Thats why Cloud is in a like semi-conscious state, while him and Zack are fleeing to Midgar, because hes still adapting to the Jenova Cells and Mako in his body.
Thats why Cloud is in a like semi-conscious state, while him and Zack are fleeing to Midgar, because hes still adapting to the Jenova Cells and Mako in his body.
Funny how FFVII is the most confusing game made, yet the only Final Fantasy I beat...
haha...no.Originally Posted by Chaos Prophecy.Crash..
ff8 is more confusing
coughTimeCompressioncough
here's what i dont get.....how did Sephiroth take jenova from the shinra biulding if he was(SPOILER)frozen in the ice near the crater where the weapons are?
Kaycee says (12:06 AM):
whos' obama?
so really jenova (SPOILER)killed aerith? but the last sephiroth you fight is the real sephiroth and not jenova, right? or did sephy die in niblehiem and somehow get frozen up near the glaciers?
You are correct. Jenova took Sephy's form because Cloud feared him the most.
Kaycee says (12:06 AM):
whos' obama?
God I feel temtped to whip out a certain smilie. But seriously. Your not funny.
Cloud was infused with mako though, as I remember. Aeries says somthing about him having the mako shine in his eyes.\
Bipper
Just to clarify, the word clone used in FFVII is just a way of saying someone was infused with Jenova cells, and not an actual 'clone'. And about Mako preventing jenova cells' side effects... I'm not sure. I think it doesn't really apply seeing as how many members of SOLDIER turned into monters (like the one in the FMV when Seph and cloud are in Neibelheim Reactor). I might be wrong though, and if I am please clarify. (I think we need the help of SOS)
Nandattebayo!!!
This thread is in need of numerous clarifications.
JENOVA arrived on Gaia roughly 2000 years before the events of FFVII. The entity is very similar to a virus, although it's difficult to pin specific definitions to the being.
After infecting (and thus dooming) the vast majority of the Cetra, both those at the Knowlespole and elsewhere, it was "contained" and "sealed" by the Cetra.
From Film 1: The Original Crisis
And from Film 2: What is Weapon?Ifalna: I'm all right... When the Cetra... were preparing to part with the
land they loved... That's when it appeared! It looked like... our... our dead
mothers... and our dead brothers. Showing us spectres of their past.
Gast: Who is the person that appeared at the North Cave? I haven't any idea.
Ifalna: That's when the one who injured the Planet... or the 'crisis from the
sky', as we call him, came. He first approached as a friend, deceived them,
and finally...... gave them the virus. The Cetra were attacked by the virus
and went mad... transforming into monsters. Then, just as he had at the
Knowlespole. He approached other Cetra clans...... infecting them with... the
virus...
After being confined, JENOVA was discovered two millenia later by Professor Gast, who believed it was an Ancient. This led to the Jenova project, and Sephiroth's injection with JENOVA cells while still in the womb. Eventually, during the mission to Mibelheim, Sephiroth becomes partially aware of his origins. He had previously been told that his mother was "Jenova" (although why Lucrecia was never mentioned to him goes unsaid), and the literature in the mansion basement convinces him that JENOVA was a Cetra, and that he and JENOVA are the rightful heirs to the Planet. At this, he proceeds to slaughter most of Nibelheim's residents, and heads to the reactor on Mt. Nibel to retrieve JENOVA itself.Gast: Back then, Weapon was a weapon the Planet produced of its own will?"
Ifalna: Yes, but... There is no record of Weapon ever being used. A small
number of the surviving Cetra defeated Jenova, and confined it. The Planet
produced Weapon... But it was no longer necessary to use it.
Gast: So, Weapon no longer exists on the Planet?
Ifalna: Weapon cannot vanish. ...It remains asleep somewhere on the Planet.
Even though Jenova is confined, it could come back to life at some time... The
Planet has not fully healed itself yet. It is still watching Jenova.
The being contained behind the Mechanical Angel (as previously noted, this apparatus is not actually JENOVA), then, is the same JENOVA that plagued the Cetra 2000 years before. However, Cloud wounds Sephiroth (I won't go into the details of what was actually going on during the disaster, although Zack and Tifa had already been wounded at this point). While Cloud runs back to Tifa, the injured Sephiroth manages to obtain JENOVA's head and staggers out. Cloud confronts Sephiroth and is stabbed, but somehow manages to throw Sephiroth and his sword into the depths of the reactor. Sephiroth still has the head of JENOVA, which travels with him through the Lifestream; they eventually come to rest in the far north of the world, as seen in the game.
When Cloud and company enter the Shinra building, they come across the body of JENOVA, which was at some point taken from the reactor and moved to Hojo's lab. Its head is still missing, though, since Sephiroth had it. The fact that JENOVA is missing its head is made very clear.
On Floor 67...
An interruption in the Kalm flashback...Cloud: It's moving... ...still alive?
Barret: Where's its #%$*#&$ head? This whole thing's stupid. Let's keep goin'.
In short, then, the JENOVA that was temporarily located in the Mt. Nibel reactor is the same JENOVA that assaulted the Ancients, and the same JENOVA that the party encountered while in the Shinra building.Barret: Yo wait a minute!! Isn't that, um...? The name of Sephiroth's mother...
I remember Jenova. That's that damn headless spook livin' in the Shinra
building.
Cloud: That's right.
