Which of these theories fit better the storyline?

[CaladBolgLionHeart]

I go on a trip to Orlando for 3 days, 3 DAYS, and I come back and Future Esthar's made ANOTHER wacky theory topic? *CLAPS* Ladies and Gentleman, the hardest-working person on the board.

[Future Esthar]

No not particularly. Theyre famous so theres often a portrait sometime in there life time but theres no reason to see that painting as Ultimecias portrait. No reason at all.

Don´t you think you are contradict yourself?
If she is the queen of the castle,if the paint is the paint of a queen ,if there is often a portrait sometime on their lifetime,ONLY one portrait seen in only one place of the castle we conclude it was Ulti´s portrait.We don´t even need physical similarities.

Or do you think she bought the picture of the queen of another castle for entertainment?I don´t.
You see I can even say that I proofed Ulti was Julia.
The accuracy of this theory is no little than that of LRS(and I am a proponent of it).

[Sir Bahamut]

Ugh, I know I shouldn't be doing this but anyway:

Future, even if we assume the portrait is of Ultimecia, so what? Are we to assume that any two characters who has the same colour clothes and hair are in fact the same people? Because by that logic, as Destai pointed out, that makes Rinoa = Zone.

[Destai]

No not particularly. Theyre famous so theres often a portrait sometime in there life time but theres no reason to see that painting as Ultimecias portrait. No reason at all.

Don´t you think you are contradict yourself?
If she is the queen of the castle,if the paint is the paint of a queen ,if there is often a portrait sometime on their lifetime,ONLY one portrait seen in only one place of the castle we conclude it was Ulti´s portrait.We don´t even need physical similarities.

Or do you think she bought the picture of the queen of another castle for entertainment?I don´t.
You see I can even say that I proofed Ulti was Julia.
The accuracy of this theory is no little than that of LRS(and I am a proponent of it).

I havent contradicted myself. I was giving an estimate. But if you want facts fine. No I dont think a queen is obliged to have a portrait of herself in her castle. Dont need physical similarities? Ok interesting so if this picture was in place of the woman in red *attatches* would that be Ultimecia? Dont bother answering. Everyone knows the answer including you. You just dont want to admit it. Bought the picture? I cant imagine Ultimecia walking around browsing for her castles deco. Its a video game :rolleyes2 And who said it was a queen in the first place? (Again the attatched picture) Once again your ignoring logic for the sake of your theories. Its a video game and unlike your theory it has been proven that you're using detail that was not put into the game in a terrible attempt to prove your theories possible. L+R=S is much more than your theories because the game suggests them.

[Future Esthar]

Didn´t you read?
There were ONLY TWO important characters on the game that reads dress.And everything about them is similar,not just some things.
Isn´t it a coincidence that there were MANY similarities between them?

That´s a bad comparision.Rinoa is in no way similar to Zone.There were many differences.This is not the case with Julia and Ulti(portrayed by the picture).

[Destai]

Didn´t you read?
There were ONLY TWO important characters on the game that reads dress.And everything about them is similar,not just some things.
Isn´t it a coincidence that there were MANY similarities between them?

That´s a bad comparision.Rinoa is in no way similar to Zone.There were many differences.This is not the case with Julia and Ulti(portrayed by the picture).

Once again you only responded to the argument you thought you could argue against. No proof that the woman in the portrait was Ultimecia. Theres no proof at all. Where does the game state that the red dressed lady is Ultimecia Future Esthar. I dont want to hear your warped logic. I want to hear where the game states it. Many similarities? LOL. Julia has a red dress and black hair. Ultimecia has a dress which has bits of red on it and white hair which you've decided was originally black. So far it seems more likely that Rinoa is Zone from the future. No proof that the woamn in the portrait was Ultimecia yet either. Im waiting.... :/

[Future Esthar]

What? Is that not a portrait of a queen?
What it is then?
A portrait of a woman in a mask feast?
A portrait of a woman while she stoles the crown?
Oh my God. :rolleyes2

You don´t even need to see the physical similarities between Ulti and the picture.

We just need to look at the Xerampelinae picture,to realize it was a picture of a queen and then think a little.

And the woman at the picture looks more like Julia than Rinoa like Zone.

I know this is a video game.That´s why I believe your evidences at LRS were as valid as mines.Being a video game also made your evidences on LRS loose accuracy.Not only mines on Julia=Ulti.

[Skyblade]

...ROFL. Esthar, where would we get our comedy without you? Julia=Ultimecia?! You think the two characters have lots in common?! Like what? Ultimecia's dress never struck me as being particularly red. Sure, it had red bits, but a red dress? No. Also, on the picture thing, how do you know that the picture isn't simply the FFVIII equivalent of the Mona Lisa? She has an entire art gallery. Are you saying that the picture for The Messenger or Judgement is her as well? Maybe she's just a collector. It certainly makes more sense. Also, do we actually see Ultimecia playing the organ? I don't remember that (although I don't deny that it's possible). Squall plays an organ in order to get a Rosetta Stone, but we never see Ulti playing one. Why not argue that Julia is Shuyin? He played an organ too.

[Destai]

What? Is that not a portrait of a queen?
What it is then?
A portrait of a woman in a mask feast?
A portrait of a woman while she stoles the crown?
Oh my God. :rolleyes2

What? No nevermind. Its as sensible as anything else you post.

You don´t even need to see the physical similarities between Ulti and the picture.

Yeah because its not her :rolleyes2 YAY CLAP HANDIES

We just need to look at the Xerampelinae picture,to realize it was a picture of a queen and then think a little.

What?

And the woman at the picture looks more like Julia than Rinoa like Zone.

Thats lovely and that connects to Ultimecia how? Oh because the pictures in her castle? So what? Theres lots of pictures in castles. If I hang a picture of you in my house am I you? Nope. The same applies to Ultimecia and the Julia look alike portrait. Particularly when the pictures in an art gallery.

