedence that both Ultimecia and Adel were searching for Ellone. Ultimecia used Edea for her search, so is it not possible she also used Adel? I mean, look at how Ellone is treated; looked up in some research facility without any care at all. Hardly the kind of care you'd expect given to someone who's supposed to take over after you're dead, no?

One thing which could explain the odd coincidence is that Ellone just happened to be the only potential sorceress they could find, but that seems a little bit odd. Perhaps she was searching for Ellone because she was possessed by Ultimecia, and she had Ellone put in a research facility to try and awaken Ellones dorman powers(she was very young, so she might not have learnt of her powers yet).

This is naturally pure speculation, so it doesn't show anything conlusively, but it's interesting to think about anyway.

[Christmas]

Perhaps Adel was in fact possessed by Ultimecia. After all, it seems like a rather odd coincedence that both Ultimecia and Adel were searching for Ellone.

I dun think Adel is possessed by anyone when she first started her search for Ellone since if I remember correctly they are looking for little girls and not a specific girl.

Ultimecia used Edea for her search, so is it not possible she also used Adel? I mean, look at how Ellone is treated; looked up in some research facility without any care at all. Hardly the kind of care you'd expect given to someone who's supposed to take over after you're dead, no?

Adel became more interested in Ellone's ability than the succession thing when Odine researched her when she is a kid. That is why she is so anxious when Laguna told her Ellone is in the sorceress memorial and she just barged it.

[Squall of SeeD]

Yes, it is a problem, and it isn't the only one either. The bottomline is that it isn't all too likely that sorceresses age slower than normal people, but there's one thing that could contest against this particular argument:

Perhaps Adel was in fact possessed by Ultimecia. After all, it seems like a rather odd coincedence that both Ultimecia and Adel were searching for Ellone. Ultimecia used Edea for her search, so is it not possible she also used Adel? I mean, look at how Ellone is treated; looked up in some research facility without any care at all. Hardly the kind of care you'd expect given to someone who's supposed to take over after you're dead, no?

One thing which could explain the odd coincidence is that Ellone just happened to be the only potential sorceress they could find, but that seems a little bit odd. Perhaps she was searching for Ellone because she was possessed by Ultimecia, and she had Ellone put in a research facility to try and awaken Ellones dorman powers(she was very young, so she might not have learnt of her powers yet).

This is naturally pure speculation, so it doesn't show anything conlusively, but it's interesting to think about anyway.

I think this was most likely the case. I'll have to edit my own theory on this (the one in your document at GameFAQs) now.

Anyway, we don't really have anything much to go on for this theory. Saying that Edea looks younger than Cid -- as was said earlier in this Thread -- isn't necessarily true. Comparing Edea to Quistis, Selphie, or Rinoa, she's obviously got a good 15 years on them in age, and 10 at the least. Cid doesn't look all that old himself. I would assume he and Edea to be in their thirties, which both of them appear to be.


I really hope the Ultimania has some kind of conclusive information.

[Future Esthar]

Oh,so you are saying that:
1-Adel was interested in Ellone for being her successor.
2-Odine researched her powers and discovered her ability.
3-Odine created Junction Machine Ellone.
4-It reached Ulti and she used it to take over the world.
5-She then possessed Edea first.

So Adel is not possessed isn´t it?

Well for those who believe in time loops it would not be difficult to see that Adel could have been possessed by Ulti.I always thought it was implied in the game.

[Christmas]

Oh ya, some of your riddles again and the pot calling the kettle black. Very well, kindly pls explain.

[Mo-Nercy]

the R-U theory is unproven and false.SHUT UP DAMMIT ABOUT SMEGGIN R-U THEORY. IT IS UNTRUE.i agree with rubah.

No one in this thread said anything about believing R=U. You get worked up rather easily don't you?

Well for those who believe in time loops it would not be difficult to see that Adel could have been possessed by Ulti.I always thought it was implied in the game.

Edea tells you tha Ulti can only possess sorceresses of the present in order to compress time. And the only sorceresses available to her, as explained by Edea, were herself, Rinoa and Adel. Ulti chooses Adel (after Edea turned out to be failure, I guess) but needed Adel released from her space prison. Therefore, she possessed Rinoa temporarily so that Adel could be released. Ulti knew the Lunar Cry would occur and timed it perfectly so that Adel would come flying down to earth. Seifer, who must've found out at some point while he was serving Edea that he was really serving Ultimecia, catches Adel with the Lunatic Pandora. Ulti combined with Adel and started Time Compression then.

[ThroneofDravaris]

Yes, I too see the shortcomings in believing that Sorceresses age differently. Basically, the main reason people seem to believe this is because Edea looks much younger than cid. Let me point a few things out:

1. In many Japanese games/anime, the female characters appear youthful and pretty, despite their age (Bulma in Dragon ball Z is proof enough of this). Male characters are not usually given this luxury, thus it possible for 2 people approximately the same age to look years apart.
2. As can be seen from the similarities in the character designs of the female FF8 characters in the FMV’s, the same basic body seems to have been used for all of them, with minor alterations. They probably couldn’t be bothered changing her appearance enough to make her look any older than the other characters.
3. In Japan, it is seen as more acceptable for an older man to marry a younger woman, so it’s entirely possible that the age difference was always there, and not caused by slow aging.
4. Cid looks like Robin Williams. Not sure what that proves, just thought I would through it in there…

As you can see, there are major flaws in believing that Edea has aged differently to anyone else, thus there is no basis to the idea that Sorceresses live forever.

One last thing though…

Laguna: … Ultimecia lives far in the future where none of us
can technically exist.

Direct quote from the game. Don’t you think it’s a little odd do believe in a theory that is DIRECTLY refuted by the game itself? Just a thought…

[beaglegod]

Now Im not trying to argue with any of you FF VIII vets, Ive just finished the game today for the first time (hooray for me ) so Im kinda trying to put the whole thing together.

I understood things to work this way:

1. Odines machine based on Elone becomes very powerful in the future enabling Ultimecia to travel back in time, so she comes up with the whole time compression theory and figures "what the heck Ill give it a shot"

2.Ultimecia isnt able to go back far enough to compress time from the begining but she gets fortunate enough to get dropped off in Elones time (or she purposely does so after finding her abilities in time travel are still limited). Hence she starts a search for this girl the machines based on in order to use her to go further back.

3.Ultimecia posseses Adel (whos not such a nice person to begin with) to accomplish this but after Laguna and friends put Adel out of commision, Ultimecia jumps to Edea, but SeeD having defeated Edea many times causes her to go with Rinoa.Smart choice because of the relationship she has with Squall and the rest of the gang perhaps thinking that relationship will serve to protect Rinoa as she uses her.


Is any of this right?