As to the matter of the "Sephiroth" chased throughout the first half of the game by the party, these forms were derivative of the JENOVA that had previously been housed in the Shinra building. However, as Sephiroth and JENOVA are in many ways indistinguishable, the "Sephiroth" that killed Aeris was in fact carrying out the will of Sephiroth. JENOVA, after all, would have had no reason to attempt to force Cloud to kill Aeris, yet Sephiroth (bound up in human emotions despite the influence of JENOVA) would have wanted to see his enemy suffer.
This is, I'm afraid to say, completely wrong. The CLONES (the figures garbed in black, the JENOVA cell-injected survivors of the Nibelheim disaster) only first appear in Nibelheim; they would not have been aboard the cargo ship, where Jenova∙BIRTH was fought. Moreover, while the CLONES are apparent at certain sites (the Temple of the Ancients, the Whirlwind Maze), they do not appear at the Water Altar. Rather, a small object (a part of JENOVA, most likely) descends, and the battle with Jenova∙LIFE commences. Even Jenova∙DEATH does not appear on the same screen with the CLONES; rather, as in the previous two cases, only Sephiroth himself (his form derivative of JENOVA) is present.
Beyond this, there's nothing to indicate that any of the CLONES were "less important" or "above average." All of the CLONES exhibit no will of their own; they can only mumble something to the effect of "Sephiroth" or "Reunion." Thus, such a distinction is wholly ineffective.
Jenova∙SYNTHESIS (there is no Jenova∙ABSOLUTE; Jenova Absolute is merely the name of the piece of music that plays during the SYNTHESIS fight) is likely derivative of the head of JENOVA, as opposed to the body. The BIRTH-, LIFE-, and DEATH-forms all have basically the same appearance (and appear as a vaguely "body" form); Jenova∙SYNTHESIS looks completely different, and almost seems to have a "head form." Furthermore, one must remember that Sephiroth (encountered immediately thereafter) had the head of JENOVA with him when he came to rest in the north; as a result, this particular form of JENOVA would have been derived from the head (contrary to the previous battles). However, this form also involves the CLONES; their cells would have been assimilated, as JENOVA's cells remain alive even when separated, and seek to reunite.
Cloud wasn't a failed Sephiroth Clone, actually. He is only told this by Sephiroth in order to further confuse him (and Sephiroth certainly succeeds in this). Convinced by Sephiroth that he was entirely built from JENOVA cells, he believes this to be the case and begs Hojo for a number. Hojo, informed by Cloud's twisted testimony, assumes that Cloud really is a failed Clone.
The point, then, about Cloud doesn't work. Zack, for his part, shouldn't even be mentioned; all members of SOLDIER were Sephiroth Clones, as Clones are simply people who have been given JENOVA cell therapy.
Mako has nothing to do with Cloud's reaction to JENOVA cells, and Zack's lack of a reaction. Zack, a member of SOLDIER, would obviously have already exhibited a tolerance for JENOVA therapy. He simply wouldn't have reacted to JENOVA cells; it's a part of his identity. Cloud, however, was susceptible. Perhaps as a result of his own lack of confidence, or perhaps as a simple aspect of biology, the cells had a far greater effect on our protagonist. Cloud may have, actually, received some small amount of JENOVA treatment, and been rejected from SOLDIER because of exhibited weakness. It's irrelevant, though; Cloud received Mako infusion during Hojo's experiments, so Mako cannot be used as a reason for resistance to the cells. Escapee Report 2 suggests as much.
Cloud and Zack were given JENOVA cells and infused with Mako; neither affected Zack, the cells affected Cloud.Escapee report no. 2
Description at the time of capture.
A - Former member of SOLDIER/Number ( )
No effect could be detected from either Mako Radiation Therapy or Jenova on him
B - Regular/Number ( )
Reaction to Jenova detected.
Moreover, one can look to the glow in Cloud's eyes; indicative of Mako infusion.
When Reno arrives at the church in the slums...
After Cloud and Aeris escape...Reno: They were...... Mako eyes.
As a result, one can understand that Mako had nothing to do with Zack's resistance to JENOVA cells, or Cloud's lack thereof.Aeris: ...Your eyes. They have a strange glow...
Cloud: That's the sign of those who have been infused with Mako... A mark of
SOLDIER. But, how did you know about that?
Aeris: ......Oh, nothing.
Cloud: Nothing...?
Also, for reference, Mako is not "pure life stream energy." The pure stuff of the Lifestream is Spirit Energy; Mako is condensed, refined Spirit Energy.
Mako infusion, by itself, results in a kind of phyiscal enhancement. However, in the extreme concentrations that the individuals in the pods received, it appears that it has mutagenic effects.
In short, it wasn't the fact that they were infused with Mako that caused the transformations, but the degree of Mako to which they were exposed.Cloud: Wh... what is this!?
Sephiroth: Normal members of SOLDIER are humans that have been showered with
Mako. You're different from the others, but still human. But, what are they?
They've been exposed to a high degree of Mako, far more than you.
Cloud: ...is this some kind of monster?
Sephiroth: Exactly. And it's Hojo of Shinra that produced these monsters.
Mutated living organisms produced by Mako energy. That's what these monster's
really are.
i agree.
(too lazy to read it all but i trust masamune for he is an gaming god. and i don't know if that's a compliment or a put-down, but take it as a compliment.)
Thank you Hysterian!
I read it all, hes right in what he says, it all makes sense.
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
