Retirement funding

[Raistlin]

It's disgusting if you think that it's fair to abandon people just because it's too much hassle to take care of them.
Besides, collapse of the Social Security sytem, and the eventual collapse of societey, is an inevitable result of western capitalism. Ho hum.

Collapse of social security as it is now? Yeah, probably - good thing, too. Collapse of society? What the hell does that even mean?

And I don't think the government should be responsible for providing for "the free development of personality." It seems to me that people should develop their own personality in their own way, but that's just me.

[Cloud No.9]

yes being an under 18 scot i am entitled to free university education, dental care and eye care. next month my dental and eye care will just be subsidised.

it's not government figures that i quoted on unemployment rates. long term sick (over 12 months) do count on unemployment lists. as do disabled. the disabled are able to work. there's been a great push for that recently.

as to the article raistlin quotes. it grants a freedom. it makes the government responsible for the freddom not for the personality.

[Madame Adequate]

yes being an under 18 scot i am entitled to free university education, dental care and eye care. next month my dental and eye care will just be subsidised.

Big whoop about uni. How many under-18s even go? Although I don't have any particular objection to those obviously smart enough to get in early getting a break, to be honest.

[Cloud No.9]

i'm not granted free education because i'm under 18. it's because i'm scottish.

[Madame Adequate]

i'm not granted free education because i'm under 18. it's because i'm scottish.

So all Scots get free uni education?

[Mr. Mojo Risin]

Regardless, once the gov't starts providing every benefit, they can just as easily take them away.

[Cloud No.9]

if they get the grades then yes. we have to pay a graduation fee at the end of it. but that's all. no tuition fees.

[Madame Adequate]

if they get the grades then yes. we have to pay a graduation fee at the end of it. but that's all. no tuition fees.

Right, well, at least in Scotland (If I can infer a fairly accurate image solely from what you're saying.) it seems that help goes to those who deserve help (Ie the intelligent get aid for uni.), which isn't ideal but it is at least tolerable, and a damn sight better than some places.

[Cloud No.9]

are only the intelligent deserving of help?

[Madame Adequate]

are only the intelligent deserving of help?

No; the able are deserving of more than the unable. A free market lets this happen naturally and allows the unable to find other ventuers where they will be succesful.

[Cloud No.9]

the able are more desrving than the unable? i do hope we are not talking about the disabled here. and even if we aren't you are on very very shaky ground. are the intelligent more desrving than the unintelligent? the strong more deserving than the weak?

there was one political party that had those ideas.

[DarkLadyNyara]

are the intelligent more desrving than the unintelligent?

Meh, it's more of a "better able to utilize" thing. And grades are not based just on intellegence.

[Cloud No.9]

better able to utilize what? or is it "to be utilized"?

and grades are weighed hugely on intelligence. yes there is effort. but some people are just not capable. have talents else where.

[DarkLadyNyara]

and grades are weighed hugely on intelligence. yes there is effort. but some people are just not capable. have talents else where.

And some people are lazy as all hell. BTW, if someone is not capable of learning, then there is no real point in sending them to college. If they have other talents, then cultivate those talents. Higher education aint for everyone.

[War Angel]

and grades are weighed hugely on intelligence.

I'm fairly intelligent, and I didn't do well in school. Others, that weren't as intelligent as I, but had a much better sit-down-on-your-arse-and-study capablity did far better. Just a side-note, really.