I

know this is a video game.That´s why I believe your evidences at LRS were as valid as mines.Being a video game also made your evidences on LRS loose accuracy.Not only mines on Julia=Ulti.

Wow, I honestly believed you could only miss the BLARINGLY OBVIOUS so many times but unlike R=J the R+L=S theory is suggested with solid evidence. Your theory has no solid evidence. Just a perception of a picture and absaloutely no evidence to suggest a connection to Ultimecia.

[Future Esthar]

Oh my God.
You say that I don´t make sence but you are the ones that makes comparisions outside the game.I always compare people from the game with people on the same game.That´s what makes most sence.Isn´t it Skyblade(I were talking to you)?
I don´t even know who this Shuyin is.
More,I said many times I have compared IMPORTANT persons with IMPORTANT persons.
That´s the phylosophy of SQUARE here.

Destai,I see that script and events are more believable to you than graphical details.
I just wonder why is it that Square improved the graphics to made them realist and turned the blue beautiful dialog box of FF7 into the grey dialog box of FF8.

[Skyblade]

Oh my God.
You say that I don´t make sence but you are the ones that makes comparisions outside the game.I always compare people from the game with people on the same game.That´s what makes most sence.Isn´t it Skyblade(I were talking to you)?
I don´t even know who this Shuyin is.
More,I said many times I have compared IMPORTANT persons with IMPORTANT persons.
That´s the phylosophy of SQUARE here.

Destai,I see that script and events are more believable to you than graphical details.
I just wonder why is it that Square improved the graphics to made them realist and turned the blue beautiful dialog box of FF7 into the grey dialog box of FF8.

Actually, that's YOUR philosophy. The interesting idea is that, even bringing in the villain from FFX-2, my theory has just as much evidence backing it as yours does (ie: NONE).

[Destai]

Destai,I see that script and events are more believable to you than graphical details.

Of course. Thats more logical. I remember you arguing that the Delling parade in disc 1 was not televised because you couldnt see any video cameras in the background despite it being stated that there were video cameras there by some character.

I just wonder why is it that Square improved the graphics to made them realist and turned the blue beautiful dialog box of FF7 into the grey dialog box of FF8.

Because they could. Graphics constantly improve. So the script isnt as important as the graphics because its got a grey background? Interesting

Still no proof that the painting is Ultimecia. Not even anything to suggest it besides observing that art gallerys have paintings in them.

[bipper]

Ok - it has been while since I have gotten that far but let me gather what is going on here.

The thoery basically states that Ulti could be Juliea?
Evidence includes:
1: Paining of a woman in red (With square this would be good evi IMO)
2: The link is that the paining is of the queen of the castle, who would be ulti?
3: The pino of course

Evidnece Against:
1: Wasn't she killed?

Okay I am having trouble finding the evidence against - too many attepts to kill the evidnce for the theory. /shrug

Bottom line is: Yes, the lady in the painting are interpetations or possible clues - thus the word "theory" I for one do see a corralation here. Would it be too much for me to ask for a picture of the pianno and painting to be posted, just to see how obscured it is?

Also if I can add one thing: I hear that the word sorceress was used in place of the japenese word for "Witch" Which is a female wizzard in leage with the devil right?
from dictionary.com -

2: a being (usually female) imagined to have special powers derived from the devil

Well - if juliea was killed, prehapse she made a Dracula like pact with the devil and in the end became ulti? Who knows - just an idea though. But the sorceresses do share several similaraties with traditional Vampires.

Square is also trendy at this point in thier history. Playing of the gothic tones of the time prehaps?

Oh well just some thoughts. I guess I hope i remembered everything clearly. hrm.

Bipper GOES
out to buy the game for his pc

[Future Esthar]

So the script isnt as important as the graphics because its got a grey background? Interesting

I was exagerating a little.The first part of the phrase is what really matters.The graphics had improved.End point.
Square improved the graphics so much that the game looks like the "Where is Waldo" games or the "Find the seven differences " games.I mean the graphics not only were realistic but they help us see things in detail.This didn´t happened at FF7.
For example,on FF VII you never find an iterative journal or panflet in which the screen changes to it´s scale of vision when you press the action key.
In FF8 there is the pictures.The screen changes to the scale of vision of the pictures when you press the action key.
Now the question is:
If one just need the words to complete the mini-game why bother to show the pictures themselves?Why don´t you just see the words when you press the action key?
Because you are supposed to see hidden things on the storyline through these pictures.

Of course. Thats more logical. I remember you arguing that the Delling parade in disc 1 was not televised because you couldnt see any video cameras in the background despite it being stated that there were video cameras there by some character.

Are you talking about a woman that appears on Balamb asking you if you wanna help her taking FOTOGRAPHS of the parade?

[Squall of SeeD]

Would it be too much for me to ask for a picture of the pianno and painting to be posted, just to see how obscured it is?

Here's the painting:

Linkage.

Also if I can add one thing: I hear that the word sorceress was used in place of the japenese word for "Witch" Which is a female wizzard in leage with the devil right?

As far as many contemporary and Christian-derived definitions go, yes. However, the word is actually equivalent to that of "Sorceress," "Seer," "Sage," or any other such title.

Well - if juliea was killed, prehapse she made a Dracula like pact with the devil and in the end became ulti? Who knows - just an idea though.

The game not only in no way suggests this, but in the context of Final Fantasy VIII, Witches obviously have nothing whatsoever to do with the Devil. Using "Witch" in this context is like using "Clone" in the context of a genetic duplicate in Final Fantasy VII. It just doesn't work.

Witches are those with Hyne's power.

But the sorceresses do share several similaraties with traditional Vampires.

Such as?